Advice Needed

[LauraBR]

If my new horse is stressed he tends to nod his head, throwing it up and down over and over. If other horses get turned out before him he stands nodding until I get there.

My yard is v strict re vices and other liveries are very quick to complain about any undesirable behaviour. Someone had a go at me about the nodding the other day as other horses have been seen to nod at breakfast time too. Told weave bars were going up and if that didn't stop him who knows what could be done next (kind of implying we would be shot off yard).

Went to see YO about it, she wasn't concerned, said as long as he didn't weave (he doesn't weave) then other liveries would have to put up with it.

Anyway, I'm the kind of person who likes the easy life... don't want to dread getting up to the yard every morning just in case someone bites my head off. So, I have been getting up earlier to make sure I'm at the yard first to get him turned out. This then means I end up in work for 7:30am which isn't ideal (yard is on my way to work) as I'm working an extra hour every day.

Saw car of major complainer had got there before me this morning, my heart sank. Sure enough he was stood nodding away. I can't get up at stupid o'clock every single day to keep these people happy

.

His breakfast keeps him occupied for a while in the moning- can anyone suggest anything else I could leave for people to stick in his stable to occupy him in case I'm not there first?

Really don't want to move yards.

 

[Judie]

What are people like for goodness sake? Have you tried leaving him a feed ball, you put nuts in it and he has to roll it round to get them out, keeps my chap happy as Larry, it can be used on shavings or straw? Maybe leave him some hay?

Can't really see the problem with nodding heads but it is awful when other liveries make you feel uncomfortable, but the YO has the right idea.

 

[LauraBR]

You know what, I have a feed ball actually, will give it a go- great idea!

He has ad lib haylege so always has some left over in the morning. I guess I could limit the amount he gets so that he's hungry enough to busy himself eating haylege in the morning but I don't think he is going to be the easiest to keep weight on over winter so reluctant to cut back on overnight stuff.

His nodding can be bad when he's in full swing and I accept it is annoying but it's only at certain times... my heart was in my mouth when I saw a few others nodding this morning, couldn't get him out and get myself the hell out of there quick enough!!!!!

 

[Weezy]

If the other liveries are SO annoyed about it then why dont they turn him out for you? Or could you ask YO to turn out for you at the crack of dawn?

 

[guisbrogal]

That is an awful way to have to keep your horse and to have to go to work on a morning feeling that wound up

I would definitely try the feedball thing or as Weezy has suggested get one of the other liveries to turn him out for you. It is ridiculous though....I didn't think there was any proof that horses pick up vices from other horses.

If they complain again just say you have had a word with the YO and she said it was not a problem.

To be honest if they are going to make you feel bad about your horse and cause you to have to get up at the crack of dawn to avoid people, then I wouldn't want to be there any way.

Silly people

 

[threeponies]

I'd hardly say nodding his head was a vice, some people need to get out more!

 

[JAK]

I have every sympathy for you here lzt, as CB's head nodding nearly got him sent back when he first arrived, as it was so violent under saddle, I actually wondered if he was a headshaker! (Child could barely stay in saddle, the movement was so violent!)
After much observation, I realised he only did when under 'stress', e.g. when asked to do things or put in a situation that worried him! As this involved rather a lot of things, he did it rather a lot of the time!

Anyway, as to your lad - could you fill a Snak-a-Ball the night before (a few low calorie pony nuts is all that's needed!) & ask them to pop it in his stable in the morning to keep him occupied?
Please don't let them put up anti-weave bars, it won't help with the 'up & down' movement & may just stress him out even more!
Head-nodding at times of stress etc. means the owner needs to be calm & reassuringly confident in the situations that set the horse off, so turning up at the yard all stressed out & worried will only make it worse, so try & not let it get to you quite so much! (Your YO doesn't seem overly bothered after all!)


CB mainly only head nods now if he meets something really scary out hacking, or is left tied up alone for longer than he can cope with without MD being there, or if his routine is altered drastically!
He can however now cope with schooling challenges & has successfully attended a couple of local shows, restricting his head-noddiing to 'gentle bobbing', which diminished with every subsequent class he went in! (He was well placed in all of them & even coped with a 'ride judge', which certainly confused him but he dealt with it!)

The above all sounds pretty awful but initially, he couldn't be left at all, was very difficult to hack out (considered only borderline 'safe' to do so!) & couldn't cope in the school at all!
He has since learnt to do a proper half-halt, done everything it is possible to do with cones, been ridden in draw reins etc. & has coped marvellously with it all, so there is hope that it will improve, given time, sympathetic handling & careful management!
The co-operation of fellow liveries would be of enormous benefit here, if only to put you in a better state of mind about it all, so perhaps you could appeal to their better natures?

Certainly, having seen the effect on CB, I would potentially consider head-nodding to come under the category of a 'vice' & the effect it can have on a horse can be quite devastating! It is however, a 'vice' that can be improved upon, though it is something the horse will often resort to again in times of stress, so your best plan of action is to 'take the stress away' wherever possible!

It is all still new & a bit scary for him remember, so if you don't think his current environment is going to be condusive to a relaxing lifestyle for both of you, the time to consider moving is now!
As for affecting the other liveries, unless you have seen it for yourself, i would say 'b*llox' to any such claims by your fellow liveries!
CB has never set any other horse off head-nodding & on our yard, we have not only the world's worst crib-biter but the world's worst weaver - no other horse has 'copied' either habit & the only 'vice' I have ever known to be truly infectious is the dreaded door-kicking!

Best of luck!

 

[Cobnut1]

Could YO not put him out for you? Is it a DIY yard?

Or perhaps another livery could put him out when they put theirs out, and you do something in return for them?

Weaving isn't that bad..!! we have a weaver on our yard, and it hasn't caused any other horse to start weaving!!

Don't be bullied by these people.

 

[LauraBR]

You make a very good point about my state of mind affecting him Jak- quite true.

It is definitely a stress thing and me feeling wound up will affect him. Have also noticed he is worse when a certain complainer gets there first- I do wonder whether she shouts at him for it but that little theory isn't based on anything...

and I'm quite sure if she was she wouldn't do it in front of me.

 

[JAK]

[ QUOTE ]
Have also noticed he is worse when a certain complainer gets there first- I do wonder whether she shouts at him for it but that little theory isn't based on anything...

and I'm quite sure if she was she wouldn't do it in front of me.

[/ QUOTE ]
Hhmm, yes, bit obvious that! This definitely needs to be knocked on the head - could you try roping her in to give him his Snak-a-Ball maybe, as it is difficult to sort the problem out if the stressful situation is still ongoing!
Maybe ask for her 'help' in improving the behaviour? (Most people are nosey, vain & interfering & cannot resist reacting positively to people asking for their advice or help - psychological warfare is often a very powerful weapon! lol)

Do you remember a while back i posted that CB stamped a lot when the farrier came, as he was a bit sharp with him, pouncing on him for every small movement etc.?
Well, I have purposely been engaging the farrier in conversations on how good CB is being & how insecure etc. he is & the last time he was shod, he was much better - he had his likit to occupy him & the 'good vibes' produced a calmer horse & a calmer atmosphere all round!

Also (& you know I have great respect for the way you treat your horses etc.!), have you considered the possibility that the problem could actually be down to you?
That it is you who are struggling to find your place on the new yard etc. & that the head-nodding in front of the other liveries who arrive first, is at least partly in anticipation of 'stressed out mummy' appearing? LOL
If MD flaps or gets stressed, CB starts panicking almost immediately, as he is such a wet drip, he just can't cope! (Not that I'm calling your neddy a 'wet drip' you understand!)

 

[LauraBR]

Certainly would not rule out it being me... if only horses could talk.

 

[Iestyn]

Sorry lzt but these people need to get a grip. I appreciate you saying that you're one for an easier life but I would just ignore it - horses are going to be horses and people have got to accept that they are not going to have a yard full of perfect horses! I would just ignore it - if the YO says she's not worried then leave it at that. If these people then go to her to complain then hopefully YO will tell them exactly what she's said to you. If they have another go at you just politely apologise and say there is nothing you can really do about it and explain that it is upsetting you being got at like that. Chin up hun

 

[malibu211211]

Hi,
My boy does that too especially at feed time (sometimes I wonder whether his head is still gonna be attached when I get back with his feed

)
My friends horse is directly opposite mine and she has'nt started doing it. You should be pleased that the other horses want to be like your boy

If the yard owner is'nt bothered then I would politely say to them that if it is bothering them that much to turn him out or not look at him.
You could always get someone to drop an apple in his water bucket too to keep him occupied.
Sorry if I'm not much help but people like that really annoy me

Poor boy is'nt doing anything wrong, at least he is'nt lungeing over the door trying to take a chunk out of their arm

Your boy is lovely, by the way.
Mali xx

 

[WishfulThinker]

Mine nods his head to when he gets excited!! Or over eager - I just equate it to like a little kid jumpin gup and down in excitement to do something!! He's just going "me me, what about me????????" I just ignore mine and he would stop it after a few mins. Some people would try and stop him by like putting there hand on his nose etc, and they would usually end up getting nibbled as he would tink they were food!

Ignore them! And if he gets worse ask that complainer to not go near him or react to him as she could very well be makin ghim worse

 

[AmyMay]

Just out of interest - what time do the first people arrive at your yard? Whilst I totally agree with others about over-reacting owners, it may well be that you will have to get there at stupid o'clock if it's going to help your boy deal with his stress.

Not in any shape having a go - and I would feel equally concerned in your position - but if your boy is exhibiting signs of distress then you will have to manage it at some level.

Freddy was a very stressy horse -and when I took him over ensured that I mainted a really regular management of him, which helped enormously.

 

[LauraBR]

I'm doing my best to do right by him, if I have implied that I wasn't trying to manage it for his benefit then I have not explained myself properly.

Right now I arrive at the yard at 7am and he's either just finishing off his breakfast or I'm first there and feed them all. Got there extra early this morning and managed to spend nice half hour with him- only problem was I was so tired after work I couldn't summon the energy to ride! I have a demanding job too which doesn't help.

Happy to be there for 7am to get him turned out before others get there but getting up at 5am to get there first over winter I would struggle with- not the getting up but the doing full day at work too! Don't think I could cope.

 

[Tia]

You took the words right out of my mouth Weezy.

 

[LauraBR]

Sadly other liveries won't turn out (well, thats not true actually- most liveries would help me out but not the ones who roll up at 6-6:30am) and YO won't turn out until much later.

 

[vicijp]

Send the whingers to me, I have 3 weavers out of 6 at the mo. Ill chain them up in the yard and watch them go slowly mental!
*I wish to add that although yes, I did breed one of said weavers, he has greatly improved from his younger days when he used to box canter also. The other 2 have been with me for a couple of weeks nopne have shown any sign of 'teaching' others to do it.*