Advice for horse that stops (sorry long!)

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domane

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I have a lovely Clydie-cross and my OH and I are very attached to him. He's been with us nearly two months at the field I lease but because it is on a very busy road, I haven't attempted to ride him. However, last Saturday, we walked him in-hand (mostly off-road) 3 miles down the road to a lovely livery yard with 500 acres of off-road riding.

I was told he was unpredictable to load and couldn't be there to bring him home to us and apparently it took them an hour and they used some... shall we say "very unorthodox" methods to get him loaded. He was branded evil by the transporter who told me she'd have had him shot but there was still something about him that told me that was rubbish and he unloaded calmly, walked across a main road during rush hour, down a track, across a field and into a strange stable in the pitch dark without question, as calmly as anything. Yeah, really evil!!! So we gave him those first couple of months to chill and get to know us and to start to realise that we won't harm or scare him and we've all really bonded. Jack is the first horse my OH is particularly taken with too so it's lovely to think of him as "ours" rather than the usual "mine".

He came from a riding school but had only been there a few months and hadn't been used at all since Christmas as he was labelled as stubborn because he stops. I was told he was great to hack out. The day I tried him was incredibly windy and although I rode him in the school I didn't hack him out because I didn't feel I would get a true representation of him. We bought him on a "hunch" and so far he's been a really lovely affectionate horse who canters over to greet us when we arrive each day. We lead him to the yard, which is about an 8-minute walk and he gets a feed, so he associates our arrival with something nice (a routine we established back at day one, 2 months ago)

Since being at the new yard, we have led him out and about a few times to get him used to the tracks and location and he's generally been fine but he does occasionally stop. He doesn't "plant" as such and we can keep his feet moving by arcing around him side to side and then he will set off again. He doesn't seem agitated or bothered when he stops, so we put it down to a lack of confidence. Fair enough. Yesterday we led him out for about 40 minutes and he was great, walked along willingly. Encouraged by his relaxed attitude in his new surroundings, I decided to have a little pootle on him today. I have confidence issues so didn't have anything major in mind.

He came cantering over to meet us and for some reason today he stopped about 5 times just walking in-hand to the yard for his food. Again, he was unperturbed, didn't want to do anything except just stand. He was great to groom, tack up and mount and walked like a dope on a rope with my OH beside him but did stop a few times. His walking with me on him was a lot slower than in-hand and I did have to encourage him forwards every few strides with a small squeeze and my voice. We discovered that if my OH stopped, Jack would stop too, but I did manage to get past OH at one point so we were walking out confidently on our own. Coming home, we came up the track we lead him back and forth every day and 50 yards out he stopped. And NOTHING I did could make him move... I sat there for about 15 mins, just letting him think and make a decision. I tried turning him in a circle and pushing forward.. circle fine - forward no. I tried opening my rein and pushing diagonally with opposite leg... nothing. I even tried a pony club kick.... which unsurprisingly didn't work! My OH had wandered off at this point and was waiting at the car but did wander back and sit at the end of the track, so was within our sight. After about 15 mins, Jack did decide to move forward but was then very slow and needed lots of encouragement. Once he started forwards he got lots of praise and was then untacked and given the other half of his feed. Leading him back out to his field and he stopped on the path in exactly the same place as he had done coming in. Then proceeded to stop lots more times. Today was a bad day. He led FAR better than this moving him here on Saturday and now he's starting to get familiar with this layout so I don't think it's a confidence thing. I can understand that he may prefer hacking out in company but if that's the case why is he generally so calm in-hand?

Does anyone have any experience or advice please? I'm stumped.

And sorry for rambling but I wanted you to get the overall picture....

PS I should just add that I had his body checked over for soreness and he's fine, his feet are fine. Haven't had teeth checked yet, admittedly but not sure this would have any bearing on being led in a headcollar and he isn't headshy or showing any discomfort.
 
He sounds like a lovely boy:) just needs to learn forwards means forwards. I would carry a schooling whip when leading and when riding and give him a tickle behind the girth when you sense he's going to stop. If you need to be firmer with the whip, then do so, he cannot stop as and when he feels like it.:)
 
Sounds like he has got you really well trained. :(

Have you worked out why he decides to move when he does yet? Maybe your could recreate that moment for him, so he does it more often.
 
All I can say is I'm glad it was a nice day! I wouldn't have enjoyed standing there for 15 minutes in the rain!!
 
domane said:
Ah... forgot to say that if you use a whip on him he still stands and lashes out with his back feet instead... :(
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Personally, if your at the front or on his back, I wouldn't worry about back end antics. You need to be firm - I suspect he's got away with murder at the riding school with novice riders reluctant to use the whip effectively. Have you lunged him?

Edited to add, you may find that he has learnt that by lashing/bucking when the whip is used, his former riders have backed off - what a great trick!
 
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Bit of a different take, but I remember my friends little appaloosa pony behaved in a very similar way, and it turned out to be his back. Think whatever it was caused spasms. He was a rescue, and quite green so they put it down to that for a while. The tentative first steps when he did move forward sound similar to what your boy does. It looked like he was testing himself to see if it still hurt. He also used to lash out when asked to move before he was ready. Maybe something to bear in mind if yours doesnt improve
 
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I have recently added to my herd a very big cob was a bit bolshy when first arrived isnt now but can be very green and backward thinking,he does not respond to back up command with a whip at all just starts a tantrum.

None of this bothers me used to riding all sorts lots of tbs but he really does not respnd to scolding telling off a whip, he also just stops when hacking alone it is a confidence thing pony club kicking or anything where you are expiring energy is a waste of time is pointless as you get tired he just stands.

What has worked for us is just asking to move off one way to left say if doesnt do this then asked to move off to the right i keep dong this very quickly and he moves it used to take longer it now takes now seconds and he is much more confident also lots of praise as he really responds to this.

This horse is a real lump of a horse so probably like yours so physical pressure doesnt work and use of whip only confused and upset him asking for small continual movement is easy on rider and worked and he didnt get stressed and i didnt get tired hot and bothered seeing it through.

I am used to much more forward horses but from alot of his behaviour although he isnt skittish i think he has been bullied and roughly handled and instead of becoming nervous he has just closed down i think alot of big horses that are nappy or stop are like this but it seen as being stubborn if you raise your hand quiclky he doesnt flinch but closes his eyes tight shut as if resigned to the fact he is gtting a thwack. persevere and build his confidence.
 
The stopping on a hack could be forgiven as a confidence issue. But the fact he does it to and from the field makes it sound very much like a pisstake.

A life in a riding school, being handled by a mixture of very competent, often unsympathetic, professionals and pushover novices will have taught him to be very subtle in his taking the mickey. Some horses would be testing the boundaries at this point by being bargy and rude. Sounds like he's trying the passive stubborn route instead.

My friend has a young cob who tried the same thing for a while: too much of a woose to be genuinely naughty so he tried to stop, coming in from the field, going out to field etc.

Forcing him forwards was essential. If someone else was there they shoo-ed him forwards with a swinging rope or stick. If on her own she had a long heavy 12ft rope to swing behind him. Enough pressure, building gradually, to make him move but stopped the second he did. But willing to esculate until he did. It only once got as far as actually having to belt him with the rope and stopped entirely a few days later.
 
Hi, this just sounds like greenness and babyishness with a touch of trying you out as well. If you can't get him moving forwards (and often flailing a whip around can make the situation much more frantic) try moving him from side to side. You may have to be really firm but keep shifting his balance from left to right, the idea being that you are making it more uncomfortable for him to stand still than walk on. In hand, practise him stopping whenever you stop then practise reversing him a few steps, then walking on again. If you have an arena, it may be easier to start that exercise in there. It comes down to teaching him that you are in charge of your partnership! I'm sure if you get him hacking out with others, it will help build his and your confidence immensely. Best of luck with him , he sounds lovely! x
 
domane said:
Ah... forgot to say that if you use a whip on him he still stands and lashes out with his back feet instead... :(
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Try waving your whip in his eye-line. That works a treat for my ID mare who REALLY resents being touched with a whip but has been known to stand for an hour.
There is *nothing* more stubborn than a Clydie - and I speak from experience - and yes I do mean even in comparison with my stubborn ID. But they are fabulous animals and IME very safe.
 
sun-shine said:
Bit of a different take, but I remember my friends little appaloosa pony behaved in a very similar way, and it turned out to be his back. Think whatever it was caused spasms. He was a rescue, and quite green so they put it down to that for a while. The tentative first steps when he did move forward sound similar to what your boy does. It looked like he was testing himself to see if it still hurt. He also used to lash out when asked to move before he was ready. Maybe something to bear in mind if yours doesnt improve
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You have plenty of good and varied advice there Domane.
Sun-shines answer put me in mind of a riding school pony we had back in the 1970s.
His teeth were the problem.
.
Hope you soon find the solution
Teg :)
 
I'm not sure if I'm reading OP's original post correctly...

am I right in thinking that this was the first time horse had been ridden
- since being owned by (nervous) OP
- at new yard
- in two months?!?

If so then, well, heck yes, of course horse is likely to be a little cautious.

And, almost certainly in badly fitting (change in exercise regime, seasons etc) tack too.

OP
- don't let it bother you, the fact you managed a first ride when, as you say, you've got confidence issues is a Good Thing
- and, please, ignore those who'd like you to start hitting the poor creature just yet

You need to make sure you're a confident leader (unlikely on first ride!) before you can expect horse to get used to trusting your judgement.

Maybe get a lesson booked for a few days time so you have someone confident around to help you out. Sounds like the OH is supportive but not a horsey type you can rely on (just yet!)

Well done to both you and horse for taking your first hack together.
 
Lots of good advice given. I also think that he's taking the mickey a bit. If I was in that situation I would ride him like I mean business all the time until he gets over the stopping business. I know it's a walk down the lane but I would school him down the lane. Halt walk, halt trot transitions. Get him thinking and concentrating on you so he doesn't get the chance to think about his stopping habit. Even circle him if you can way before his stopping point.
 
As others have said, he needs to understand that forwards means forwards. But I wouldn't agree with beating him with a whip, you could easily turn something simple into something impossible. I'd either buy a proper wip-*** rope or improvise with the end of your reins. When he stops, ask politely for forward movement with the ordinary squeeze. Give him a couple of seconds to respond and if he doesn't, up the ante with a pony club kick and a growl. If he still ignores you (which I expect he would) surprise the life out of him by slapping the wip-*** rope (or rein ends) left then right then left again on his neck, firmly. Be prepared for a horrified leap forwards, possibly into canter. That's ok, it's still forwards. Tell him he's good and bring him back to walk. When he stops again (he will, just to test whether it was an accident, the thing with the rope/reins), do the same thing again - step 1 = polite, step 2 = really firm, step 3 = wip-*** or whatever it takes, which could include banging 2 saucepan lids together behind him! Do be prepared for more forwards than you anticipated. If you use the 3-step rule every single time, it won't be long at all before he responds sweetly to your 1st polite request. He sounds gorgeous, but he knows he's loved and just isn't taking you seriously. Shift your adoration slightly so it's more parent/child than equal x
 
I'd say that from all the sticky moments he's having, he sounds very green and young, my breakers often do this. They stop and they are unsure of how to get going again. A bit of wiggling will help. Sometimes all you have to do is get a friend to lift a hoof for you! I wouldn't bother with a whip just yet, but the last poster suggested the 'end of reins flick trick' and I can't agree more, it works great! (looks terrible mind you, but any port in a storm!) I use it for my young ones and also it it the only thing that works on my teenage medium dressage horse. you can pony club kick and whack him with a schooling whip and he'll refuse to pass a bin bag. Then the flicky rein trick....hey presto, off we go! Perhaps if you go out hacking in company off a lead rein too, if he's used to being led?

Best of luck, he sounds like a gem!
 
Thank you all for your lovely replies... some really useful things to work with there....

This is the boy, can you see why we're smitten? :)

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Have you tried hacking him out behind a calm, experienced horse? Usually herd instinct overcomes stubbornness in these situations. Once he's happy and confident going behind another horse--you might want to do this for a few weeks, actually--you can try going in front and then going alone.

Get his back, teeth, tack checked if you haven't already done so. And a sympathetic trainer is worth their weight in gold. Good luck!

If he's had that long off, I would build a regular routine of work so he knows he has a job to do, that it's not just pony holiday camp for him. Maybe four to six days a week, depending on your schedule.
 
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