a question about tucking up

[LaurenBay]

Hi all.

Not posted much recently but something odd happened tonight which I've never come across before. Ruby went out this morning and came in around 1ish, I changed her into a medium necked stable rug and left with hay. Went up about 5ish and did my jobs and groomed and got ready for being ridden. I noticed that one of rubys flanks was twitching. At first I thought perhaps she was cold, but felt warm to touch and hadn't been without her rug long. The other flank was fine and there was no twitching anywhere else on her body. I tacked up and went in the school, just walked but she felt a bit uneven although happy to go forward. Got off and put her on the lunge so I could have a better view of what was going on, trotted her round and the shaking/twitching was still there. I bought her back in and popped a warmer rug on, done some stretches and then massaged her under her rug.

Popped her in stable and she pawed and tried to roll (she had gut sounds and had done a normal poo on the yard 2 mins earlier! ) So got her out and walked and put her back in with an extra rug. Sat around for 30 mins to keep an eye and she was happily munching on hay, no colic signs or any abnormal behaviour. She was lovley and warm although there was still slight twitching.

I'm going up again a bit later on to check on her otherwise I'm in for a sleepless night (probably won't sleep much anyway now )

Does it sound like she tucked up? Can they tuck up on one side and not the other? She did look a bit "dipped" on the side she was shaking on.

Any suggestions welcome

 

[twiggy2]

what you are describing is not what I would call tucked or tucking up.

A few years ago a mare I look after was being groomed on the yard so she could be tacked up to be ridden, one side of her quarters started trembling and then as we watched for a moment her whole quarters started to do it, I put her i the stable and she laid down-no rolling just laid down, I called the vet-she had compacted colic.

The trembling can be a sign of pain especially gut pain and it is often an indicator of colic

 

[Pigeon]

Yes! Though there are many reasons a horse could tie up. Was it like this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zsa-uVFKg7U

 

[LaurenBay]

I didn't know that I'm going back in half hour to check her so I'm really hoping there's no sign of trembling

 

[LaurenBay]

No it wasn't as notixeble as that pigeon. She didn't seem to mind it much at all.

 

[Pigeon]

I think stuff like PSSM you can get a blood test for, I would do that to be on the safe side. Calcium deficiency can be a factor? I know humans can get that very mild flickering muscle tremor for no reason really, and it's not a problem, so I wouldn't panic just yet, but try and ring your vet tomorrow.

 

[FfionWinnie]

Do you mean tying up?

PSSM type 1 you can do a hair test. Costs £30 via animal genetics. Type 2, RER and other muscle myopathies need a muscle biopsy to diagnose correctly.

If your horse has had a myriad of seemingly odd symptoms then you may find some answers by googling PSSM.

Things like unexplained lameness, stiffness, grouchy behaviour, colic (often a secondary), ulcers (also a secondary), and things you just can't put your finger on...

 

[stormox]

tucked up or tied up?Tucked up is when the horse hasnt got a nice round belly behind the rib cage but is pulled up there, like it hasnt eaten for a day. No it cant happen just one side. Tying up is a totally different thing, it is a spasm or paralysis of a muscle in the quarters, can be caused by an excess of lactic acid due to excercise can be very dangerous. This could be in just one quarter.

 

[LaurenBay]

Thanks pigeon. Yea I'm trying not to worry but Horses do like to worry us! The Horse in the video seemed to be agitated by the twitching but Ruby didn't seem to care, didn't mind me touching or prodding it and as I said was pooing fine. I mucked out at 1ish and then came back at 5 and there were wees and 3 poos and then pooed again on the yard. She always has loud gut noises and I can usually hear them even just standing near her. Which I could tonight.

 

[Pigeon]

Here's another PSSM video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqp6IXdDKB8

 

[TGM]

Are you confusing tucking up with tying up?

Tucking up refers to a horse who looks rather greyhound-like, with a sucked up belly. This can be caused by lack of fibre intake, dehydration, stress and/or excessive exertion.

Tying up is a complex disorder when enzymes from damaged muscles get into the bloodstream. A horse who ties up may present just as a little stiff behind, or may be so crippled as to be unable to move. Hindquarters and back muscles usually are rigid and hard, and there may be trembling. Horses often look distressed and paw the ground, so easily confused with colic, in severe cases the urine might be brownish in colour. Risk factors with tying up are high carb feeds (cereal-rich mixes/cubes, straight cereals, highly molassed feeds), reduced turnout, riding after a few days off, dehydration (common in cold weather). A lot of horses who tie up have underlying conditions such as PSSM.

From your description it sounds unlikely that your horse is tucking up. It may have tied up slightly, alternatively she may have another condition such as a low grade colic. Only your vet can really tell you! If there is any suggestion that she has tied up I would suggest asking for a blood test because that will give you a definitive answer.

 

[FfionWinnie]

tucked up or tied up?Tucked up is when the horse hasnt got a nice round belly behind the rib cage but is pulled up there, like it hasnt eaten for a day. No it cant happen just one side. Tying up is a totally different thing, it is a spasm or paralysis of a muscle in the quarters, can be caused by an excess of lactic acid due to excercise can be very dangerous. This could be in just one quarter.

It's not actually due to lactic acid, which is a by product of the cause of the muscle damage. The presence of lactic acid is normal and metabolised by the horse within an hour.

 

[LaurenBay]

She was dipped on one side but not the other

 

[Illusion100]

No, I don't think being tucked up is the problem.

Usually with tying up the horse reluctant to move, stiff and the muscles particularly over hindquarters are 'rigid' to the touch. They also tend to be depressed, anorexic and sweating isn't uncommon. Not entirely convinced this is the problem either but a blood sample to check CK and AST levels would determine this.

Hate to cause alarm but I'd be suspecting colic and keeping a very close eye. Please keep us updated.

 

[LaurenBay]

Sorry I got the 2 confused. She was happy to move so don't think she tied up

 

[LaurenBay]

I'm so worried if it is colic. She moved onto straw 3 weeks ago so I'm wondering if that might cause an issue if she is eating it (she does but not a huge amount)

 

[Illusion100]

Colic is so indiscriminate, most of the time the cause can only be suspected or guessed at.

Give your Vets a call and chat your concerns over and see what they say before you worry yourself sick.

 

[LaurenBay]

Just gotten in from the yard. She is plenty warm enough and the twitching has stopped, also not dipped anymore. Hasn't pooed but then again not long left her. Bed doesn't look too disturbed either so she's not been thrashing around. Is bright and alert and happily munching her hay. Could also hear good gut sounds. I'm going to check on her first thing in the morning. Thanks for everyone's suggestions.

 

[unicornystar]

My chap tied up badly last week, what made me mention this was the fact you mentioned she felt a little unbalanced when you rode her, this was the first sign of my boy, he jogged out of the yard like a lunatic and within half a minute felt so unbalanced, almost a bit lame....we had quite dramatic episode compared to what you describe but the muscle twitching and the fact your horse was pooing and weeing (mine was fine too with that!), we had rolling, falling over, but largely what rang alarm bells other than the incessant sweating was the feeling he was not "quite right" on his feet....hope your mare is all well and dandy this morning but would be worth keeping an eye on and withdrawing any grains....

 

[BBP]

It could be a mild version of a tying up condition. My horse has RER muscle myopathy. His version of tying up (have been lucky not to have a big episode so far) is that he gets little muscle tremors/spasms, it was just one side behind his shoulder last time. He doesn't get depressed, sweat, certainly isn't anorexic! or unwilling to move with it, although his movement becomes very poor for him. His issue is faulty calcium regulation, this cannot be fixed by adding calcium or magnesium to the diet, it is a defective system. A blood test for muscle enzymes should give you some information.

 

[LaurenBay]

Quick update, left her in today so she could be kept a close eye on. All seems fine, normal amount of poos has drunk normal amount and is warm. No twitching or dipped side. I rode and she felt normal again. Phew!

 

[LaurenBay]

I will get a blood test done if it happens again to check

 

[Illusion100]

Very pleased to hear she is ok! �� Thanks for update. ��