Another racing thread!

[Velcrobum]

https://www.racingpost.com/news/lat...n-races-to-give-racing-a-bit-of-a-buzz/585685

I think a downturn in attendances is probably more to do with the economic climate not timing.

There is also the small topic of staffing as not all yards can send multiple staff racing.

The jockeys also need time to weigh in get changed and weigh out for the next race. I assume jockeys have more than one saddle so that the next ride can be saddled at leisure

 

[spacefaer]

@Elf On A Shelf
So far as I know, they only have one saddle and weight cloth, which will need adjusting between races.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

Jockeys have different saddles that weigh different amounts. Whilst they can weigh out up to 45mins before the race time if the trainer requests it it's not always possible if they are using the same saddle as the ride in the race before has a similar weight.

A low weight will usually require a doc or pancake saddle whilst a top weight of 12st would need a stone saddle as well as a weight cloth with lead in. A light jockey riding at 11st would probably use the stone saddle and no weight cloth, if they were riding a 12st in the next they would need the same saddle. You can't weigh out with the same saddle for 3 different races at the same time. It has to come back in, weigh in then change colours, lead etc and weigh back out.

So time really is tight for the stable staff on 30mins! And some tracks take a hell of a walk to get to and from the stable yard and pre-parade rings.

They do 25min gaps for the Super Sunday Flat series and it causes no end of havoc for the stable staff.

 

[Velcrobum]

Jockeys have different saddles that weigh different amounts. Whilst they can weigh out up to 45mins before the race time if the trainer requests it it's not always possible if they are using the same saddle as the ride in the race before has a similar weight.

A low weight will usually require a doc or pancake saddle whilst a top weight of 12st would need a stone saddle as well as a weight cloth with lead in. A light jockey riding at 11st would probably use the stone saddle and no weight cloth, if they were riding a 12st in the next they would need the same saddle. You can't weigh out with the same saddle for 3 different races at the same time. It has to come back in, weigh in then change colours, lead etc and weigh back out.

So time really is tight for the stable staff on 30mins! And some tracks take a hell of a walk to get to and from the stable yard and pre-parade rings.

They do 25min gaps for the Super Sunday Flat series and it causes no end of havoc for the stable staff.

Thank you Elf you have confirmed what I expected the answer to be about jockeys saddles. Rather a pity Mr Mullins as a leading Irish trainer is actually making this statement with no consideration to stable staff or the jockeys he/his owners employ to ride. W**ker......

 

[teapot]

Also I'd hazard a guess and say for the drinking punters, it can take half an hour to get a pint so there's a cashing in on food and drink costs issue here too.

 

[bonny]

Thank you Elf you have confirmed what I expected the answer to be about jockeys saddles. Rather a pity Mr Mullins as a leading Irish trainer is actually making this statement with no consideration to stable staff or the jockeys he/his owners employ to ride. W**ker......

Exactly, what would Willie Mullins know about racing!

 

[humblepie]

I think that more could be done during the race gaps by utilising the parade ring and big screens. Information and background stories. Bits about how to get into owning a racehorse or working in racing. That said that may alienate those who want to see replays and odds.

 

[Carrottom]

Tbf to WM he is suggesting that the 35 min gap be shortened to 30 min. He also says for flat racing in particular. I tend to agree, especially if you have a few sprint races which are over quickly unlike NH which can be 5 mins or more of racing.

 

[Velcrobum]

My experiences racing are very limited having been to Cheltenham twice and Warwick once. All were jumps meetings and we did not find the gaps between races long at all. Watch the race then go to the parade ring to watch the runners in the next race maybe get a hot drink then it is time to find a spot to watch the next race. We found plenty to see however I can understand that the people who ensconce themselves indoors in the bars for the whole meeting might feel otherwise.
I was thinking of the stable staff who are the ones who have the most work to do behind the scenes especially if they have more than one horse to care for at a meeting in my reply to Elf.

 

[Gamebird]

I have to say that the trainer involved was mostly referencing Irish racing, and probably not the festivals either. I think that the bog standard weekday Irish meetings are pretty workmanlike and the racecourses more compact and it would probably work just fine for those situations. We did manage with 18 runners of his on a single day at Cheltenham once when they'd reduced the timings from 40 mins to 35 (Cheltenham pre-parade ring is a very long walk from the stables, particularly when half of your horses are in the top stable yard, and you have to be down there extra early for the Festival), and it was during covid when they'd restricted the number of staff allowed into the course during racing to 10 per day (including whoever was saddling), so everyone had to do double lead-ups. You also have to take into account the issues caused if one member of staff is stuck in the dope box or with a vet post-race, but that is the same problem if it's 35 or 30 mins. I would not ever want to reduce below 35mins at the big tracks and bigger meetings, but I think for a standard Wednesday in Clonmel it could probably work just fine.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

I have to say that the trainer involved was mostly referencing Irish racing, and probably not the festivals either. I think that the bog standard weekday Irish meetings are pretty workmanlike and the racecourses more compact and it would probably work just fine for those situations. We did manage with 18 runners of his on a single day at Cheltenham once when they'd reduced the timings from 40 mins to 35 (Cheltenham pre-parade ring is a very long walk from the stables, particularly when half of your horses are in the top stable yard, and you have to be down there extra early for the Festival), and it was during covid when they'd restricted the number of staff allowed into the course during racing to 10 per day (including whoever was saddling), so everyone had to do double lead-ups. You also have to take into account the issues caused if one member of staff is stuck in the dope box or with a vet post-race, but that is the same problem if it's 35 or 30 mins. I would not ever want to reduce below 35mins at the big tracks and bigger meetings, but I think for a standard Wednesday in Clonmel it could probably work just fine.

Do you guys just lead up 1 each at the races on a day?

 

[Gamebird]

Do you guys just lead up 1 each at the races on a day?

We tend to have multiple horses in the same, or consecutive races. So say we have 4 in the Triumph hurdle, and 3 in the race after. So we'd need 7 people for those 7 horses. If one person is doing 2, especially at somewhere like Cheltenham where you have to be in yhe pre-parade early, then really the minimum gap between your 2 horses is 2 races. And hope the first horse doesn't land you in the dope box or the vets.
But I'm guessing it must be the same for you as you physically need time to get the first horse back, washed off and checked, walked off, and then your second horse dressed, hoof oiled and out.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

Whilst we don't quite take those numbers we have to work on the basis of leading up every other horse. If we get stuck in the dope box that's where the truck driver comes in. They don't just get to drive the truck and chill for the day. They end up running all the saddles (we saddle everything in the stables) and doing dope box duty so the rest of us can just keep kicking. We end up working on a 3 horse to 1 person ratio.

We have 7 runners at Ayr tomorrow. There will be myself and 2 other people. I won't be leading anything up, I will be on saddling duty as the boss is away to Wetherby for Ahoy Senor. So it will be OK to start with as we have 1 then 1 then a gap then 1, 1, 2. So when we get to the last 2 races whoever takes out the last single runner will get back to the stable yard and be handed one ready to go for the last. I will finish up that horse and start sorting all the tack and cuts and things so we are ready to go home ASAP.

Home is going to be very short staffed as all 5 jockeys will be away, a minimum of 2 work riders and 2 ground staff will be away. And that's before you take out the boss, scu and the assistant trainer from riding too. I think racing is going to be the far easier day of the 2 tomorrow ??

 

[Bob notacob]

How we survive the ever changing complications of going racing I just don't know. I grew up in racing, (a long time ago). Folk who mattered knew me as that horse crazy kid ,and then as a kid who knew what he was doing, and then ,omg he is going to pt to pt on his pony club horse. (survived ) .Got a lot of respect from head lad ,ex NH jock for trying. Apprentices laughed at the photos but head lad said , you go out there and try it. Watched a lot ,learned a lot. In later years I wound up occasionally driving a box for a friend who occasionally provided transport for trainers who were stuck for transport. Of course I was just the box driver (like hell!!!!!!!!!!) No passport , so not officially on the payroll, but most of the time ,providing the jockey club were far away , I was assistant trainer for whoever was mad enough to believe in me. (oddly enough there were a few!.) Just once , the sh1t hit the fan . First call Leicester Bad traffic , I ducked and dived to get us there on time. Jockey didnt. Rules of racing ,time limits ,had to engage a jockey. \Trainer up at air. . Engaged garry B . a good jockey , trainer liked . Had to follow the rules , could,t contact trainer. . Discovered why trainers wear wide brimmed hats as girth slipped on horse who was clearly part pufferfish!. Had to nrush out onto track to re saddle pufferfish for Garry. Hat pulled well down to AVOID TV CAMERAS. next CALL Uttoxeter nh RACE , JOCKEY CLUB THERE IN FORCE. Not allowed in as no passport .Bollocks . Horse fell half way through race ,not good. Said to security , I either go through you or you let me pass.Thats my horse out there. Its in bad trouble.Common sense prevailed. We recovered horse as trainer arrived from Ayr. Horse was in no fit state to travel ,owner was distraught (pet pony). Up to me !Said in front of owner ,surely there is a yard locally that could take poor S in . (having already found a good yard and worked out a pln) Sneaky me!. Trainer just followed my lead ,(gratefully) Next to deliver hors, done efficiently but mistook burton on trent forstoke on trent , got lost ,got caught speeding, but magnificent hysterical drama from girl groom scared the living daylights out of our constabulary so they backed off sharpish. Picked up a rather lonely horse and groom from \leicester at stupid oclock in the morning. Arrived back at Epsom as firs lot were going out. Feck off the lot of you ,we aint playing this morning!