A bit of advice please.

MrsElle

MrsElle

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We have had dogs for more years than I care to remember, and had a few rescues in to rehome when we had the room and time a few years ago. We never had an issue with the dogs fighting when we let them out to play or on walks, but wanted to know how best to handle the following issue as I haven't had experience of it before.

We take the three lunatics out together for an hour or two at lunchtime. The first part of the walk consists of them all wee-ing, poo-ing and being fixated on all things rabbit! As soon as we get to a certain spot (ie end of gorse bushes and rabbit country!), Elsie the new Rottie turns to face Roxy the JRT and off they go. Roxy runs about pretty constantly on walks and at this particular point in our walk Elsie chases her. Elsie shows no interest in chasing or interacting with Poppy our Staffy, who spends her life following Roxy the JRT around wherever she goes. Roxy is more agile than Elsie, but Elsie can easily keep up with her on a straight run. Elsie is barking, Roxy is barking and snapping and it all sounds very aggressive, although no hackles are raised. I try to calm it all down after they have been playing so roughly for a while as I feel that Elsie can get carried away and am pretty sure Roxy would snap hard if she had had enough and am then worried Elsie would retaliate.

So, with regard the above issue, am I right in stopping them playing after a while? Roxy does get a bit fed up with Elsie as Els is so much bigger than her and tends to knock her flying from time to time :)

Second issue is balls! Elsie loves chasing and fetching balls, and after never being interested before, it seems the other two do as well. Because the other two are lower to the ground one or other of them seems to scoop the ball up before Elsie can, resulting in Elsie becoming a bit grumpy. This afternoon Elsie and Poppy (the Staffy) got to the ball at the same time and a fight ensued. Elsie actually picked Poppy up by the scruff of the neck and shook her, letting go of her when I squealed very loudly and at a very high pitch (diversion tactic - OH thinks I am insane, but it works!). We put the ball away and Elsie spent the rest of the walk with her hackles up and Poppy spent it throwing herself on her back in front of Elsie or standing in front of her and doing lots of lip licking and generally submissive behaviour.

At this moment in time we have decided no more balls when all three of them are out together. OH takes Elsie out alone later for an hour, so she can get her ball fix in then, and I have the little two out in the garden playing seek and fetch games while Elsie is out. However, I am still a bit concerned that Elsie is lots bigger than the other two and isn't afraid to put them in their place. I don't want a problem arising so need to know the best way to deal with our current doggy dynamics. A muzzle on Elsie while out with the other two might be an option, at least we will know that she can't hurt the JRT if she decides to snap, but is that the right thing to do?

Sorry for the essay!
 
Toys around a pack, especially involving a new dog would be a bad plan IMO.

Just sound like they are establish their order of things, now that Elsie has found her feet.

I would step in if you feel it is getting OTT as you did.
 
I am alway very wary of throwing balls within a group of dogs unless their pack order is well and truly established. It also sounds as if they are getting a bit over excited at the start of their walk which can also be a catalyst for things to kick off. Our little heeler pup is a horror for swinging on Evie the GSDs tail, we stop him because it would only take her to lose her temper and snap and she could do him a lot of damage, so all moments of high excitement e.g. going out of the door in the morning , setting off on walks etc are kept strictly under control.
I would do as you are doing and stop any OTT behaviour as soon as it starts.
 
Thanks, I think the ball plus three newly thrown together dogs was a bit of a mistake, but until now Elsie has been happy to back off. She does get chance to play with balls when off by herself, so we will leave it at that for now :)

She does get quite excited when chasing the JRT, which does worry me (fiesty little JRT plus excited large Rottie = recipe for disaster!), so I do calm it down after a few minutes, although Elsie is normally knackered by then - she hasn't the stamina that Roxy has!
 
Not sure if this will work for you but when I walk with my dog and my dad's, I take three balls for three dogs. One of my dads really isn't fussed but the other one likes to play fetch and gets cross as Freddie always beats him to it.

So, I throw one a long way for F (with launcher thingy) and then throw the second one on a slightly different trajectory but still in his 'eyeline' for the other one.

Admittedly they all generally get on well - in fact my dad's ball oriented dog will tease F unmercifully given the chance by hanging onto the ball and then teasing him with it (if we're just hanging out in the garden etc) and I would then give F a seperate ball. However, it seems to be a game they enjoy as the second ball will often be abandoned or F will give it to my dads other dog!

Like I said, this may not work in your situation but I've found it useful when our 3 are out together.
 
I would certainly take the balls out of the situation now Elsie seems to have found her feet, as MM says try to keep the excitement levels down.

When you take them out how about staggering them when you let them off their leads, this teaches the one on leads self control which you are looking for and dont allow them off the lead until they are calm. I mix mine up so its never the same one off the lead first and reward the ones sitting nicely with a reward. As regards the Rottie I think you have to watch her and any inapproiate behaviour needs to be nipped in the bud, if she dosnt respond to a loud ahah I would put her back on the lead. Not knowing her I would be wary of putting a muzzle on her fearing she might regress but only you can answer that. Given the difference in hers and Roxys size you have to err on the side of caution but if Roxy is the one winding Elsie up its also Roxys behaviour that need addressing.
 
This is common in rotti (the fixating) lest not forget the where herding dogs. They are a little like collie only instead of fixating on the heal they tend to stand over their target or even mouthe.
Mine does it with my whippet, she never shows aggression and the whippet is a wicked little git and often latches onto rotts cheek and the rotts does not retaliate and she can be shouted off/back in any situation and it is this control you need when dealing with a pack of dogs.
Mine is also very ball orientated but again I can throw the ball for them all 9 of them and (no fights) but again this is all in the initial control and the understanding of reprimand that will come with any unwanted behaviour.
As suggested work on control esp of the rott, get some identifiable voice commands in there.
 
yo say you take the 3 out at lunch time, what do the dogs do in the morning after a night in? if all are quite well behaved IF you are going to do the fetch the ball thing then you need to fire out 4 balls in v quick succession so each dog has a ball to persue, and human gets the 4th! 2 terriers on a rottie could be nasty. i would agree with dobie girl.. keep one on a lead and let 2 off to play varing the equation. in time, all 3 should be fine together. other solution is take all balls/items out of the equation and leave thn to sniff around and mooch. if i left my lot til lunchtime before exercise it would be edlam. mine are full of beans first thing having spent the night sleeping. am exercise i would think would be the way to go thus making the lunchtime walk more pleasueable! and the teatime walk. and the late night pee in the garden routine! good luck,.
 
Thanks all :)

We had a lovely uneventful walk today with no balls involved.

When we let them off lead when we first get to the field they don't interact at all, spend a good ten minutes running about doing their own thing until we get to a certain point where Elsie has decided it is chase Roxy time. I am not sure who instigates it tbh, Elsie stops and looks at Roxy, ready to play, Roxy looks at her and legs it! Roxy does snap at Elsie when they are running alongside each other, but she does this with Poppy the Staffy and is in play. At no time are hackles up, just a lot of running and barking is involved. However, Elsie does get carried away and does what you said, Cayla, catches Roxy and stands over her. This is obviously quite threatening to Roxy who snaps and runs again, and the whole 'game' starts over. I called Elsie over and put her on the lead just before the point where the chase starts and kept her on for five minutes. When I let her off she did chase but was quieter and not as giddy :)

We were met by a loose dog that appeared over the dunes at one point and our three just met it with a quick wag of tail and a sniff and then came back to us :) (I know the dog, know it is ok with other dogs so didn't recall ours immediately). I was pleased that Elsie passed the meeting strange dogs unexpectedly test with flying colours.

The JRT gets put on lead at various points on the walk as she chases flying seagulls, so at various times today both Elsie and Roxy were on lead while the others were off.

Hopefully Elsie and Roxy will calm down with each other a bit with time.

Unfortunately we can't go on a loose walk first thing as we run a guest house and start work at 6.30 when it is still dark. They do go out in the garden and run about like lunatics though :) Or at least Roxy and Poppy do, Elsie refuses to get out of bed some mornings - must be a teenager :D
 
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