Advice needed for difficult mare

Ellzbellz97

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Hello all,

September this year I brought a new mare she's a 15yo Tb x Trakenher. She settled in well when she was on 24/7 turn out and would stress when I brought her into the barn alone let you can leave her out alone fine. Now she's being brought in at night, she really stresses to the point where she reared up and collapsed on the floor from it and injured herself only minor luckily. She is fine when other horses are in but if they get turned out before her she really stresses and box walks, bangs the door etc which is making me have to get up at stupid times to turn her out before anyone else does as she stresses so much. If she stresses she is then naughty to ride spooking at everything, I had to get my instructor to come to me in the end as we wasn't going to be able to hack to hers as she was being silly. I currently have to tie her up so she can see other horses out in the field to tack up if no one else is in the barn, she's bruised me and reared up before and gave me a black eye... I have tried her on NAF Oestress and currently have a calmer tube I'm going to try. It's getting to the point now where OH and a few others have asked me if I have thought about selling her and getting something more sensible, I really don't know what to do as some days we have really good schooling sessions but other time's she's super stress and balshy. Can anyone recommend any calming supplements to help her or any other advice???

Thanks

Ellie
 

Ellzbellz97

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have you tried a mirror?

In the barn set up do you have bars between stables so they can see each other or not?


No but that's a good idea!! No they have bricks walls between them but she can see them when she pops her head out the stable as its an indoor barn with horses in a row on each side
 

Annagain

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We have one on our yard who would climb over the door (literally) if he wasn't not first out in the morning. We solved it by organising a rota for turnout so 3 of us take it in turns to put them out in the morning. We're normally the first ones there but if, occasionally, other horses go out before him now he's much better as long as he goes out when his buddies do. they are 4 of the 6 in their field and he can cope with those in a different field going out as they're not 'his' gang. Of course if he has to stay in for any reason, we have a bit of an issue - to the point that even though he always has the farrier at 8am, he goes out with the others at 6.30am and his owner has to then get him back in - this is acceptable to him :rolleyes:

ETA - It's only November now, she hasn't that long to settle. If you keep handling her consistently and calmly and establish a routine she might come round.
 

Summit

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Is there an option to let her have 24/7 TO or consider moving yards?

Doesn’t sound like fun riding her and you should be enjoying your horse considering how much time and money we give them. Maybe selling her is something to consider so that you both end up happy...no shame in that
 

ester

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I asked the rails/walls question as sometimes they can cause some odd reactions.
Have you spoken to the previous owner as to whether this is normal for her? Or how much of it is the stress of change - how long had she been in her previous home? was it similar to the current set up? Horses can be funny :p some are better in barns, some seem to prefer quiet corners instead. I agree with the above in that you haven't had her long. If you continue to struggle I would get someone who is good at behaviour stuff on board.
 

Ellzbellz97

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We have one on our yard who would climb over the door (literally) if he wasn't not first out in the morning. We solved it by organising a rota for turnout so 3 of us take it in turns to put them out in the morning. We're normally the first ones there but if, occasionally, other horses go out before him now he's much better as long as he goes out when his buddies do. they are 4 of the 6 in their field and he can cope with those in a different field going out as they're not 'his' gang. Of course if he has to stay in for any reason, we have a bit of an issue - to the point that even though he always has the farrier at 8am, he goes out with the others at 6.30am and his owner has to then get him back in - this is acceptable to him :rolleyes:

ETA - It's only November now, she hasn't that long to settle. If you keep handling her consistently and calmly and establish a routine she might come round.


Pretty much what she does!! I'm hoping she settles as she's fine out alone its just bringing in she will get so stress if no one else is in or she see's others going out
 

Ellzbellz97

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Is there an option to let her have 24/7 TO or consider moving yards?

Doesn’t sound like fun riding her and you should be enjoying your horse considering how much time and money we give them. Maybe selling her is something to consider so that you both end up happy...no shame in that


Yes she can be but turn out isn't that great plus I have to bring her in to tack up and she will stress at that as well. Thank you for your advice :)
 

Ellzbellz97

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I asked the rails/walls question as sometimes they can cause some odd reactions.
Have you spoken to the previous owner as to whether this is normal for her? Or how much of it is the stress of change - how long had she been in her previous home? was it similar to the current set up? Horses can be funny :p some are better in barns, some seem to prefer quiet corners instead. I agree with the above in that you haven't had her long. If you continue to struggle I would get someone who is good at behaviour stuff on board.


Got her off a dealer who only had her for a couple of weeks and she was fine there but I think its because she was constantly indoors with others. Thank you I have a behaviourist in mind if she doesn't improve
 

eggs

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You haven't had her long and she might settle but at 15 it is possible that this is ingrained behaviour. She certainly doesn't sound happy to be left in the barn on her own.

As a short term solution could you arrange a rota with one or two other owners so that you take it in turn to turn the horses out in the morning so she has some-one in the barn with her. What time do the earliest horses get turned out? If you could arrange a rota with one of those owners it might well help although I accept it doesn't completely resolve the issue.
 

Ellzbellz97

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You haven't had her long and she might settle but at 15 it is possible that this is ingrained behaviour. She certainly doesn't sound happy to be left in the barn on her own.

As a short term solution could you arrange a rota with one or two other owners so that you take it in turn to turn the horses out in the morning so she has some-one in the barn with her. What time do the earliest horses get turned out? If you could arrange a rota with one of those owners it might well help although I accept it doesn't completely resolve the issue.


Exactly what my instructor said age wise! Usually about 7-8am I usually go down at 6 to make sure shes out first as when one horse is put out that can set her off as well even if others are in. Thank you for your advice :)
 

Summit

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Exactly what my instructor said age wise! Usually about 7-8am I usually go down at 6 to make sure shes out first as when one horse is put out that can set her off as well even if others are in. Thank you for your advice :)

To have to be the first every day is very stressful for you :confused:
 

ceva

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Hello all,

September this year I brought a new mare she's a 15yo Tb x Trakenher. She settled in well when she was on 24/7 turn out and would stress when I brought her into the barn alone let you can leave her out alone fine. Now she's being brought in at night, she really stresses to the point where she reared up and collapsed on the floor from it and injured herself only minor luckily. She is fine when other horses are in but if they get turned out before her she really stresses and box walks, bangs the door etc which is making me have to get up at stupid times to turn her out before anyone else does as she stresses so much. If she stresses she is then naughty to ride spooking at everything, I had to get my instructor to come to me in the end as we wasn't going to be able to hack to hers as she was being silly. I currently have to tie her up so she can see other horses out in the field to tack up if no one else is in the barn, she's bruised me and reared up before and gave me a black eye... I have tried her on NAF Oestress and currently have a calmer tube I'm going to try. It's getting to the point now where OH and a few others have asked me if I have thought about selling her and getting something more sensible, I really don't know what to do as some days we have really good schooling sessions but other time's she's super stress and balshy. Can anyone recommend any calming supplements to help her or any other advice???

Thanks

Ellie
 

ceva

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Hi,
if there are a few of you at this yard, is there another horse that doesn't mind being in on its own that you can bring in with yours when you tack up and ride, then you can turn both out again when you have finished, I have to do that with my horse's companion as she won't stay in the field alone, but happy to stand in the barn while I am out riding then I turn both out when I get back problem solved.
 

tallyho!

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Aww poor girl. Do you know her history? Do you know if she's been through several homes? She may be feeling insecure and worried, possibly missing old friends and anxious to make new ones. It's interesting that in the field she seems to handle being alone ok, so far. Maybe she's never been taken/sold from a field but she has from a stable? A behaviourist is a good step - hopefully one that can take her pov into account and that can give you tools to help her become more confident.
 

Leo Walker

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Try a Valerian tincture, it's banned in competition for a reason (it works) and you can't compete her anyway like this anyway, perhaps she can relearn to cope with it's help then wean her off later.

Be careful with valerian. It definitely has a sedative effect but that means they dont learn while under its influence.
 

ihatework

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Be careful with valerian. It definitely has a sedative effect but that means they dont learn while under its influence.

They learn perfectly well, it’s not exactly hard drugs.

And in fact it is a very good suggestion, might help take the edge off while getting into a routine.

Ultimately you are going to have to try and reach a point where you don’t pander to her to the extent you are there at 6am before everyone else. That’s not fun and not sustainable. Hopefully it’s just a few quick moves and she is feeling anxious, but at 15 it might be trickier to crack.
 

YorksG

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Be careful with valerian. It definitely has a sedative effect but that means they dont learn while under its influence.
I have fed valerian as dried herb to a mare who was Very reactive, having read an interesting article about how different "types" of horses react to different herbs. Interestingly she ate it with gusto to begin with, but then got so that she really didn't like it, I stopped feeding her it then, the article suggested that the micro nutrients "reset" the horses reactions, now I accept that may be codswallop, but the article suggested only feeding for a few weeks, which is the length of time it took my mare to decide that she wouldn't eat any more of it :) It appeared to give her time to think about what she was doing and not over react and she became more receptive to learning as a result of it
 

Ellzbellz97

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Aww poor girl. Do you know her history? Do you know if she's been through several homes? She may be feeling insecure and worried, possibly missing old friends and anxious to make new ones. It's interesting that in the field she seems to handle being alone ok, so far. Maybe she's never been taken/sold from a field but she has from a stable? A behaviourist is a good step - hopefully one that can take her pov into account and that can give you tools to help her become more confident.

Unfortunately not :( I brought her from a dealer who only had her for 3 weeks, in her passport she's had 2 homes from before me one of which was for 10 years
 

Leo Walker

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They learn perfectly well, it’s not exactly hard drugs.

And in fact it is a very good suggestion, might help take the edge off while getting into a routine.

I've never used it on a horse, but that's the advice I was given by a behaviourist who was very strongly against its use in a situation where you need to retrain reactions.
 

Horsekaren

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I went to a yard recently and possibly heard the most lovely words ive ever heard on any DIY yard "you get to know which horses can be left alone and the ones that cant, we work things around this"

I think some horses just hate being alone, whether it can be truly trained out of them i'm unsure. When i got my 15.2 cool as a cucumber cob i was so shocked when he lept over his stable door as two horses left the yard to go on a hack, this was a one off due to fear i believe.
I was always a bit concerned about him being in alone but i just try and make it a happy place for him, adlib hay, munch blocks, i often sit outside his stable so he can pop his head out and see me. He is so chilled now i know he can be left as he knows its a safe place.

I think some horses cant shout as loud as others (ie a 13.2 pony in alone box walking and calling isnt as scary as a horse rearing and falling down) If her reaction is always that extreme after more time to settle i would think she is one of those that needs company, she may get over it with time.

Is there a stable where she can see less of the comings and goings?
 

Horsekaren

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I've never used it on a horse, but that's the advice I was given by a behaviorist who was very strongly against its use in a situation where you need to retrain reactions.
I used it earlier in the year, the herb form that you add hot water to, my horse was sleep deprived so i tried it, true i did catch him flat out like a pancake that night for 15 mins but when i boiled it myself and my husband got the worst headaches just from the smell alone. It was like taking a sleeping tablet but then not being able to sleep, made me feel so groggy. I stopped using it in case that was how it was making my horse feel.
 

Ellzbellz97

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I went to a yard recently and possibly heard the most lovely words ive ever heard on any DIY yard "you get to know which horses can be left alone and the ones that cant, we work things around this"

I think some horses just hate being alone, whether it can be truly trained out of them i'm unsure. When i got my 15.2 cool as a cucumber cob i was so shocked when he lept over his stable door as two horses left the yard to go on a hack, this was a one off due to fear i believe.
I was always a bit concerned about him being in alone but i just try and make it a happy place for him, adlib hay, munch blocks, i often sit outside his stable so he can pop his head out and see me. He is so chilled now i know he can be left as he knows its a safe place.

I think some horses cant shout as loud as others (ie a 13.2 pony in alone box walking and calling isnt as scary as a horse rearing and falling down) If her reaction is always that extreme after more time to settle i would think she is one of those that needs company, she may get over it with time.

Is there a stable where she can see less of the comings and goings?


Thanks for your advice, as it goes for stables where she cannot see ones coming and going we don't have that unfortunately but its also bringing in alone even without seeing others will set her off too :/ I've tried salt licks etc but so far no luck
 

Horsekaren

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Thanks for your advice, as it goes for stables where she cannot see ones coming and going we don't have that unfortunately but its also bringing in alone even without seeing others will set her off too :/ I've tried salt licks etc but so far no luck
Must be connected to leaving the herd, i would defo get a behaviorist out and in the meantime just keep practicing taking her out of the field, walking a bit each time then giving her a treat. Once she has had the treat and is standing calmly i would then return her to the field. I wouldn't bother trying to get to the stable if its that bad, sounds like she just needs to realize she isn't going to die when leaving the herd, even if it is just a few meters to start and then gradually get further. I guess that is easy to do if you have all the time in the world and don't need to be anywhere else :p
 

tallyho!

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Unfortunately not :( I brought her from a dealer who only had her for 3 weeks, in her passport she's had 2 homes from before me one of which was for 10 years

I suppose you can understand why she’s behaving that way. It sounds like she’s landed on her feet with you, at least you’re willing to give her a chance and find out how to help her. So many people treat horses like machines, like they should automatically be perfect when in fact they feel things like we do. From being in a stable home for 10 years then, moved about a bit, it’s little wonder she’s anxious. You may just have to continue building her confidence for a while and let her be confident in you. It’s hard work but she will settle once she knows there’s a routine she can rely on. I always find it funny how horses cling to routines but I guess this is the comfort we can offer them when we can’t offer the stability of a herd life.

Obviously some horses cope well with change, and I had one like that... took everything in his stride. Nothing bothered him as long as there was food. Not my mare. She notices everything and is always ready to question it.
 

Polos Mum

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If you have the previous owners details in her passport I would be really tempted to write to them. If they had her 10 years then they probably won't begrudge spending 15 minutes on the phone with you talking about how they managed her for most of her life.
If she's always needed company then you need to change yards / set up so you can give her that or
If this is something new you can persist in working through it with calmers/ behaviour ists etc.
 

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Must be connected to leaving the herd, i would defo get a behaviorist out and in the meantime just keep practicing taking her out of the field, walking a bit each time then giving her a treat. Once she has had the treat and is standing calmly i would then return her to the field. I wouldn't bother trying to get to the stable if its that bad, sounds like she just needs to realize she isn't going to die when leaving the herd, even if it is just a few meters to start and then gradually get further. I guess that is easy to do if you have all the time in the world and don't need to be anywhere else :p


Excellent advice!
Baby steps:)
 
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