Am I wrong in thinking... saddlery question

[Degan]

That a dressage saddle should be balanced (in the way it is made) that where the stirrup bar is positioned should allow the stirrup leather to hang down in such a way that lines up with the lowest part of the seat?

OR should the stirrup hang in front of this point?

My thinking is that it should hang under the lowest part of the seat, so that the riders leg can be in the correct shoulder hip heal line. And that if the stirrup leather falls with the stirrup iron infront of this point that the rider will constantly be fighting against the saddle to bring the leg under themselves?

I'm a little confussed...
Hope thats understandable :\

 

[Degan]

^^ This is the saddle that got me thinking. The green line is where the stirrup leather hangs when attached.

 

[dumpling]

I think I know what you mean and it probably should be to an extent but if it was right under you then you're leg would be at risk of going too far back?

 

[kerilli]

i think it'd be impossible to have the stirrup leather hanging perpendicular if the bars were below the lowest part of the seat, because even someone with a perfect dressage seat never has the thigh literally upright, it has to come forward to a certain degree, and the seat bones are in the lowest part of the saddle, so... no, i think it'd be impossible to ride with stirrups in a saddle with the bars that far back.
hmmm, i'll have a look at the position of the bars on my 3 dressage saddles and measure how far behind them the lowest part of the seat is, should be interesting...

 

[Carefreegirl]

Stirrup bars are normally slightly further back on a Dressage than say a GP or jumping saddle so you have a 'straighter' position to aid your leg contact but the picture you show seems a very odd position. I'm no saddler though so could be talking utter drivel.

 

[Thistle]

you also have to rtemember that it's your toe in the iron, so the hip heel alignment would have to be the distance of the foot, ball to heel behind the point the the iron falls.

 

[D66]

The stirrup supports the ball of the foot and the heel is a few inches back from that point. so I think that the stirrup bar should be forward of the lowest part of the saddle by the distance between your ankle and ball of your foot.
I haven't thought carefully about the position of the hip joint in relation to the deepest part of the saddle though.

edited to add - took me 2 min longer than Thistle to express it!

 

[Thistle]

The stirrup supports the ball of the foot and the heel is a few inches back from that point. so I think that the stirrup bar should be forward of the lowest part of the saddle by the distance between your ankle and ball of your foot.
I haven't thought carefully about the position of the hip joint in relation to the deepest part of the saddle though.

D66 posted the same thing at the same time!

 

[Degan]

Thankyou for your replies I was trying to think aout it logically from both sides but ended up going round in circles.

It was the saddle above that got me thinking as when I rode in it and I found it hard to stop my leg slipping forwards, which was making me unbalanced. I haven't has this issue before, even in GP saddles. So looked at the saddle afterwards and noticed that the sirrup leather hung considerably infront of the lowest point. Hence my question.

 

[Degan]

Thistle and D66 - Thankyou, thats a very good point!
I hadn't thought about it like that.

 

[smellsofhorse]

My thinking is the same as thistle and d66

 

[Thistle]

when the saddle is on the horse does the seat lie flat. If the back is slightly high that will tip you into a 'sitting on the loo' position

 

[sbloom]

Foot size is very influential in where the bar should be relative to the lowest part of the seat. Fighting to keep your leg back can come from all sorts of saddle fit issues - as said the saddle being out of balance, the twist being the wrong width, the blocks being in the wrong plac, the horse having an awkward shaped ribcage (a very wide ribcage will push your leg forwards)....the list goes on.

 

[burge]

To find out if the alignment is correct sit in the saddle on the horse without your feet in the irons and let the leg fall in the correct position. The iron should hang in the right place if the balance of the saddle is correct ie near the ball of your foot. Mirrors or a friend on the ground are helpful for this excercise. I had a dressage saddle once where when I did this the iron hung way in front of my toe so my leg was too far forward and therefore to find my balance I was leaning forward. Hope this is understandable.