7.5t Horse Boxes are dead, long live the HGV!

C

cym123

New User
Joined
6 June 2007
Messages
7
Visit site
Alright, I'm 28 and missed the automatic class 3 license by about a week so I couldn't just jump into a 7.5t and terrorise other road users. I investigated the cost of tests and found that class 2 (HGV) was actually cheaper round here than class 3! (Still £1000 though)

So I spent 4 days learning and passed first time. Then it came to buying a box. We tried out a couple of 7.5t and quite frankly they were awful. They wallowed all over the road, didn't stop particularly well and didn't pull up hill (even empty) without red lining the revs. (I had just been driving a 17t Scania remember so I knew what it was supposed to feel like)

So we went to look at a couple of HGVs and eventually bought a J reg 18t Volvo which is brilliant but I keep getting sneared at because I'm young and have the biggest box; so here's why everyone should abandon those god-awful 7.5t death traps and move onto HGVs

1) You don't have to worry about weight - My box weighs 7t empty leaving 11t for upto 5 (6, if you trust one not to open the jockey door) horses and everything else. Even with a full load of clydesdales you won't overload it. (H&H once suggested that you didn't take more fuel or water than absolutly nessecary to save weight! At least I know I can wash off my horses and get to the neaarest petrol station without fear!)

2) It stops. It has great brakes and has an exhaust brake for long descents.

3) It goes. It is designed to pull 18t and isn't half that heavy, it goes up any hill with ease even if full.

4)It's stable. The suspension is brilliant and not soft and squidgy like a 7.5t. Although ours doesn't have air suspension some at the same price did (another bonus for the horses)

5) You can take friends, we have three horses which still leaves space to be social!

6) It was half the price of an equivelant 7.5t box (something everyone overlooks when they see we have decent day living, running water etc). In fact for the money we spent (£6.5k) we could only have got avery basic 7.5tonner.

And the disadvantages:

1) If you have class 3 you save £1000 on the test. (But if you don't have class 3 like me I don't see any reason why you don't do class 2 when you take the test.) Also as I said above HGVs are cheaper (at least at the moment) because fewer people drive them so you save that money when you buy a box.

2) It's bigger (30ft to be precise) but I can get it anywhere you can get a shorter 7.5tonner and have yet to be defeated! But it is harder to find somewhere to park it.

3) Probably slightly less economical on diesel but everything else is the same.

4) You have to drive 10mph slower than a 7.5 box is allowed on most roads (but since it's more stable you don't have to slow down so much for corners and as I said before you don't have to get out and push up hill!)

5) The ramp is a bit steaper than most 7.5t as it's higher, but not significantly.

6) As it's been used professionally it has 500000km on the clock but has always been maintained regardless of cost. Many of the 7.5t may have only 20000km but have spent the rest of the time in a ditch rotting. If you look on the Scania website there is an approved used truck with over 1millon km on, it so I'm not particularly worried about this.

So there it is, rant over (sorry it's a bit long, but as you might have guessed I feel quite strongly that 7.5t lorries aren't great for transporting horses - expecially when they are not only leagally overloaded but in some cases over the maximum design weight as well)

Discuss
 
I think it depends on what 7.5t you have driven. I love mine, it stops fine and doesn't wallow over the road and is within it's weight limit. Personally I would find an HGV too big for me. Horses for courses I guess.
 
Add to your list of disadvantages the need to have a working and fully calibrated Tachograph which isn't required on many 7.5t's...but the rest I agree with.
 
I have a class 2 as well, so I do know what you mean. My instructor has a skania as well and absolutely loves it. BUT I couldn't have done what you did and bought a bigger truck, as our lane is a 7.5t limit, and that is the only problem with the big trucks I can see. I have been to same show as instructor before now and taken considerably less time to get home as she got stuck in traffic, I could go the alternative route but she couldn't because there was a 7.5t bridge on that route.
Also how much is yours to tax as a matter of interest? Also, what happens if they bring in tachos for private HGV...will you then have to do all that stuff? Genuinely interested as when we eventually upgrade I know we would get more box for our money if we go HGV.
 
well your more then welcome to try and get your lorry in our yard, concidering my 20ft lorry only just fits and yes its a 7.5 tonne and ive done my class 2, however my mum hasnt so if i get injured at a show she will drive the lorry and ponies back.
Its a bit pointless to get a HGV for 3 ponies who dont top 14hh and very often i wont take more then 2.
Also some of the lanes up here you would have fun getting a hgv down at all plus there are weight restrictions.
I know of one show i went to last year and you couldnt get a 30ft lorry through the turn into the gate, i know because i saw someone try, they had to park on the road in the end, where as my friends 26ft long lorry could just make the turn.
Not everyone wants a HGV, not everyone has the space for a HGV (i cartainly dont) and if your injured at a show then it is much much harder to find someone to take the lorry and horses home.
 
i so agree planning to take my HGV soon done the theory !!!

all the points you make are so valid especially about all this weight laws etc !!! atleast witha n HGV i know i can take 3 horses easily where as most 7.5ton you can only take 1 or 2 maximum !!
 
Got my HGV, still only have a 7.5 tonne lorry, seems a bit pointless having a huge 30ft lorry for one horse...
 
I know that there will be places with weak bridges etc that you can't take them,there certainly are round here.

My point is that all the articles in H&H imply that HGVs are only really for professional riders and not for 'everyday' use. I think this is wrong and as more and more people who passed their car test after '97 buy lorries I think HGVs should be considered as a 'normal' lorry to have. Not least because in my experience horses usually travel better in them.(Okay so I have an 18.2, 17.3 and 16.3hh and you could easily loose a pony in it for several days, but even ponys like to travel comfortably!)

You don't need a tacho on a Private HGV (Although it does have one that admitedly isn't calibrated at the moment)

Another reason I think HGVs will become more popular is that the DVLA is about to start cracking down on class 3's from car licenses; so better start cutting back the booze and fags for that medical they're talking about introducing!
 
My 7.5ton lorry weighs 5 ton without horses but with tack (we were weighed on the way back from a plateing) so that gives me 2.5 tonnes for horses and water! i think you coulld quite happily put 3 horses in it plus water (obviously not clydsdales bt normal tb or hunter types)!
 
[ QUOTE ]
You don't need a tacho on a Private HGV (Although it does have one that admitedly isn't calibrated at the moment)


[/ QUOTE ]
Sorry to be the bearer of bad tidings but from 11/04/07 the new EC directive on driver hours has removed the exemption for private HGVs above 7500kg max laden weight.
Therefore you have to comply with driver hours regs and need a working and calibrated tacho.
frown.gif
 
I thought I had read that somewhere, glad I'm not going mad. Thats interesting above about the laws cracking down on class 3 from car licences, good idea I think tbh (but then I would say that, I had to spend £1000 on my HGV!). Will be a hell of a blow to an awful lot of people though to have to do medicals etc.
The tipper chassis thing is also v interesting. Ultimately we might well look to put our horsebox body on a new chassis as it is sound and has everything we need, but would be V interested in a shorter HGV chassis - she is quite long for a 7.5t, so with my HGV licence we would then be able to put 3 horses in too, which the body is partitioned for and my licence would be fine. Did you look into that in detail elaine?
 
I am working towards my theroy at the mo and am planning to take my HGV (Class C) in the next month or so. How did everyone find the actual traing and test? I'm only really used to driving cars and am a bit worried about the whole thing. I was also thinking of taking my +E for the trailer (I don't have to for ordinary towing as I am old) as my sister did the training and found it very helpful; for reversing. On the normal test do they tech you in articulated or rigid lorries, do they teach you reversing so that I might not need the addtional test for the reversing.
 
Comicduo, I found the training/test really good fun actually! It was a little scary to start with as I had never driven over 3.5t before, so to be sat in the drivers seat of a 16t flatbed was scary to say the least! But soon got the hang of it! Had a very good instructor though so that helped, and did a week's training with them. Had a bit of a nightmare with my test as my handbag got stolen the week before with my licence in it, so the DSA wouldn't let me take my test. So had to re-book etc, but got it all done in the end!

If you need to tow a horse trailer as well as drive a horsebox, you'll either have to do class C then C+E, or B+E and C.
God, it is complicated actually! I've done B+E and C now, cost me about £1500 total but I can now tow a horsetrailer legally and drive any rigid lorry, so should be sorted for life!
PS reversing you will get the hang of, main problem is that they test you as a professional driver so your general drive standard has to be higher than it would be for car tests.)
Hope some of that helps! PM me if you want any more advice.
ETS mis read your post sorry! You can obviously tow a horsetrailer on your licence - the reversing for class C is actually much easier than B+E so won't really help with that, but much cheaper just to practice by yourself!!!
 
The training is good actually, although exhausting. I found the reversing easy, you just follow a set series of moves. Left lock, follow the curb with the wheel, straight when flag visible etc and you end up in the right place, just so long as you don't get flustered. Hardest part is lining up the back of the lorry in the 2 metre grid but knowing where the back is is very useful especially when it's your car your reversing up to!

Once you've mastered making it move it's a bit of an academic exercise really, how should I take this corner, how should I line up for this turn etc and then practice.

Get a good DSA registered instructor and it should be easy!

As regards tachos, it's actually not clear what you need to do. The EC rule has changed but the current VOSA advise sheet on drivers hours appears to state that as long as you are driving in the UK only you are still exempt. AND the Ec regulation 3820/85 Council Regulation 3820/85
actually excludes non-commercial use but 3821/85 DOES include any vehicle over 3.5t not just HGVs, so 7.5t should also need tachos (if commercial?)3821/85
VOSAs un written view is that if you aren't a proffesional driver during the week then your use of the lorry is effectivly the same as if it was your car. But I suppose they will forget that if they nick you. Fortunatly my tacho does seem to still have a valid calibration so I might just change the disk that's been in there 7 months! It's looking a bit like a piece of modern art - (sensible offers over £1m considered)
 
[ QUOTE ]
You don't need a tacho on a Private HGV (Although it does have one that admitedly isn't calibrated at the moment)

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you'll find the law has recently changed and any vehicle over 7.5t (private or otherwise) now requires a working Tacho
wink.gif
 
If you look on the BSJA website today under News there is an article giving examples of those who do and those who don't come under the new regs.
 
I've only just started driving a 7.5t wagon (never driven anything bigger than a car before) so can't compare it to anything else but our wagon pulls very well up hills, has air suspension, gives a very smooth ride round corners and stops fine. It's also nice and short and not very wide so easy to get round our narrow country lanes. In fact you couldn't get anything longer than about 25feet up our lane as the turn in is very tight. HGV wagons have to park at the bottom and the horses led up the lane to home. It's plenty big enough to carry the max of two horses we ever need to take anywhere. Perhaps if I couldn't drive a 7.5t'er on my normal licence I might think about doing the HGV test but why pay out for something you don't need?
 
You can actually drive over a weight limited bridge if it for access.
Went up to Scotland once to pick up aload of cows for auction there was a 10T weight limit bridge going to farm we were 40T empty! Imagine what we were when full double decks of cows coming out!
I have seen myUncle but his artic where people struggle with short wagons! Now naturally not saying it will fit in the impossible but alot of it is down to practice & skill! (Not saying anyone hasn't)
IfI needed a wagon then I would go for the Big HGV's just for peace of mind for weight & much better ride for the horses.
 
Exactly my point.

It amazes me the number of caring, intelligent horse owners who would do anything for the horses and then happily put them on a lorry that is loaded beyond it's design limits.

You wouldn't think of putting 12 kids in a fiesta so why even entertain the notion of putting 2 or 3 horses in a vehicle only suitable for 1?

Of course the difference with lorrys and cars is that people build 7.5t boxes KNOWING they are unsuitable to carry the load. People don't do that with cars (with the possible exception of the 2CV).

As has been said above, HGVs don't have to be long, an old skip chassis is the same length as a 7.5t box and has the added advantage of having diff locks so you don't get stuck in the mud! (DAF LFs come in 7.5t and (I think) 12t and they are exactly the same size, the only outward difference is the 12t has bigger wheels)

If, like me, you have to take a test to drive a lorry don't do the class 3, do the class 2 and before you buy a box go and look at HGV boxes as well as 7.5t. Then make your decision but I firmly believe that HGVs are so superior to 7.5t boxes that you will, in most cases, choose an HGV.

Finally: Go to a show and watch people unloading boxes. The 7.5t boxes DO rock around and bounce as the horse goes off. An HGV will be steady and not rock or bounce. Then tell me that 7.5t are as stable as an HGV.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top