Additional sharing costs?

[Pmf27]

Hi all, hoping for some input on a (current) hypothetical which I'm hoping stays that way!

If you were sharing a horse, who also had two other sharers, for £120 a month would you then expect to pay additional cost for saddle check? Or would you expect your £120 a month to cover this?

Bearing in mind the same amount is being paid by the other sharers...

 

[Lintel]

Sounds complex.
So there are 4 people, 3 sharers and the owners presumably?
I would assume the bill would be split 4 ways?
Although I think £120 a month is quite an amount for a share horse that also has two other sharers! But I have never shared so maybe that’s just the norm, but didn’t want to read and run!

 

[Pmf27]

Sounds complex.
So there are 4 people, 3 sharers and the owners presumably?
I would assume the bill would be split 4 ways?
Although I think £120 a month is quite an amount for a share horse that also has two other sharers! But I have never shared so maybe that’s just the norm, but didn’t want to read and run!

Yes that's correct, but the owners don't do much with the horse as they have other things going on. Hence putting horse out for share.

It has so far worked well, there haven't been any confusions or conflicts at all. But I do think that for £120 a month that ought to cover (as a contribution) to all required care inc. saddle fees.

 

[criso]

I would expect that to cover all costs unless stated right at the beginning. What else might they ask to be paid, dentist, vaccinations?

I have seen adverts that say so much per month plus share of shoes but it's outlined at the beginning.

 

[Vodkagirly]

Normally sharers pay a set cost and any additional expenditure eg saddles or vets is paid by owners. I mean if a new saddle was required, who would make the decision if there are multiple sharers?

 

[HappyHollyDays]

As the owner of a horse that had a sharer I paid for absolutely everything for him. Saddle fitting, physio, dentist, vets bills and all his livery costs. His sharer paid for his shoes, her own lessons on him and entries to any events we were going to such as clinics, fun rides, camp.

 

[Dave's Mam]

Owner should deal with saddle fit on a share. IMO.

 

[SO1]

The only case where I think that sharer might be expected to contribute towards this was if you felt that the saddle needs checking but the owner disagreed.

I have seen situations where sharers have wanted a physio or some other practitioner to see the horse and the owner felt it was not necessary but said sharer could get one out if they paid for it.

 

[Regandal]

Sounds like one mercenary owner you’ve got there. Does the horse get a day off?

 

[Red-1]

If the owner doesn't do anything with the horse work wise, I don't see 3 sharers as mercenary. I could see each having 2 days, they won't always want to do jumping, for instance. They will likely do hacking or simply chores on their days sometimes.

£120 a month seems OK, especially if the horse is nice and at a good livery yard on part livery.

The only issue seems to be that an unexpected bill is being thrown at you. If extras were going to be charged, that should have been made clear at the start.

I would speak to the owner and say that this bill is unexpected and you don't feel it is fair. Unless you really rate the share, in which case a saddle check is around£60, so if that is split 3 or 4 ways you may choose to simply pay it.

 

[maya2008]

I am guessing you’re getting 2 days a week each, and the owner isn’t riding at all? £360 total was about right for total monthly cost of a stabled horse 10 years ago, I would imagine it’s more now. So if this is more of a part-loan arrangement where you cover all the costs on your days, then 1/3 of the saddle fitting cost (would be approx £75 total so £25 for you) would be yours. Do you also pay 1/3 of shoeing costs and vaccinations?

Not questioning you couldn’t get a cheaper share elsewhere, but it seems this owner is basically loaning their horse out, split between three people, with the aim that all the costs would be covered that way.

 

[peanutsmumma]

Wow....£120 plus extras does sound a lot.....unless im not charging enough!

I have a sharer for 1 of mine, she pays £80 per month and can have as many days a week as she likes, My 2 live out so her only chores are poo picking on her days and making up haynets once a week

Any feet trims, saddle checks, dentist etc is paid by me.

 

[Identityincrisis]

Crikey! I'm missing a trick here! 1 sharer alone would pay my diy livery, i might start pimping him out!

Sorry, being flippant, no i would not expect to pay towards a saddle fit, as others have said, everything should be outlined from day one. If the horse needs the saddle checked the owner needs to dip into some of that money you're paying and get the saddle checked.

I mean, if the horse is on full livery that money will go on livery bills alone but there shouldn't be any hidden costs

 

[ihatework]

I don’t think £120 a month is too much for a share provided the horse and stabling facilities are suitable.

I do however expect a share fee to be a fixed price and for the owner to pick up the tab on the routine ad hoc costs

 

[Bikerchickone]

There isn’t enough information here to say. Is the horse on full livery or DIY? A full livery yard in my area would be £650 a month or more. Who wanted the saddle checked? Did the owner advise of any extra costs to be met? The cost of keeping a horse properly these days is ever increasing so if the owner isn’t riding it at all then I’m not surprised they would want those who do to share the cost.

 

[SaddlePsych'D]

Other sharers aside, for a share I would not be happy with extra expenses being randomly added that weren't part of the initial agreement. If it were a renegotiation of the regular contribution (with various costs all going up at the moment) that would be a bit different.

 

[Skib]

Sharing should be as per a contract. Both my shares have been for riding, with both horse and tack provided by the owner. I have bought items of tack for both my shares but that has been of my own free will with the owner's agreement and when an item clearly needed replacing.
But this sounds to be a different situation. I was once involved in a possible share where a horse was shared by several sharer riders. A legal sharing arrangement involves the sharer paying a contribution to the upkeep of the horse. Hiring out a horse is different and requires a local authority licence, and (I think) insurance.
I remember the vet insurance obstacle as I was over 70 and the owner's insurance did not cover anyone over 70 years old. I didnt much care for either the horse or the owner or the lack of any licence and so I walked away.

 

[MuddyMonster]

I've always paid a set amount plus any extras I've chosen (e.g lessons, clinics, competitions etc) with the owner's permission when I shared in the past.

I wouldn't expect a sharer to contribute towards extras like saddle fittings, replacement tack etc.

 

[Fransurrey]

I wouldn't expect to pay for saddle fitting, no (unless I wanted it and owner didn't, as said above). There does seem to be an increasing trend of owners using their horses as 'cash cows' in my area. I know one who has so many sharers nobody knows how many there are - at least 4 lots. She almost certainly makes a profit, as she gives lessons on the horse, too!

 

[Pmf27]

Thank you all, this has confirmed what I suspected - that it is normal practice for my monthly rate to be inclusive of these extras.

I've not been asked to stump up money for the saddle by the owner, but it has been suggested by someone on the yard that I may well be asked to.

If I am asked to, I'll explain that I was under the impression my £120 a month covered that.

 

[Oreo&Amy]

Hi all, hoping for some input on a (current) hypothetical which I'm hoping stays that way!

If you were sharing a horse, who also had two other sharers, for £120 a month would you then expect to pay additional cost for saddle check? Or would you expect your £120 a month to cover this?

Bearing in mind the same amount is being paid by the other sharers...

Instinctively I would just split the cost between all riders including the owner. Part loaning means you are partly responsible. Proper saddle fitting is so important which I’m sure you already know so it’s no different from sharing shoeing costs. That’s the advice in case this hypothetical comes about! Having said that I have to admit I have never loaned out any of my horses so I’m basing this on what I’ve seen with other loaners. Look at the loan agreement you drew up, assuming you did one;that should help clarify the situation. Good luck ?

 

[criso]

Thank you all, this has confirmed what I suspected - that it is normal practice for my monthly rate to be inclusive of these extras.

I've not been asked to stump up money for the saddle by the owner, but it has been suggested by someone on the yard that I may well be asked to.

If I am asked to, I'll explain that I was under the impression my £120 a month covered that.

If asked to, i would take the opportunity to clarify exactly what you are expected to pay for, not just the saddle fitting, so everyone knows where they stand going forward.

 

[Fieldlife]

Thank you all, this has confirmed what I suspected - that it is normal practice for my monthly rate to be inclusive of these extras.

I've not been asked to stump up money for the saddle by the owner, but it has been suggested by someone on the yard that I may well be asked to.

If I am asked to, I'll explain that I was under the impression my £120 a month covered that.

I guess it depends on what your sharing contract says?



Morally I guess it also depends on what kind of livery? My local part livery with good facilities in surrey is £700pcm.



So three sharers paying £120 a month for two days each, not doing any chores and horse having a day off, and owner not riding would not cover 60% of livery bill!



DIY – 3 sharers doing chores and £320 a month might cover most / all the monthly costs.



Before you get to vaccinations / farrier / saddler / physio / fly spray / supplements etc.



It is a huge grey area. And needs an upfront discussion.

 

[ester]

I pay what you pay.
I would not expect to pay extra for a saddle fit other than the time I wanted to check whether my dressage saddle fitted him because that was for me ?

 

[criso]

Just had another thought, has one of the other sharers prompted the saddle check?

 

[Pmf27]

So, unfortunately I do not have a contract. I did ask the owner about this when I first met him, but he said that he has never bothered with a contract and just told me what my money would cover.

I was not told that I'd need to pay extra for saddle or vets or anything like this.

The horse is not on livery as the owner lives on site and so the horse has no stabling costs. And yes, the saddle check was requested by one of the sharers (not myself).

 

[SO1]

I expect as the saddle check was requested by a sharer rather than the owner is why you are being asked to pay.

So, unfortunately I do not have a contract. I did ask the owner about this when I first met him, but he said that he has never bothered with a contract and just told me what my money would cover.

I was not told that I'd need to pay extra for saddle or vets or anything like this.

The horse is not on livery as the owner lives on site and so the horse has no stabling costs. And yes, the saddle check was requested by one of the sharers (not myself).

 

[MuddyMonster]

If I've read it correctly, the owner hasn't actually asked you to pay but an outside person om the yard has suggested you might need to?

I'd ignore the other person's suggestion entirely!

If the owner brings it up, you can question it but at the moment its just hear say from an outsider.

 

[ester]

Is that just because the owner doesn’t ride though so won’t have noticed an issue?

I expect as the saddle check was requested by a sharer rather than the owner is why you are being asked to pay.

I agree MM until this comes from the owner it’s not a thing

 

[SaddlePsych'D]

If I've read it correctly, the owner hasn't actually asked you to pay but an outside person om the yard has suggested you might need to?

I'd ignore the other person's suggestion entirely!

If the owner brings it up, you can question it but at the moment its just hear say from an outsider.

I was also interested in who the 'someone' was in relation to the horse (other sharer, livery, YO, friend etc.) and would be mindful that the owner hasn't actually brought this up so to take it a bit lightly as the person may have got the wrong understanding or be unhelpfully interfering.