ACD's the positives and the negatives,please!

m3gan

m3gan

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Hi there,
I am hoping to get an ACD bitch pup soon, but I have been given a very negative picture of them from a member of this forum, and I would be very grateful for your opinions of the breed for me.

I have owned a Belgian shepherd before who was PTs 7 weeks ago at 15yrs. 2 years earlier we lost our Collie cross at 17 yrs. so I am not a novice dog owner. We live in the country on the edge of Dartmoor where there are plenty of stock. I also would like to try to train the dog to come riding with me on my ned.( alongside not on top !) The dog would be exercised twice a day and on the days that I work (3) i will have a dog sitter/walker for 1 and half hours . We don't have any other pets apart form 3 chickens and 2 beehives! My daughter lives with us but she is 24 and we don't have any other young children around, except OH sometimes!!!!

Thank you in anticipation and for reading.
 
Australian Cattle Dog Annette! The only experience I have of them is that someone I know has them, including a top winning bitch. She says they are hard work and can be stubborn, but loves the breed, think they are pretty intense though. Which variety of BSD did you have. some are easier than others I think? You are best contacting KarynK on here for infor about ACD, or see if you can find a breed club website.
 
My neighbour has bred ACD's for years (40+), along with GSD's. Fabulous lady, in her 80's now and still runs various training courses.

She does end up with a fair share of rescues for rehab (not her own breeding) going to her with aggression issues to people and other dogs. As she says they are heelers and the inbred nipping and determination makes them intense personalities. However if trained from the start and handled well they are great characters and companions. Very loyal to one or two family members. Can be mouthy too and have a tendancy to pick up anything and everything. Noise - shrill high pitched bark, tell me about it, if one of them starts up at night we can hear it 30 acres away!!!

As an alternative what about an AS?
 
What kind of Belgian did you have? I'd say anyone who can cope with a Malinois could cope with an ACD. KarynK and Dodgeraus on here also have lots of experience with them, if they don't show up you could send them a PM.
 
i dont have much experience of them... but i did train someone who had one for agility a few years ago. They are, from what i gather from my experience with this dog and what Ive heard, very stubborn and willful. they are bred to work and need a job and an experienced firm handler. The bitch in question was a super wee dog though:)

only other beed i'd ever consider is a kelpie ;)
 
MurphysMinder said:
Australian Cattle Dog Annette! The only experience I have of them is that someone I know has them, including a top winning bitch. She says they are hard work and can be stubborn, but loves the breed, think they are pretty intense though. Which variety of BSD did you have. some are easier than others I think? You are best contacting KarynK on here for infor about ACD, or see if you can find a breed club website.
Click to expand...

Thank you MurphysMinder!

I have been in contact with Karyn and she has given loads of info. and it is positive, was just interested to know if anybody else has experience of them.
My Belgian was a Tervuren and was a lovely boy, he was very full on when he was young but was a wonderful dog, sadly missed!
 
the rescue centre have a nice austrailian cattle dog for rehoming. might be worth a look.
see www.manytears.co.uk i think. i got a super puppy from them 3 weeks ago. well worth the drive to swansea! good luck, and please consider a rescue dog.
 
Just to clarify that I don’t recommend this breed to just anyone you need to have the right lifestyle and attitude, they like every breed have good and bad points. My two have been totally screwed over by humans in their pasts and yet to their credit they still like people and will walk away from situations with other dogs! You have to understand their heritage then you will know if you can do them justice!

They are a tough breed from a tough country bred for a tough job of WORK. The outback is no place for sentiment and cattle are a business, a “paddock” can be thousands of acres in size, full of tough mean cattle and little water with little sentiment from their owners only the best were allowed to survive and reproduce!

They have Dingo in them and some very tough herding dogs, they are strong and very intelligent, probably more so than some of their owners, give them an inch and they will happily push the boundaries to a mile and it will take you two miles to get back that respect! They are still very close to their working roots and have not yet been mucked up in the name of beauty. They are sound and active and need a job if they are not to do the cattle bit, or they will look for their own job and you may not like their choice of activity at all.

They are really a trainable Husky being close to wild dog and have a good understanding of pack psychology, mine quickly fit in with my sisters husky pack and happily obey those rules, where a member of a more subservient breed would likely come unstuck before it capitulated!

If you shout at some breeds they will fall to pieces shout at a Cattle dog and you get “but, do you really really mean it?” So if you are a complete novice, are not aware of dog psychology, do not think that seeking help and guidance is an option for you, want something to cuddle or are a lazy couch potato who thinks a walk round the local park once a day is enough THIS IS NOT THE BREED FOR YOU.

Unfortunately the ACD like other breeds has suffered for its looks with people picking it because it looks lovely rather than choosing a breed that suits their situation. So the breed gets people slagging it off without looking at the big picture.

I make no apologies for this next bit and if you are offended “whatever” but if you have any dog that you have had from a puppy and it is people or dog aggressive you need to look long and hard at yourself as a dog owner and make some drastic changes. Cattle dogs like other breeds are not this way inclined, they are not, like all breeds bred for bad temper, I am sure CC will back me on this one, but the best security, police or schutzhund dogs are those with a level biddable temperament, so there is no need to breed for aggression in any breed. I would go as far as to say that a dog that is aggressive towards other dogs and or humans is either in pain, has been subjected to pain in the past or is at the wrong end of pi** poor training/handling!!!!

Re ACD's Yes they can bark, yes they can be wilful, yes they will like to nip heels but no more than any other Working herder, BUT only if you allow it! But they are not manic, will go anywhere with you, have endless stamina, will not disappear off hunting, will protect you and your property and are perhaps one of the most entertaining and loyal companions you could find.
 
Thats a really good piece of advice to someone considering the breed karynK, its good to see owners/lovers of a breed that are realistic enough to admit that it may not be suitable for everyone.
Totally agree with you that the best schH dogs etc have good level temperament, not aggressive ones, however would slightly disagree with your blanket statement re dogs showing dog aggression etc. I have mentioned my friends shepherd on here before, she is a highly experienced gsd owner and trainer, had this lad from 7 weeks but he did have huge dog aggression problems. A lot of work has virtually eliminated this, but she is not a p**s poor trainer/handler. She has realised that she made mistakes, despite being from strong working lines he is over sensitive, and she feels she may actually have over socialised him, but he did always have extreme reactions to other dogs. When introduced to my older bitch at around 10 weeks he had a real go at her, despite her totally ignoring him, and he never really became "friendly" with her. In fact he seems unable to properly play with other dogs, he just goes over the top and flattens them, so quite a challenge. He has also been checked extensively for pain issues.
She has worked miracles now and is currently working him at TD level in working trials. Sorry digressed a bit there, will let things go back to ACDs now.:o
 
I have to say my dog's issues were ingrained in terms of his bitch line and upbringing (sheltered!) but my weak handling and 'ohnowhyishedoingthatPANIC!!!' style did not help!

A lot of the working lines are hard, hard dogs, but also, strangely sensitive in other areas as MM mentions and it takes very careful moulding so that these traits do not manifest themselves in a negative way.

Also agree, for civil or sports work - aggression or fear is useless and counter-productive. The dog needs to have the confidence to go in swift and hard on command in a stressful situation...but more importantly have the confidence to let go or stand down when he or she is told to. In sport you get a DQ if the dog does not come off the sleeve after three commands.

Speaking of TD, I think my track has matured, back in a wee while :D
 
Ok MM I’m sorry I admit there are exceptions, smack my wrist for me! I do get a bit upset having always had to deal with other peoples *uckups. But I would set your friend apart by saying what is great about it is that she hasn’t blamed the dog and has thought long and hard about what went wrong, which to her credit sets her well above average Joe who is dragged round the streets by their dog aggressive pooch complete with designer collar and lead, blaming it all on the dog or it’s breed and not their total lack of understanding about dogs or that breed!!!

I know some GSD’s and some amongst other guarding breeds can be a bit sensitive and are not very forgiving if you make the slightest error in their training or upbringing, a friend of mine in the police will tell you all about the “Colleague” that got a little carried away on a job and bit more of his own side than the bad guys and not only on one occasion. He was not best pleased by the stitches he got in the place where he sits (a lot)! When he’s had a few he will even show you the scar!!!

What I’d like to see is NO ACD’s in rescue because people don’t do their homework, then one day I can justify getting a puppy that no one has mucked up!!!
 
I went back packing in Australia after uni and worked on a cattle ranch and they had workind ACDs and ACD x Collies and I loved them. I would love to own one but I dont think I ever will due to the nature of what they are bred for. They went ALL day, We would truck the horses out to where we were drafting the cattle from and the dogs often ran with or rode on the quad bikes at the side. We would set off before dawn and arrive back well after dark, the dogs worked the cattle all day (and there were some very big bulls) and we each went through 4/5 horses but the dogs never tired. They are very strong tough dogs and very loyaland affectionate to the people they know. One hired hand brought his own little blue bitch and she never lost sight of him ever. However, on the days they weren't worked they were a nightmare and had to be chained up to stop them harrasing the stock and anything that moved. and yes very noisey. These were working dogs rather than pets so i'm sure some dogs are calmer but after seeing what they are capable of I know I am not in a position to have one but I loved the little blue dogs
 
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