Advice pleasRe horse not as it said on passport. Brightwells replied

soulfull

soulfull

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I had a call from them today saying that I have the right to return the horse because of the fact he is not what was stated they have informed the vendor that if I wish they have to collect the horse. However if the vendor is prepared to negotiate on price then I am prepared to keep him as he is a lovely horse.

I originally paid £2100 as it stated he was king of diamonds (there is a TB with same name) However he isn't even by the TB one

My question is how much should I offer for a 16.2h 6yr old ex race horse who raced 19 times. last raced 2 yrs ago but no idea what he has been doing since. Lovely laid back temperament. hacks alone not at all spooky.

I have had his teeth done, and the chiro says he has fallen on his tummy at some point and needs some work, but will be ok


how much do I realistically offer?? (bearing in mind I would like to keep him if reasonable)
 
I have bought lots of ex racers.

He would be worth between £500 and £1000 at Doncaster and he might have been lucky to get a bid at all with winter just starting. £500 is their minimum bid. If you really like him, he's worth £1000.
The fact that he raced nineteen times is against him, as would be when he started - if he raced at two it really knocks down his value.

Well done in following it up. Can you possibly find out how much they paid for him - he will probably have been bought from a bloodstock auction, either Ascot or Doncaster?

Good luck.
 
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Did you buy the horse because of its breeding or because you liked it?

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Sorry Sally your question is not relevant unless the buyer has more money than sense. They have been the victim of a fraud. Surely you wouldn't want the seller to profit from that? To protect future buyers, this needs to be put right. As for the buyer, there are a thousand ex racers out there for a quarter of the price she was duped into buying by a fraudulent sale description.
 
Another point. If they have had him since he finished racing, but decided to sell him at auction rather than privately, then it is EXTREMELY likely that there is something wrong with him. I would have a 2* vet before you decide whether to keep him at all.

If you have had him less than 2 weeks get a blood test for anti-inflammatories too.

If you can find that he was sold to the seller at auction recentely, then he's worth a risk if you like him and can find nothing wrong with him.
 
I would think around £1,000 at most. If you buy it, it will save the vendors lots of money in time and hassle.

What if you HAD bought it because of its supposed breeding? How many people do check up like you do?
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Did you buy the horse because of its breeding or because you liked it?

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry Sally your question is not relevant unless the buyer has more money than sense. They have been the victim of a fraud. Surely you wouldn't want the seller to profit from that? To protect future buyers, this needs to be put right. As for the buyer, there are a thousand ex racers out there for a quarter of the price she was duped into buying by a fraudulent sale description.

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You're of course right. I have just read the whole of the previous thread - so understand more now about the situation.
 
My head says if they have deliberately changed/ hidden his identity they have something to hide and I would not touch with a bargepole. Of course now you have him your heart may say something different! I would get a 5 stage vetting with a vet you trust and get an honest opinion.

Also VERY relevant is whether he raced as a 2 year old. My first TB did. Raced before his 2nd birthday so god knows how old he was when he was broken. From the age of 12 he suffered terribly with his joints and had to retire from all competition the following year. He had to stop riding at all a couple of years later as he could not stop tripping
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frown.gif

I had to watch the most lovely horse let down by his legs and finally at 19 we had to have the decision to PTS. My vet said undoubtedly this was a result of his early racing. His heart and other vitals were so strong he could have gone on for many years otherwise.

If you do still want him I would say £1000 in current climate
 
Passporting is a tricky one - I know dealers who seem to be very gung ho about which passports go out to which horse - and just a quick question - are you 100% sure that you do now have the right passport for your TB? I didnt' think from your commentary earlier that the breeding was important but presume you thought you were buying a horse who was unraced?

If you are thinking of keeping him, I would definately go for the 5 X vettting and bloods but listen to the voice of caution from earlier messages - 19 is a lot of races ..
 
You may want to delete this thread as leaving it could predjudice any legal proceedings.

It does sound like deliberate fraud as an ex racer sells for much less than a young IDx.

Questions to ask are when was he repassported & who by when he is microchipped?

Sue
 
Depends on how attached you are to him but if he went to auction I'd agree that there is probably something wrong.

My yard is full of ex racers and they've all been gifted at that age!
 
[ QUOTE ]
You may want to delete this thread as leaving it could predjudice any legal proceedings.

It does sound like deliberate fraud as an ex racer sells for much less than a young IDx.

Questions to ask are when was he repassported & who by when he is microchipped?

Sue

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Please do not delete this post, people are learning a great deal from your experience. There will be no legal proceedings. The terms of an auction of Brightwell's calibre are clear and that is why it costs so much to sell through them, and horses that are sold through them cost more money to buy. It's not your local meat market type sale.

Brightwells terms will be that if they tell the seller to pick the horse up, they must pick the horse up. If they don't, they won't get paid by Brightwells anyway, so they will have lost the horse completely and be banned from future sales. They'll pick it up!

Brightwells will make sure this does not get to a court action, their whole reputation is at stake.
 
I am interested to know how this happened in the first place. Surely Brightwell's vets scan the microchip of all Ex-Racers at the sale to check their identity. Why did the miss match not show up then?
If you want to keep the horse offer £500 but be prepared to go to £800.
I got caught once at Ascot. I bought an undeclared windsucker. But as I had only payed £800 and she looked like a horse worth much more than that, I kept her anyway.
 
As I understand it Brightwells do not routinely scan for microchips.

My friend bought a horse through Brightwells 18 months ago. She bought him as a hunter and was told that he was ID.

When she came to sell him on about a year later (she advertised him as Irish), the sale-vetting scanned him for a chip and it turned out that he was a European warmblood and not Irish so the sale fell through.
 
Auctions drive me mad. I don't know of a single one that scans for chips. How can we stop our horses being stolen if they can still be sold at cash auctions with no chip scan?

Do you know, if the horse concerned here had sold successfully for £2100, then Brightwells will have earned £105 in commission on the hammer price, plus another £60 whack for entering it in the sale in the first place plus a "sales levy" of over £18 and on top of that, the money from making buyers buy a catalog to find out what they are bidding for? All that money, and no guarantee they have made even the most basic check that the horse offered for sale is the one in the passport!

And they are the BETTER end of the horse auction world!
 
Surely scanning for microchips should be made complusory.

OP I would make complaints to DEFRA about breaches of the passport rules, and write to you MP as well, maybe contact horsewatch. Sales should be forced to check for microchips to prevent crime.
 
For goodness sake!
If an auction company as big as Brightwells don't bother to scan all horses for chips, what is the point of having them?

I hope H&H are reading this thread. After the "stolen foal" business, allegations of cruelty at Fayre Oaks and some questions over a number of horses presented at Ascot this week, I think maybe Brightwells need to look at the way they manage horses/ponies at their auctions.
 
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