"Anorexia" in emaciated rescue hores?

[Box_Of_Frogs]

Desperate for information as title. This story leads on from my earlier one a few days back.

I took on Rockin' Robbie 8 days ago. Since last November he'd been at the yard that the Local Authority uses for seized and abandoned horses and ponies. Robbie is only 6.2hh and a 2ft 9in rug. He's between 3 and 4 years old. He has no outer guard hairs on his fluffy coat, a symptom of his long term starvation I think. He is the friendliest and most unflappable little lad - humans, dogs, other horses, anything. He was condition score 1 at the time and, worryingly, he's still a condition score 1 now. Hmmmmm. You'd think that an emaciated rescue pony would wolf down anything edible but this is soooo not the case. He is the most picky eater I've ever known. I have 4 serious good-doers and know a lot about keeping weight off but not much about putting weight on. He's already had his teeth done and has had bloods taken that don't show anything major at this first stage. Weighed him at the vets today and he's a shocking 45.8kg. I reckon he should be about twice that. He will graze happily but there isn't much nutrition in the grass this time of year. He'll nibble a tiny bit of good quality haylage. This is what he WILL eat: Calm and Condition, a few tiny pieces of apple, bread, Lo Cal. I can't give him huge feeds of just Calm and Condition. I'm not even sure he should be on that but at least it's high in calories and he'll actually eat it. My understanding that ponies starved for a long time stop feeling hungry and that it can take a year or more to get them eating normally again. My fear is that he has not an ounce of spare flesh as reserves. I need to get high calorie FIBRE into him.

Been reading about Readigrass - seems ideal. Anyone tried it? Does it have to be soaked? My YO knows of a horse that choked on it but I've read glowing testimonials about it. Or any other palatable alternatives to C and C? Any help or experience at all would be gratefully received.

 

[zaminda]

I have used readi grass, and didn't soak it. Calm and condition is supposed tobe soaked, but generally isn't. Have you tried fast fibre or alfa beet? also, have you tried feeding him outside? My mare is ultra fussy, when she was stabled getting her to eat was very difficult, but now all mine live out, and get tied to the fence when eating, this works really well, she also seems to eat better if actually tied up, that way she can't wander off!

 

[dominobrown]

I am looking after some horses on readi-grass, it seems to be lovely stuff (not soaked, personally I wouldn't soak it, it is fed with sugar beet).
As for the pony.. I don't think horses suffer anorexia, it is a human disease, maybe he has just given up the will to live? As herd animals, maybe (big maybe) the horse believes it is a goner and therefore does not want to waste food, I am not sure but it sounds as though it has something internal not right/ deformed????

 

[Circe]

I don't think horses suffer anorexia nervosa, but anorexia is just a term for loss of appetite ( for whatever cause ).
I know its tempting to try and get as many calories as poss into the pony, but I think you would be wise to discuss the possibility of re feeding syndrome with your vet. Basically it can cause low phosphorous, magnesium and potassium in the cells.
I would think that if your pony is that malnourished, you'd be thinking of giving a handful of feed to start with, then very slowely building up.
Maybe contact one of the charities who are ( unfortunately ) more used to getting weight on poor horses, and see if they can give any help.
Good luck with him.
Kx

 

[jeeve]

I have fattened up a few skinny ponies, and it takes way longer than you think. Our clydie TB mare we got about 3 years old was quite thin, and not used to hard feed, so would only eat chaff/ hay but not her pellets. She has now learnt to eat the hard feed, and also we have had good grass - so she is normal now.

Other ponies have taken up to 6 -12 months to fatten up. I think as long as he is eating, (and I would have unlimited hay of a reasonable quality), then he should continue to make progress even if slow.

Small and often with any hard feed, and he is only little so he will only need small feeds.

I also think speaking to a rescue organisation is a good idea, they may be able to advise.

 

[Damnation]

Readigrass is good. I used to feed it to my last horse and it kept weight on her fantastically. Calm and condition is supposed to be good for weight gain. Small feeds several times of day for starvation cases would be my first port of call. Get the metabolism started.

Speaking to the feed hotlines that are free would also be a good place to go, I have spoken to them in the past and they are very helpful. Also, get a worm count done, if he has a heavy worm burden it could hinder weight gain greatly.

Remember 8 days is not a long time at all, it takes a long slow process to get such an emaciated horse to put on weight. He is eating nibbling quality hayledge, that is a start, but the readigrass is also good. Is he stabled overnight? You could give him a big trug of readigrass and the option of hayledge.

 

[zaminda]

Should add to my earlier post, don't overface him,if i give mine even a double handful more than she can manage, she has a tendency to leave most of it!

 

[Old Bat]

His stomach will have shrunk. Feed little and often, and try Pink Powders which helped my skinny boy no end. They contain probiotics which help the digestion.

 

[[59851]]

I had one like this I picked up a few years back. I fed redigrass and sugar beet - ad lib in a big trug, he nibbled this on and off all day - the right way for a horse to feed! I also added pink powder, slowly his appetite improved no end and he turned into a rather nice lad.

 

[Shilasdair]

I would try HiFi Lite - I know it is 'lite' and therefore low in calories, but my horses tell me it is very palatable.
My approach would be to offer him a whole range of different things to see what he likes - so I'd try a range of different chaffs, and then maybe speedibeet, or alfabeet.
You could try Baileys no 1 cereal (sort of paste but quite breadlike in a way) as some horses love it, and it is intended for weight gain. Or a little bit of barley.
I also buy the Horsehage Timothy which my two girls love.
Finally, if you have other horses - he may eat better if in company.
Good luck.
S

 

[Spudlet]

If this is the first one you've needed to put weight on, I would give one or two of the big rescues such as whw or Redwings a call on Monday and see what they advise because they do this a lot. Also your vet.

 

[YasandCrystal]

Calm and condition should definately be soaked. How about adding micronised linseed? That will add condition and you feed it in small quantities. I feed my 17hh WB a cup and a half a day so for little Robin I would say a half a cup. If you want to try it before you buy a 20kg bag you can get it from Natural Horse feeds via ebay cheaply. How about just adding a splosh of oil too?

Readigrass is great - mine get a bucket of that a day and I also feed carob kibble or locust bean. That is full of calcium and magnesium and horses love it. It gives all these mushy feeds likd C & C some crunch - it's sweet (but no sugar its used in diabetic chocolate) and all mine love it.

Are you feeding 3 or 4 small feeds a day? I think that makes a big difference.
He sounds delightful

 

[Daisy2]

Sugar beet, oil and there is a feed out there called Sumo Original. Good luck

 

[Goldenstar]

Two things spring to mind that could be affecting his appetite and I apologise if you already had them checked out.
his teeth if your vet has not looked get them checked.
Gastric ulcers if he's been starved there's a very high chance he has these he's small and while gastro guard which is used to treat ulcers is expensive it won't be so bad in such a light horse. If he were mine to look after I would not bother getting him scoped to look for the ulcers I would save the money to pay for gastroguard and treat him anyway have a chat with the vet.
This will take time I aggree about the readigrass in like the summer in a bucket lovely stuff .
Could also be that be just be that he does not know what bucket food is try letting him watch others eating.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I'd be trying soaked grassnuts with Readi-grass or Graze-on mixed in. This combined with soaked Speedibeet puts weight on our elderly cob. She used to be a good-doer but is quite a picky feeder now, she will only eat what she considers to be good haylage and as we can't tell which wrapped bale she will like, it's a bit of a lottery!. Her weight does fluctuate because of this but we find that adjusting her bucket feed sorts out any loss.

I'd be very wary of feeding anything other than fibre, as I had a mare who had been 'rescued' and fed up rapidly on cereals (she loved bread) by the rescuer before being sold to me and she developed severe intolerances to cereals and molasses because of the damage done to her digestive system. I'd also be wary of PinkPowder, as we have found that it can adversely affect some horses, we now feed Brewer's yeast instead.

Good luck!

ETA, what are you using as chaff with the C&C?, does he like that?

 

[Box_Of_Frogs]

Thanks everyone - keep it comig please. Won't eat any chaff. Teeth done. 4 small feeds a day. He came from my local rescue but they only had him 36hrs. He was found in November and taken to the yard that the Local Authority (not our county) uses for seized or abandoned horses. He went there condition score 1 and 3 months later he's still condition score 1, god knows what that "rescue" yard did or didn't do. I know it's not anorexia, that's why I put it in inverted commas lol. But vet's assistant said emaciated horses can forget what eating is. She took on an emaciated rescue, took her horse a whole year to put on weight and she still won't eat apples. But little Robbie is labrador sized and at vets yesterday weighed about half what he should at 45.8kg. He has no reserves left whatsoever. I'm even terrified to worm him because even Panacur Guard will set him back. My advice is feed whatever he'll eat, little and often. Feeding outside is worth a try. He won't eat hay, even good quality, just minute nibbles x

 

[Goldenstar]

I think this will just take time base it around fibre and try different things try haylage if you have not yet .
When I was doing welfare I saw this forgotten to eat thing very frustrating for you caring for him but slow gain is best and he probally feels awful at the mo .
Take some pictures and keep in touch with your progress.
GOOD luck with him lucky pony.

 

[appylass]

I haven't got much to add but I havean elderly mare who becomes anorexic from time to time. There are a few things that will normally tempt her:
- Apple juice poured on her feed
- Carrots grated into feed (if they are whole she just picks them out and leaves the feed)
- She prefers Grazon or D&H Just Grass to Readigrass, I think because they seem softer?
- Plain micronised rolled barley.
- Fast Fibre, especially warm

She is a very fussy lady

I've also heard that Fennel is a useful appetite stimulant though I've not tried it.

Good luck with your little man, I'm sure he'll start eating soon.

 

[Slinkyunicorn]

Box of Frogs you probably remember Carrot & Spud - they had condition scores of 0 and 1 when they were rescued.

At Bransby they feed them little and often and all they have is fibre - so chaff, beet, high fibre nuts (soaked) and ad lib hay. After a few weeks they start to add in some extra oil. That is all. Again as time passes they increase the size of the feeds slightly - too much too sonn can cause problems all of its own. But they never stray from the fibre

As he isn't eating chaff I would try him on Fast Fibre - haven't met anything yet that doesn't like it and as its soft it will be easy for him to eat. It contains fibre and beet and linseed so will keep his gut ticking over even if he is only having little bits If you wan tsome to try PM your address and will send some to you - also works out to be reasonable as its about £8 a bag

Good luck with him - and are there piccies?

 

[immybrookstud]

calm and condition is a fantastic feed, we use it for anything we have brought in very poor condition, and because it is socked is easy for the body to digest. dont up into large feeds, little and often split throughtout the day. we also add a bit of sugar beet and conditioning mix if they will eat it. never had anything that will eat ready grass, so wouldnt recomend it to a fussy eater. keep with ad lib hayledge to nibble at for his size he prob wont it much of it. 8 days isnt long to be honest wouldnt expect to notice any difference especially as you see him daily, try taking photos to compare instead from you then notice small differences you wouldnt normally notice. an because he wont be used to feed be careful feeding to much (build up slowly) and trying to many different feeds, he will be at high risk of colic.

 

[Goldenstar]

Just another thought do you have kindly pony you could team him up with ?
This might cheer him up and help to get him eating.
Worming when the times comes will be a difficult time do it under veterinary supervision .

 

[jendie]

I don't know about ponies but some of the Japanese prisoners of war were NEVER able to eat full-sized meals after their release. Their stomachs had shrunk.

If he likes to munch the grass perhaps some Readigrass or Just Grass would suit him. You could add handfuls of whatever he likes. I'd try feeding little and often. It won't be long before Spring and then his grass munching will show better results. Good luck.

 

[littlescallywag]

NAF pink powder with fast fibre.
If you ring allen & page direct I think you can get them to send you some sample bags of FF, they leave small sample bags at my local feed store every now and then

 

[Beatrice5]

The mare I am helping with is a very fussy skinny.

She didn't like ready grass so we tried Alpha A oil which is going down a treat.

If you are at a yard could you ask friends for a small quantity of their chaff to offer him a variety to see which he likes ?

Madame is on Baileys No 4, sugar beet, Micronised linseed, sunflower oil, cider vinegar, Happy tummy charcoal, pink powder and Alpha A oil. With Ad lib hay and haylage which she just picks at. This is in 4 small meals a day.

As others have said chaff mixed with sugar beet can be mixed up in a trug to be picked at as a hay replacer. The sugar beet will moisten and soften the chaff and may encourage him to eat.

I know I may get shot down but have you tried homeopathy Arnica for Trauma, Ignatia for grief or herbal suppliments such a nettle to cleans his system and as a general tonic. If he's feeling low they may help pick him up.

Also does he like a good scratch and a bit of mutual grooming. A kind pony ideal but if not I am sure you can get on your knees and have a good go at scratching his itchy spots yourself

Good luck with little man.

 

[threeponies]

Try making some peppermint tea- either the actual tea bags or just dried mint in boiling water and use it to soak his Calm & Condition. Peppermint is an apetite stimulant and you can use it to soak feeds or just to damp them down

 

[ponypilotmum]

I think your best bet right now is getting him used to eating, rather than worrying about him getting some weight immediately.

Tempt him with some fast fibre mixed with apple juice. Just sainsbury's value stuff watered down will do the job. Make his feeds as yummy as you can. A crushed up polo mixed in will help. Basically flavour his feed wih what he fancies.

Then he usual, keep him warm, keep him hydrated (flavour his water if need be).

Sorry, can't be of much help as I've not much experience in this field, mine are fatties, and the only one I had who wouldn't eat was a laminitic who sulked because he wanted to go out. The above worked.

Phone redwings and ask them for some advice too.

Please keep us posted about the little man, would love to hear how he's getting on.

 

[Dab]

Hi BOF,

Not sure if i'm allowed to post this link but this centre have a little dot of a pony in terrible condition that they are feeding *Forever Living - Stabilized Aloe Vera Gel*, in with a little feed that is given often.

https://www.facebook.com/home.php#!...15374730.28792.143758309059641&type=3&theater

It might be worth getting in touch with these guys at the centre to see if they can give any advice. I have no expereince with the product and i see you want to get weight on him but he may need something to sort out his system as well.

My TB was very fussy when he first arrived but after about a year he has settled down and eating is now a real passion!

 

[touchstone]

Another vote for fast fibre here, if he likes and manages soaked feeds then fast fibre can be used as a complete hay replacer, and at his size it won't cost much to feed. It is easy to mix any additional supplements into too.

 

[beeswax]

speedibeet it is so appetising and easy to eat, add some pony nuts they taste so nice, also get him alongside a good eater who will encourage him to eat and remind him that eating is nice, because if he does have animal form of anorexia then he needs some encouragement from others too, wish i could loan you my lil shettie he'll teach him to eat no problem. good luck and well done

 

[Tinypony]

I'd agree with those who suggest speaking to a rescue, maybe EMW or the Blue Cross. Another vote for Fast Fibre, which can be fed as a hay replacer and has a surprisngly useful mix of ingredients.
In fact, as he's quite a special case, why don't you ring the Allen and Paige feed advice line and see if they can advise and maybe help with a bit of "sponsorship" in the form of feed for a while? He's so tiny, won't cost them much.