Aggressive Dogs

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CanadianGirl

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Today while I was out on a hack with my friend a dog broke his leash and started to lunge and nip and my friend's horses feet. Her horse was being very well behaved and was mostly just warning the dog by picking up her back feet ad half-heartedly 'kicking'. The hustband (one of the owners of the dog) was running around ineffectively attempting to catch the dog, but doing a very poor dog, while the wife was standing next to me trying to call the dog off. I told the wife that the dog was going to be kicked if they didn't get control of it and she replied, "maybe he needs to be kicked". I told her that if the dog got kicked it would die. This seemed to go on forever until we asked a passerby to help. As we were going home we wondered what is the best thing to do in this kind of a situation? Keep moving on the horses or stay put?
 
definitely stay put

if you move the dog will escalate the situation and you will either be on a bolting horse
or sitting the biggest bucks eve,r as your horse attempts to defend itself with its back legs

i try to face the dog in this situation
establish direct eye contact with it, which is a signal of dominance
growl at it

and above all STAY CALM (not easy)

in the specific situation you describe i often advise (:rolleyes:) the owners to run AWAY from the horse
if they have any bond with the dog at all (big if - i know!)
the dog will follow them to maintain the 'pack'
 
We come across this sometimes and we always calmly keep walking, you'd be surprised how often the dog goes off the idea, and I'm certainly not standing around waiting for my horse to be bitten!

I've found giving the dog a whack with my whip (whether I come close to reaching it or not!) helps the owners find that little bit of incentive to call the damn thing off!! I don't care if your dog is good with horses, if it is running around their legs then it isn't good with horses, and what on earth makes you think 1/2 a tonne of prey animal is going to be cool with a yapping barking dog round its heels?

Mad people out there!
 
Agree with The pony, sometimes moving off slowly removes the problem, the dog is usually worse when it's around it's owner as it sees the horse as a threat to them and protects them, once the 'threat' moves off they return to the owner. Of course every situation is different, and it all depends on the reason for the dog displaying the behaviour, what works for one situation, may not for another.
 
"i try to face the dog in this situation
establish direct eye contact with it, which is a signal of dominance
growl at it"

I can't help but feel that this is not a wise decision, if the dog decides to lunge then your horse is in the way.
 
I have had a number of issues with loose dogs. My first horse was received a nasty bite from a Staffy that attacked him over waste ground many years ago, my horse eventually kicked at the dog and it received a broken jaw/teeth. I reported it and the police told me to ring 999 if i saw the dog again in public. Some years later with a different horse my present horse was worried by the same dog on three separate occasions whilst riding over riding club grounds. It was reported to the office on each occasion but nothing of any value was done and it has been seen since worrying yet another rider. This dog was extremely aggressive and the worry was that a horse would bolt onto the main road from the gate that was left broken and not fixed to the boundary of the field. My horse stood his ground each time, on the second 'attack' the dog came back for a third try!

Even more recently the same horse has been worried by a gang of dogs, this is almost more than this poor horse can take and he must be feeling pretty desperate by now, my only hope is that if he sees the dogs on a hack again he will kick out and cave their heads in. I feel desperately sad for him but have not much sympathy for the dogs in question although I am an animal lover. If its my horse or their dog then I would rather its their dog.

Dog owners are mostly responsible but out of control dogs are highly dangerous and their owners are irresponsible to let their dogs aggression escalate to such levels. As was the case with the dog at the riding club, the owner had rescued it from a labrador rescue centre and didn't want to shout at it, or smack it as 'it must have had a terrible life prior to that'. Lets hope this misguided owner never had foster kids eh? Or they will be allowed to run riot too with the excuse that they can't be shouted at or disciplined because of their 'prior life'. Silly, silly people.
 
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First thing I say to people if they have no intention of leashing the dog is say , if he gets close he is likely to get kicked, so I have warned them



I had many accounts like this.


One time a friend and I were walking down a track this dog walker made no attempt to put dog on lead. When we got to the wides part we moved away to the side and gave them the wide birth. The dog still off the lead came over started sniffing my horses feet she in turn lashed out and the dog did somersaults the owner just grabbed the dog said nothing and moved a way.


Next time on holiday in newforest was hacking with a friend , i told her dont let the dog behind her she hates dogs. Yes you guessed it the dog went behind and got kicked.

Many times I say if you dont get your dog it will get kicked. I get back * it better* not i say *well control it then*.


Now I always warn people watch your dog or it will get kicked , this way I have warned them so if it happens its their fault.


In your case OP you did the right thing stay put, stay on board. If how ever the dog is actually biting the horse , has hold of flesh then i would either spin the horse round to reduce the grip. Depends on what type of dog it was really small yappy dog I would get off grab it myself

I general keep walking as i normally have my dog too so they get distracted on him. i have lashed out with my whip at the dog many times in the past and turn round and face dog.
 
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CanadianGirl said:
Today while I was out on a hack with my friend a dog broke his leash and started to lunge and nip and my friend's horses feet. Her horse was being very well behaved and was mostly just warning the dog by picking up her back feet ad half-heartedly 'kicking'. The hustband (one of the owners of the dog) was running around ineffectively attempting to catch the dog, but doing a very poor dog, while the wife was standing next to me trying to call the dog off. I told the wife that the dog was going to be kicked if they didn't get control of it and she replied, "maybe he needs to be kicked". I told her that if the dog got kicked it would die. This seemed to go on forever until we asked a passerby to help. As we were going home we wondered what is the best thing to do in this kind of a situation? Keep moving on the horses or stay put?
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I though the Americans/ Canadians call it trail riding?? :confused:

Hack is an English word :D Just asking
 
As a rider and dog owner I always stood my horses still however as I now hack out with my Stafford bitch I now keep walking on. I do tell the owner that the,horse will lash out at strange dogs but tbh, while I meet a lot of dog walkers I very rarely have this problem. I did have to shout at my dog yesterday who wasn't paying full attention when we passed some other horses as she started to follow them!

The breed of dog is completely irrelevant. It's the lack of training which causes the problem. We have a lovely well trained lab at our yard, and the worst dog I met on a hack was a lab. The most nutty are springers on full hype alert.... I never assume that the dog ahead is good with horses and call my dog in.
 
Do report the attack on the BHS accideint reporting website. They are trying to gather information on the range of hazards faced by riders including attacks by dogs. (For some reaosn the first time I typed that it came up as "Gods". I wonder what the BHS might be able to do about attacks from a vengeful deity! LOL)

Anyway - the more data they have the more likely something can be done. I know this was more of a near miss - but report it anyway!

The webiste is here http://www.horseaccidents.org.uk/
 
labruyere said:
definitely stay put

if you move the dog will escalate the situation and you will either be on a bolting horse
or sitting the biggest bucks eve,r as your horse attempts to defend itself with its back legs

i try to face the dog in this situation
establish direct eye contact with it, which is a signal of dominance
growl at it

and above all STAY CALM (not easy)

in the specific situation you describe i often advise (:rolleyes:) the owners to run AWAY from the horse
if they have any bond with the dog at all (big if - i know!)
the dog will follow them to maintain the 'pack'
Click to expand...

This.

If the owner starts shouting and trying to catch the dog, there is a good chance it will interpret that as the owner joining in on the attack on the horse. Bad psychology.

The owner should give a "play call" (the sort of call they might use to encourage the dog to -- for example -- chase a ball), try to get the dog's attention, and run away from the horse. The owner should give lots of encouragement to follow, definitely not threats.

Anyone on here hunted hounds? The huntsman is always the "good guy" and the whipper-in does just that, whips in! Chastised hounds run back to daddy! Similar psychology should be employed here, the only difference being that the huntsman can control 40 or so hounds while the average owner can't control one!
 
Dry Rot said:
This.

If the owner starts shouting and trying to catch the dog, there is a good chance it will interpret that as the owner joining in on the attack on the horse. Bad psychology.

The owner should give a "play call" (the sort of call they might use to encourage the dog to -- for example -- chase a ball), try to get the dog's attention, and run away from the horse. The owner should give lots of encouragement to follow, definitely not threats.

Anyone on here hunted hounds? The huntsman is always the "good guy" and the whipper-in does just that, whips in! Chastised hounds run back to daddy! Similar psychology should be employed here, the only difference being that the huntsman can control 40 or so hounds while the average owner can't control one!
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Good enough for me. Most dogs with any sense won't take on a full grown horse standing up to them - they might nip or lunge at one running away though.

Running away from your out of control dog is so hard to do, though as it does tend to make you look like a lunatic to the ill-educated in dog behaviour :cool:
 
Personally I tend to send my horse after aggressive dogs to drive it back to its owners, the paths where I ride are narrow and it is easy to send a dog running by trotting at it.

In the field my horses will lash out at dogs with the front end (I don't invite dogs into the field any that have come in have pushed through the hedge and are not meant to be there) so I don't like to allow dogs to get around their back end.
 
This is all very useful -hope I never have to defend myself against a dog on the attack but at least I have some idea's now as to the approach to take.

At least the owners here hadn't deliberately let / left the dog off the lead. It sounds like they were being responsible it was just that the lead snapped. I'd like to think that they were horrified at how their dog was behaving and just didn't know what to do in the circumstances.
 
Iv never actually come across a dog that actually attempted to nip/bite the horse iv been on so cant really comment as far as this is concerned.

BUT

When out riding through the woods I often come across dogs off leads and 8/10 the owner actually grabs the thing and puts the lead on it and stands out the way. But then I have been very surprised at the number of people who know their dog will come running up and do nothing to prevent it! I stand still nice and calm, talk to the horse and reassure him he is doing well and stare at the owner. Because iv found that carrying on past the dog then means its chase time and they get very excited/aggrivated and then the horse gets a bit skitty, so i find its better to just stop and wait for the owners to do something about their dog.

Some peoples dog just give a wide berth and stay calm which is great but then iv had others when the owners have dragged the dog a fair way away and then let them off the lead they come tear arsing back towards me woofing!

Fortunately the horse i ride is generally very good and not easily spooked so we do well as a team. But i have a fairly long whip so if a dog was to physically attempt to nip/bite i would give the thing a good whack.
 
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My girl has been attacked twice when we've been out.

First, walking down a wide track with a friend, we went single file to pass man with GSD who had hold of it. As I (in lead) went past he let go, & dog went in at my girls front legs from the side, she span, & lost her rear end down a ditch. Somehow she stayed upright, & my friend on her sec D drove dog off. Owner ran off yelling that we'd 'frightened him'. We got dogs name, put up posters in woods & local shops with description of man & dog to warn other riders. Never saw him again in very small woodland.

Second, I'd got off to adjust execise rug which was slipping. Saw 2 people with 2 GSD on leads at top of knoll. Went to mount, next thing I know horse taking off with my foot caught in stirrup. Managed to keep hold of reins & she stopped. I was winded on floor, couple walked by. Bloke apologised, woman said not to apologise its 'what dogs do' (I'm still winded on floor at this point, no-one asked if I was okay). Got myself back together, calmed horse, got on. Was planning on going down narrow track where they went anyway. So I set off in canter. Couple last seen grabbing dogs & jumping into prickly hedge. As went past said 'that's what horses do'.
 
pip6 said:
Second, I'd got off to adjust execise rug which was slipping. Saw 2 people with 2 GSD on leads at top of knoll. Went to mount, next thing I know horse taking off with my foot caught in stirrup. Managed to keep hold of reins & she stopped. I was winded on floor, couple walked by. Bloke apologised, woman said not to apologise its 'what dogs do' (I'm still winded on floor at this point, no-one asked if I was okay). Got myself back together, calmed horse, got on. Was planning on going down narrow track where they went anyway. So I set off in canter. Couple last seen grabbing dogs & jumping into prickly hedge. As went past said 'that's what horses do'.
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:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D
 
My main strategies are 1) warn owner that my horse may kick and kill their dog, so please get it on a lead (ssh though, she actually likes dogs) 2) Tell owner to run in the opposite direction calling dog 3) Attempt to whack dog with the whip if they get close 4) Trot menacingly at dog, growling and waving whip around. However, this only works for dogs who are not socialised with horses and are more excited than actually trying to attack. If it was some massive killer type dog, hell bent on actually harming us I may change tactic. To what, I'm not sure... I always carry my phone and would be prepared to film nuisance dogs/ owners as evidence.
 
I always show new animals as many different senarios as possible.
I only discovered my boy didn't like dogs when he threw a terrier across the field, followed by cornering our old very aggressive gsd, who didn't attack.
Our new gsd bitch was taken to meet cows over a fence, ponies and sheep in a field, even meeting the hens she was leashed until she was calm.
I would be tempted to get off, until the dog was under control, because it would be me kicking the dog since my lad has been taught not to attack dogs
 
pip6 said:
My girl has been attacked twice when we've been out.

First, walking down a wide track with a friend, we went single file to pass man with GSD who had hold of it. As I (in lead) went past he let go, & dog went in at my girls front legs from the side, she span, & lost her rear end down a ditch. Somehow she stayed upright, & my friend on her sec D drove dog off. Owner ran off yelling that we'd 'frightened him'. We got dogs name, put up posters in woods & local shops with description of man & dog to warn other riders. Never saw him again in very small woodland.

Second, I'd got off to adjust execise rug which was slipping. Saw 2 people with 2 GSD on leads at top of knoll. Went to mount, next thing I know horse taking off with my foot caught in stirrup. Managed to keep hold of reins & she stopped. I was winded on floor, couple walked by. Bloke apologised, woman said not to apologise its 'what dogs do' (I'm still winded on floor at this point, no-one asked if I was okay). Got myself back together, calmed horse, got on. Was planning on going down narrow track where they went anyway. So I set off in canter. Couple last seen grabbing dogs & jumping into prickly hedge. As went past said 'that's what horses do'.
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Liked this one, well done, horse 1, dogs 0 !
Oz :)
 
Over excited & disobedient dogs I get the owner to walk away & call them.
Mine was severely attacked by a pit bull many years ago, so my tactic now with aggressive dogs is to run at them. They will always flee. If you don't believe me do some research into how wolf packs hunt to see where the idea comes from. That said, very few dogs are truly aggressive.
As for whether to stand the horse or walk on in the case of a playful dog, it depends on the horse. Usually I'd stand, but with a highly strung youngster etc I'd walk on to avoid it getting silly. If the owner can't catch the dog, often just walking or trotting towards it scares it off.
And lol at pip, I used to meet the owner of a badly trained young dog who never made any attempt to retrieve her dog, just used to say 'its only playing, its only young'. Until I trotted towards her saying the same!
 
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