Any ideas - Pony has learnt to stand up :(

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Booga22

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Hi - I will try and not make this too long - so just a warning!
My 4yo NF mare has learnt a new trick, and it is appaerntly from nowhere. Last Sun (not just gone), I took pony for little ride on a track she has been on few times before and enjoys.....decided she didn't like the look of a dock leaf so threw brakes on, and then when I asked her to go on, she did a half/small rear. I put this down to maybe me putting too much pressure on (she hates 'confrontation' and is prone to panic attacks though very rare now), as when i sat much quieter she went past ok.
Anyhow, in school yesterday, did around 15 mins lovely walk, huge loops, halt transistions etc, listening and being a very good girlie. Had picked out her 'spooking spot' which is always an imaginary monster at any given spot around the school - never consistent with this, where/which rein/whether it be in walk or trot.... Asked for trot on left rein, fine, no probs. Asked for trot t'other way, all fine until the 'scary' spot, and rather than just a little spook, we had the anchors and a small rear. I tapped her on the shoulder with the stick and kept her straight but her response to this was to go right up and try spinning. She lost her balance, I lost my balance as did not expect this atall (totally new thing for pony) and was hovering over the point of no return. thankfully just as I was about to bail out and try to reduce the risk of her coming over (this has happened to her in her past way before I bought her), she regained her balance and stood square.
As she'd upset herself she started to worry and threw her head up, and as she met the contact threatened to do it again. I pushed my hands forward and she stopped that idea. I ended the session by doing huge circles near said scary point, and taking her closer to it, then in away, then closer again, until she was going past it without any reaction atall, and then we called it a day after some walk work.
She had her teeth done 6/7 weeks ago, feet done (first pair of fronts) 6 weeks ago, saddler out at the same time, back done last week - was noted she is tight in her neck and shoulders - mostly through nervous tension (she is very highly strung some days and can be very sensitive and over reactive to life) and i have been given homework re specific carrot stretches and asking her to walk long & low, which she was doing brilliantly at the start yday, and the end.
So, (and thank you for even getting this far!:) ) do we think she is uncomfortable and if so, would it not be more consistant, being a bit of a madam and then working herself up as she then has a bee in her bonnet, hormones as weather not helping the other mares in the yard, or something else? I am going to ring saddler and ask her to come & check saddle again, and maybe vet re teeth - ulcer? I don't know!!
She is fed Top Spec Lite Balancer, with Fast Fibre and Top Spec Calmer with a small handful of Mollichaff to stop her bolting it, and up until this monsoon weather, has been living out 24/7
Lovehearts and coffee on offer to those who have made it through to the end :)
 
How are her reactions to go forward? Both on the lunge and ridden? It sounds like she's napping and trying to avoid going forward, so I'd work on that to really establish itso her immediate reponse to leg/voice is to go fwd
 
Its old fashioned but I would put a standing matringale on for a while I always used one with the young ones when riding away etc.
Some young horse do go though a standing on the back legs phase for no apparent reason you need to concentrate on getting good forward reactions and I would do a few hacks with another horse so she gets some nice fun experiances too ,hacking confidently takes time and this is something that some youngster go though.
Be safe hat body protector people who know where you are going etc etc and keep going and try and watch or remember any change that is affecting her, for instance keep a record of when shes in season and see if it affects her work.
 
jumpthemoon said:
How are her reactions to go forward? Both on the lunge and ridden? It sounds like she's napping and trying to avoid going forward, so I'd work on that to really establish itso her immediate reponse to leg/voice is to go fwd
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She is very good to go forward, under saddle and lunge. I try and long rein her once per week as she is a muppet on the lunge - if she attempts to break in to canter she will have a fart about and then prats about more as unbalanced. But as you say, if I send her forwards it does stop it. She does think it's fun to select a scary spot, but the rear is a new trick :( SHe does respind well to voice and now seat aids so hoping it's a blip
 
When my horse decided to learn to rear I have to say I gave her one hell of a smack with the whip. Tbh I did it without thinking but she's not the most balanced of horses and I was worried about her going over and all I could think of was go forwards now and she doesn't listen to the leg at all when she's throwing a strop! It was only one crack but she's never tried it again.
 
Goldenstar said:
Its old fashioned but I would put a standing matringale on for a while I always used one with the young ones when riding away etc.
Some young horse do go though a standing on the back legs phase for no apparent reason you need to concentrate on getting good forward reactions and I would do a few hacks with another horse so she gets some nice fun experiances too ,hacking confidently takes time and this is something that some youngster go though.
Be safe hat body protector people who know where you are going etc etc and keep going and try and watch or remember any change that is affecting her, for instance keep a record of when shes in season and see if it affects her work.
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Thank you - I hadn't actually thought of the standing martingale - that would take away the pressure on her mouth which she hates and give her less reason to throw a wobbly. After yesterday, I will put my body protector back on, stupid of me really especially as she is a bubby still, and one with attitude. She loves going out and about, so I really don't want to spoil this.
I always carry my phone, and tell someone where I am going, approximate time I should be etc, but difficult to get peole to ride out at the same time at the moment.
What do you guys think to a market harborough (on a loose setting of course) - just an idea I had considered, especially as she has built up muscle under her neck and this could be/probably is contributing to her soreness in the front end
 
Cop-Pop said:
When my horse decided to learn to rear I have to say I gave her one hell of a smack with the whip. Tbh I did it without thinking but she's not the most balanced of horses and I was worried about her going over and all I could think of was go forwards now and she doesn't listen to the leg at all when she's throwing a strop! It was only one crack but she's never tried it again.
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I had hoped the stick on the shoulder would have discouraged her after the first rear, but unfortunately it made her put even more effort in to the next one and really unbalance the pair of us. Atleast she stood still after she came back down as I fully expected a broncing fit or the like
 
What sort of bit is she wearing? I would downgrade to the softest straight bar you can find and then work at going forward, forward, forward with very little contact. Most horses learn to rear because they are not being allowed or feel they are not being allowed forward. Also hit her behind the saddle rather than the neck.
 
She sounds just like my old horse who was a TB x NF. She always picked a spot in the school (usually a different corner every session and then spin at that point. The only way to get her over it was to push her through it as she was just being a nappy, opinionated madam. She never full out reared so I don't really have any advice for that I'm afraid but I would say definitely wear your BP and stay safe x
 
If she naps, rather than pusing her forward and risking further resistance and a rear, immediately turn her head towards your knee (she can't rear from this position) and use your legs to spin her round in a tight circle a couple of times. She is now going forward, albeit in a circle, and as you come out of the circle keep moving in the direction you want. If she naps again, repeat the head to the knee and push her round in a tight circle. The head-to-the-knee works to prevent a buck as well!

Spring grass and raging hormones wont be helping either!
 
I would hesitate to say try a market harborough in case it makes her strops more violent and it's difficult to give the rien away completly .
 
mcnaughty said:
What sort of bit is she wearing? I would downgrade to the softest straight bar you can find and then work at going forward, forward, forward with very little contact. Most horses learn to rear because they are not being allowed or feel they are not being allowed forward. Also hit her behind the saddle rather than the neck.
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She's currently in a loose ring cyprium snaffle with a lozenge which she plays with. I have been working on having a feel rather than a true contact (if that makes sense) and generally she is very good, it's when she decides that something doesn't suit and jumps around therefore meeting the contact that she over reacts. MAkes sense though if she feels she can't go forwards
I think I thought *after* I hit her on the shoulder.....
 
Goldenstar said:
I would hesitate to say try a market harborough in case it makes her strops more violent and it's difficult to give the rien away completly .
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Very fair point actually..... did I mention she was chestnut?!


I did the head turn & spin on a hack when she protested at the world's scariest stone, and it sort of peed on her fire and she seemed to forget what is was she was going to do - thankfully!
When i bought her last May, her favourite trick was to pull back at run backwards at 100mph - this we seem to have got on top of, but she has taught herself a new trick. Hoping it's just baby being a madam andshe will get bored of it. I just keep riding past said scary spot until she gets bored and we can go past in walk and trot.
Lesson on Thursday morning (though may need googles or a snorkel) so may ask RI to get on for a feel - Thanks for all the help and advice, much appreciated :)
 
You need to make her believe that if she does it again she is going to die....rearing is dangerous, needs serious nip in the bud.
 
I sympathise :(.

I have a 4 yo Sec D mare, broken last year (end of). Rearing and napping is her default when it all gets too much/too scary.

I backed right off over winter and have recently re-started her, very slowly and quietly....lots of hacking with nice buddies and have just started to do a little in the school.....her attitude has improved 10 fold. She, again is a very opinionated girl and has her own ideas....I found taking the pressure off help loads.....they are very young!

She will rear if very frightend and/or pushed to hard, giving her a smack cured the enormous bucking she tried....but I find that just sitting...not asking for anything....just sitting, has helped. Smacking her for rearing( in my experience) just evoked another bigger one. After Ive sat for a little while and shes thought about it, we ask quietly for forwards, and she usually obliges....I'm not soft, but with her confrontation is not the key.

We are coming out the other side now and she has improved massively....will very rarely offer up a rear...and if she does, only little hops.

I know it sounds like Im saying do nothing....but slowly, slowly, catchy monkey is the key for my young girl.

Good luck...theres light at the end of the tunnel.x.x.
 
""I backed right off over winter and have recently re-started her, very slowly and quietly....lots of hacking with nice buddies and have just started to do a little in the school.....her attitude has improved 10 fold. She, again is a very opinionated girl and has her own ideas....I found taking the pressure off help loads.....they are very young!""

Sounds like you had the same plan as me - I brought pony back in to work around 6 weeks ago after having the winter off to be a pleb

""Smacking her for rearing( in my experience) just evoked another bigger one.""

^^^ Exactly this. I guess I thought about it afterwards. She then sticks her nose up in the air, so I sit still but keep my leg on lightly (her fav trick is to peg it backwards although *touch wood* this is alot less common under saddle than in hand)


""I know it sounds like Im saying do nothing....but slowly, slowly, catchy monkey is the key for my young girl.""

^^ I was like this all last Summer with our groundwork as it was often 1 step forward, 2 step back - but I think, forthe most of it - it's worked (ish! :) )

Good luck...theres light at the end of the tunnel.x.x.[/QUOTE]
 
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Plenty of them do seem to go through this phase.
My horse started out of the blue one day and although most of the time now he is fine (2years on), it will always be his predisposed behaviour.
It certainly sounds like napping and the important thing is that she isn't successful.

I would be careful with smacking as you said she panic with confrontation and I have to admit I tried this strategy with mine and it made him worse. Although I appreciate for less determined personalities it may discourage.

Getting them forwards is important, but I find it is more about keeping his mind focused so giving them lots to think about transitions, poles ect.

When they do plant worst thing to do is try to drive forwards as they just go bolt upright. I agree with grabbing the rein near her head and pulling it to your knee then circle, this can wind them up more initially but they soon get them point that it isn't as easy to go up. If you need to calm them down also good to pull head to your knee and hold it there for a minute before trying again.

I know this is far easier than said but try to stay relaxed, the more you anticipate it happening and become tense the worse it is and when it does happen just try to ride through it as calmly as you can. Getting into a head on battle doesn't really achieve much even if you win it doesn't stop them next time.

I found martingales made my horse much worse so I just had a breastplate which gave something to grab hold of.

Also ground work is really important, found that when his behaviour was at its worst he was also a sod to bring in from field ect so watch her manners in general.

Oh also find my horse to be much worse in spring/ summer.
He has vastly improved, now feed him bluechip, not sure if this played a part or not but worth a try.

Key thing is patience, best of luck.
 
After checking for any pain related issues, I would second what Tammytoo said previously. You do need to teach a certain degree of head flexion and hindquarter disengagement on the ground first though. But the method is IMO very effective and confidence building for the horse.
 
She isn't any worse/better if she is in or out to be honest, but if she spooks on her way in from field, that is often enough to set her state of mind for the rest of the session. We have started on head flexing (which was actually going well prior to her tantrum)
On the hack when she did it the very first time, I did manage to get her head turned around and made her circle which annoyed her but she then stood quiet. I am pleased I didn't get too anxious about it - after having her for the past 11 months I have really learnt to control my emotions (she is very trying but in a bad mood, she needs a hell of a lot of patience).
Will keep with the breatsplate she had on - usually it is a neck strap but I think the farm puppy has bagged it.
My saddler is coming out next week, so fingers crossed that may solve it, but I am planning on a quiet session in school tonight - will try and rope someone in to being eyes on the ground too.
She has a small slice of hay at night only when the weather has been really grotty but I have found she is usually more irritable the morning/day after not having her hay so that may be an avenue to look at.
Thanks guys though for all your help - this girlie is proving to me rather a handful but, that said compared to what she was like, I shouldn't complain too much !!
 
hello!

I'm at the same yard as Booga22. She's doing a great job with her little girl.

If you need any 'eyes on the ground' when I'm around, I'm happy to help!

bye!
 
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