3.5t horsebox/van conversion - your experiences?!

[Arkmiido]

Hi, desperately want some advice before I go shopping or have a conversion done!
I'm looking at 3.5t boxes and wondering what experiences other people are having with them? I have a 16.1 neurotic rhinelander who would like maximum headroom plus a 16.2 shire x tb (weight 620kg) as well, although my other horses are smaller (15.1 warmblood, 15.3 ISH, shetlands...)
So, I need it stalled for 2 horses, with a big as possible payload - 1200kg upwards ideally. Perhaps I'm expecting the impossible in transporting 2 16h+ horses - but lots are advertised as such, yet won't state/don't know their payload..

I'm selling the beloved 7.5t lorry as can't get my license due to heart problems in past, and now have no chauffeur as (older) husband is now ex. Trailer &4x4 not really an option for my horses, plus cost of running a 4x4 with large enough towing capacity on my commute not ideal etc. My budget is about 5k - 8k at a push, which doesn't get me much!

Any thoughts on different chassis - Renault Master (Mk 1 vs 2). or the Vauxhall Movano? Fiats? Fords? Mercedes? Do the payloads work out differently? any experiences with Leyland DAF 3.5t, VWs, Isuzu etc.. I don't think I want a transit-with-a-sheep-trailer-stuck-on type though!

Van conversion vs coachbuilt? (cost is a given, but weights, headroom, safety aspect/structure..)
Ramps and top opening - do people (and their horses!) prefer the barn door style to the flip up type? Fixed wall or removable breast bars? How much headroom do these have? traveling backwards vs forwards..

Any recommendations of firms that do these conversions? There is a Steve in Staffordshire (www.horsedeals.co.uk) who offers a 51/02 Renault Master basic converted van for £5k, giving me my 1300kg+ payload - anyone heard of him or used him?? Various other firms in the midlands who offer custom van conversions, but they start to go over my budget, even on an older chassis. and I'm in Kent!

Basically I'd really like to hear anyone's experiences of owning, running and using 3.5t boxes of any type /age etc, and any ideas or suggestions... Sorry for the long post!

 

[BigRed]

You hit the nail on the head with the payload issue. The simple fact is, many of these 3.5 ton lorries could not take the weight you want to carry, so you need to be very careful to insist on a weight certificate before you hand over any money. I wanted a 3.5 ton lorry because after my back op I did not want to hitch up the trailer, but I only want to move one horse, so for me the weight was not such an issue. In the end I bought another trailer with lighter ramps.

I don't understand why you have a problem with a non HGV 7.5 ton driving license, this is a car license, the same thing you need to drive a 3.5 ton lorry ?

 

[OWLIE185]

Don't bother you will be well overweight with 2 horses in a 3.5 Ton.

 

[ginadrummond]

Hi I have a Renault Mark 1 called Mavis. Brought from travel two.

Experiences:

1. Very reliable, even my garage is impressed - started after 3 months at -7.
2. Very easy to drive except that my very tall horse travelling on one side felt very unstable (regardless of what they say). I ended up having another partition built so that I could travel him centrally - what a difference.
3. I wouldn't travel my 3 year old in it cos it has a solid breast partition and i was worried that she could come over - i think they make them safer now.

Basically it is so much easier. I've always been a trailer fan but would never go back. My advice is look for a safe one and if you can afford it upgrade to 3 litres. Poor Mavis is a little slow.

Hope this helps

 

[schneeko]

Sorry to add my own question but:

I've got a 15.3 tb and 13.2 newforest, would a 3.5 tonne be ok for that?

 

[katemiddleton]

My mare is a funny wotsit with a lot of things - travelling being one! But have had absolutely no issues with my little lorry - had it a year now and wouldn't go back! (It's a renault master conversion. My mare loves it - even drove to Truro for a few days last hunting season (from near Cheltenham) and she was absolutely fine (going from panic attacks almost immediately after loading prior to finding this!)

They are reliable - however some designs can be a pain to fix if they do go wrong (mine included) as to get to the main bulk of the engine you go through the cab which can increase labour costs if having to replace starter motor or something as quite fiddly, just something to consider (unless you have a tame mechanic!).

Make sure you get one so that, if they do try to go over the breastbar you can drop it down or get the horse out the back as you don't want them stuck in that little space, but most companies are onto this now.

Easy to drive, cheap to run, find it much more stable than a taller/larger lorry, only other downside to consider is the ramp - because of the deisgn (i.e. lower to floor) you can't get the big springs on the side so my ramp is quite heavy to lift, no worry for me but if I get a bad back it will be!!

 

[Arkmiido]

I passed my driving test after 1997 - so I'm limited to 3.5t plus 750kg trailer (unless I also do my towing test which could get round the weight issue if I travel one in the trailer!)
Was going to do my class 2 but I failed the medical due to previous heart problems (although I'm fine now...grr) which is the same as the C1 / 7.5t medical requirements, so I have no other options really!

 

[Orv]

I don't understand why you have a problem with a non HGV 7.5 ton driving license, this is a car license, the same thing you need to drive a 3.5 ton lorry ?

From my understanding OP can't drive her non HGV lorry as her ex husband was driving it and if you need to pass a medical to take your LGV/HGV license which she can't pass so can only drive upto 3.5t if she passed her driving test after 1997 (i think that's the right year)

I'm currently 3.5t lorry hunting from my research (and others have said) you won't legally be able to transport 2 decent sized horses.

I found a company Worcestershire way which convert high top vans and claim you can carry large horses, the payload was good as it didn't have many flashy extras to add to the weight.

I've driven a Movano conversion and my 17hh WB travelled comfortably and the van was a nice drive

 

[OWLIE185]

You can travel large horses in them but with 2 horses you will go over weight.
It is easy to check out..
Weigh the prospective 3.5 ton lorry on the weighbridge with yourself and your 2 horses in it.
That will tell you exactly what it weights but remember that anything else you put in it will add weight.

 

[Splish & Masons mum]

I considered a 3.5 tn lorry before I took my trailer test, but after all was considered I decided that with 2 15h middleweight cobs, a full tank of fuel, water, hay, tack, yourself and any passengers, we'd be well over the weight allowance on even the lightest lorry.
The only way to make sure is to load up and go to a weighbridge, but beware, the penalties for traveling an overloaded vehicle are severe - a £5000 fine and up to 6 points on your license.

 

[miss_c]

I have a Bonnington horsebox and the payload is 1250kg - very high for these van conversions. Genie (15hh welsh cob) weighs 547kg (she went on a portable weighbridge last week!) and Milly (13.2hh cob x yearling) is currently a lot less. This year I can carry the two, however next summer I shall have to choose which to take, as once you add tack, fuel, yourself etc, I would be over the weight. There is NO WAY you will be able to carry your two big horses in one.

 

[Arkmiido]

Hi - thankyou for all your replies - I suspected the payload issue would be the biggest problem! Evidently the "carries 2x16.2hh" is b******* if you plan on avoiding the fine etc! Having thought carefully about it, there would be very rare occasions when my sister and I would go anywhere together (she has the shire x tb) - if we do, then I have access to a 7.5t lorry and willing driver, but only for one-off outings, whereas I and my sister need to travel own horses regularly for lessons etc, which needs to be independent - ie I'm going to gloucestershire for a week's training with my horse, and want to go alone.. Additionally if I take my towing test and also get a trailer, I believe the max train weight is 5.5t so I could drive the box (with Leo) hitched to a large trailer with Tilly in?? How much do ifor williams trailers weigh roughly?! And no, I really don't want another 4&4 - my hilux nearly bankrupted me, and I have a commute to work... Anything that could pull 2 big horses is not going to be taking me to work every day I think!
Plus I can get carriage and shettie ponies in a 3.5t box.. or tow a lightweight, unbraked trailer with carriage (90kg..) for them.
So... any comments on van conversions especially design flaws, good points, which chassis are best... would be appreciated as I think I still want to go for one, just have to accept that it won't be possible to travel two big horses in!! If anyone can recommend firms that do conversions, I'd appreciate it, as all ads for existing boxes I have seen would require me to modify them anyway... or they are out of budget.. or really old!!
"Rock" and "hard place" spring to mind...

 

[Holly Hocks]

I have a 3.5 tonne vauxhall movano van conversion called Vernon. It was converted in September last year. Not coachbuilt. I had a renault master before this (they are actually the same vehicle as the movano, just with a different badge on the front). If you are buying a van to convert, get the mileage checked out if there is no service history with it. You can do this by going to www.mot.gov.uk and putting in the reg number and either the chassis number or the registration number on the front of the V5 (log book). You can then look at all the previous MOTs and what mileage it had on at the previous MOTs. Also tells you of any advisory notices which were issued at the time of the MOTs. My first one went back to the dealer because when I got it home and did the check, I found out that it had been clocked - by a lot. On the way back to the dealers, it broke down and died on the hard shoulder - engine ******. Dealer took it back and exchanged it for the movano. After a week, the battery went flat. Got battery fired up to get it to garage to exchange it for a new one and found that the clutch had gone. Cost - £550. Broke down a few weeks ago and had some new gearbox bearings, new alternator, new cambelt, service and MOT - total cost £1050. I am now neurotic when driving it and listening to every noise coming from the engine expecting it to break down.
As for the internals, mine came with only the thin bulkhead with some wood and rubber over it, so you can hear the horse at the back of you head all the time. I took it to a steel fabricators and got some steel bars put in the horse area, so that in the event of having to stop quickly, I won't get my neck broken by the horse's ar*e coming through.
And everyone is right - you definitely won't get two horses in with any 3.5tonne van. Even if you get a weighbridge certificate, they are weighed completely empty - no spare wheel, no tack, no feed/haynets, no tack.
I know its longwinded, and it sounds like all the bad points, but after a 7.5 tonne it will feel very flimsy......I like driving mine and it is good on fuel, but in hindsight, I sort of wish I had gone for a 5.5t or 7.5t.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

I am entering this discussion, hope OK, coz am thinking the same thoughts as the person who started this thread:

What sort of fuel consumption do these 3.5 vans do? Are they economic to run? And what about insurance?

 

[jnb]

My 1999 Master does 38-40mpg on a run and around 35mpg short journeys.
Insurance £300 a year for me and OH including breakdown cover, fully comp.
Tax £200ish a year (can't remember).
MOT £55 or so at a normal testing centre - not a "Plating"

BTW: Don't get one with a knackered old engine - mine cost £2800 + £1000 labour, for a reconditioned engine and gearbox after the turbo blew up!

 

[SirenaXVI]

I have a VW LT35 called Patsy, she takes two small but only one large horse. I have travelled two horses in the past but am sure that I would be overweight. I also have day living.

I love Patsy, she is more 'substantial' than a lot of 3.5 tonners around and the worst she has ever done to me is not start cos the battery was naf.

In Patsy's previous life she was a double glazing van, we converted her about 8 years ago and she has been Absolutely Fabulous (hence her name)