Any types of horse not prone to Laminitis????

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Kazza1

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Hello!! I know lami can affect any horse but im wondering since some types of Native breed seem especially prone to it....are there any breeds that are especially not prone to it also???
 
Mine was about 25 when he had it bout 10 years ago, he was fit and ridden every day not overweight no cushings Arab x cob, vet reckoned it was because we had a wet summer and the grass continually grew like spring grass. Not had it since touch wood, he is muzzled when turned out
 
all horses are prone but new research is showing different types are prone for different reasons, EMS typically is more common in natives and cob types but cushings is more likely to be the cause for other types-at the moments these are just indicators from fairly early research
 
So do you think Warmbloods are less prone to lami (or the underlying causes) because when developing the dif warmblood breed things like being a good doer or 'thrifty' weren't top of the list of desirable qualities? Whereas in native breed perhaps surviving on little food was a good thing and breed for specifically?? Do you think it's possible these lami prone breed have had these underlying causes (ems/cushings) breed into them as breeders in the past wanted horses that were good doers??? (<if that makes sense!?)
 
Many native breeds were once working horses who would do a full day's labour, but that has changed. They gain and retain weight much easier but aren't doing the jobs they were designed for whilst still being fed a rich diet which makes them more prone to sicknesses which can lead to laminitis. A disposition toward EMS hasn't been 'bred into' natives, they were bred to work hard and don't any more.
 
fattylumpkin said:
Many native breeds were once working horses who would do a full day's labour, but that has changed. They gain and retain weight much easier but aren't doing the jobs they were designed for whilst still being fed a rich diet which makes them more prone to sicknesses which can lead to laminitis. A disposition toward EMS hasn't been 'bred into' natives, they were bred to work hard and don't any more.
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this

also don't underestimate how many horses/ponies get lami from concussion/bad shoeing, stress and/or medication-research is now steering towards the idea that being fat alone will not cause lami unless the horse/pony has an underlying condition such as EMS/cushings
 
So would you say that there is no genetic/heredity influence over whether horses develop ems/cushings and then go on to get lami?
 
grass has suddenly started shooting up again with the sugary fresh shoots so our RDA 14.2 cob x who has had laminitus before is sadly starting to show symptoms again. He was off for six months last time so he's been put on bute, some lami medication and kept off the grass. Our 12 hand Welsh sec A has never had it, and never shown symptoms, so its not always good doers.
 
OwnedbyJoe said:
Very fit active ones...
Sorry. In general, the larger, lighter "hotter blooded" breeds are less prone. Your average TB is less likely to get laminitis than any M&M. That said, Arabs are very good doers and can be lami prone despite being hot blooded.
Warmbloods.
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My mare was very fit in training 6 days a week 16 hh IDXTB, I was worried about my welsh A but it was my mare of a lifetime who got it .:( sad ending
 
My tb was diagnosed with it age 5, now 7. He's been tested for EMS and Cushings and both were negative, it's purely diet related. He can't cope with rye grazing at all, and is managed as an ulcer prone horse, ad lib forage, fast fibre with molasses free alfa a, protexin gut balancer, pro hoof, linseed, salt and rosehip.

Tbs are more prone to mild laminitis than people think IMO.
 
pinklilly said:
My tb was diagnosed with it age 5, now 7. He's been tested for EMS and Cushings and both were negative, it's purely diet related. He can't cope with rye grazing at all, and is managed as an ulcer prone horse, ad lib forage, fast fibre with molasses free alfa a, protexin gut balancer, pro hoof, linseed, salt and rosehip.

Tbs are more prone to mild laminitis than people think IMO.
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TB s stud stallions can get it due to the rich diet and their paddocks are often sown grass species.
 
In South Africa it is far, far more scarce than in the UK. I have only heard of two cases in the last five years. One very fat welshie and one llama type with horrific foot conformation, completely upright pasterns an tiny, boxy, nearly club-like feet.

It's got to be the grass. So the type of horse that doesn't get lami... one with a grass allergy?
 
Kazza1 said:
Lol, fair enough. So does anyone know if there has been any research into whether it may be genetic and inherited, i.e. certain bloodlines more susceptible?
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The cause is still unknown, so it would be impossible to determine whether genetics are a factor. Genetics don't appear to be a factor however since research has proven that it's possible to induce laminitis in any normal, healthy horse.

I'd say certain types of horse, like natives, are more likely to be kept by their owners in a situation which is likely to trigger an onset of laminitis. That's not the fault of their breeding, it's due to many owners being ill-informed.
 
In about 90% of cases it's diet related usually due to insulin resistance
I think factors which make horses more prone to laminitis are hereditary but for the most part it's a management thing..I think ponies/natives are more likely to present symptoms because they are more often unshod . Shoes can mask a lot of the early symptoms and so a lot of low grade laminitis in tb's and the like goes unnoticed or mistaken for something else.
 
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I know four WBs who had the disease. Two of them (including my mare) were PTS because of it. One died of colic. The other is very much with us. He is a trakehner x TB and only 8 years old. So no, I don't think there are any breeds that are less prone to laminitis.
 
As far as I have heard/know, Any horse can develop laminitis, regardless of breed...as has been said, EMS and PPID can be underlying issues that are realised after the horse/pony gets lami...I tend to think the grass over here has been 'managed' too well over the last 40 odd years with fertilisers plus the feed we give them now can be full of sugar and starch, not eonough exercise ( unlike the old days of hacking for a couple of hours or schooling hard, plus hunting a lot).....
Interesting that its not so common abroad in certain countries though
 
Many TB yearlings have low grade laminitis, we used to give all the yearlings being prepared for the sales Founderguard to reduce the risk of them getting sore.

Laminitis is a disease of Management, over feed and under exercise and you put your horse at risk.
 
Kazza1 said:
So would you say that there is no genetic/heredity influence over whether horses develop ems/cushings and then go on to get lami?
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Genetics/breeding is a subject that few understand and, when you think you do, it will surely up it's ugly had and kick you firmly in the back side!

I had a very interesting chat with a professional geneticist years ago when I was told, "Everything is genetic". He then aded, "&#8230;of course, an endocrinologist will tell you everything is hormonal!" A broken leg is not genetic, but a tendency to brittle bones might be. So, yes, I'd say a tendency to Laminitis is genetic&#8230;as is a tendency to getting sweet itch&#8230;or breaking bones. It is the breeder's job to aim to breed from stock that is 100% perfect.

(No Laminitis or sweet itch here yet, touch wood).
 
Definitely true and many that have been prepared as yearlings for the sales will have had low grade laminitis, may not have physically been lame but will have had feet damaged by the amount of feed pumped into them
 
Dry Rot said:
Genetics/breeding is a subject that few understand and, when you think you do, it will surely up it's ugly had and kick you firmly in the back side!

I had a very interesting chat with a professional geneticist years ago when I was told, "Everything is genetic". He then aded, "&#8230;of course, an endocrinologist will tell you everything is hormonal!" A broken leg is not genetic, but a tendency to brittle bones might be. So, yes, I'd say a tendency to Laminitis is genetic&#8230;as is a tendency to getting sweet itch&#8230;or breaking bones. It is the breeder's job to aim to breed from stock that is 100% perfect.

(No Laminitis or sweet itch here yet, touch wood).
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So he would've advised not to breed from horses that have suffered from lami in the past? (im just asking...not planning on breeding anything!!!) You think it likely the offspring would also be likely to suffer from it???
 
Kazza1 said:
So he would've advised not to breed from horses that have suffered from lami in the past? (im just asking...not planning on breeding anything!!!) You think it likely the offspring would also be likely to suffer from it???
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I am saying that if I knew of Laminitis in a line, I would not breed from any close relatives unless there were no alternatives and the individual was exceptional. I would then be watching the progeny with a very critical eye. I sold off several brood mares because they were inclined to put on too much weight and needed persistent dieting. For one thing, I can't be bothered!:) I don't know if the propensity is inherited but if some breeds are predisposed to the condition (or any other), it does seem likely, doesn't it? All breeds, by definition, are to a certain extent inbred and strains and lines within those breeds more so.
 
Dry Rot said:
I am saying that if I knew of Laminitis in a line, I would not breed from any close relatives unless there were no alternatives and the individual was exceptional. I would then be watching the progeny with a very critical eye. I sold off several brood mares because they were inclined to put on too much weight and needed persistent dieting. For one thing, I can't be bothered!:) I don't know if the propensity is inherited but if some breeds are predisposed to the condition (or any other), it does seem likely, doesn't it? All breeds, by definition, are to a certain extent inbred and strains and lines within those breeds more so.
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As Laminitis is in most cases a disease of POOR Management to me this would be a ridiculous reason for not breeding from a particular mare. There are far more important factors to consider, such as quality of conformation, action, temperament. Personally I would prefer a good doer over a poor doer any day. Not just for economic reasons but it is far easier to feed the right type of feed for the discipline if you are not having to worry about keeping weight on a horse.

ANY horse can come down with Laminitis if the right conditions exist.

Some horses are more predisposed to Laminitis and not in any particular breed.

I've had native ponies that have lived out year round and never had laminitis, I've seen TB yearlings with low grade Laminitis because of the quantity of feed being pushed into them to 'Grow them Big' for the Yearling Sales.

My Clydesdale mare is a fatty and I watch her diet really carefully, she still lives out 24/7 but her paddock has very short grass in it. Yet I have friends with Clydesdales who have to hard feed to keep weight on them.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/More-Insights-Into-Laminitis-Arabian/dp/1446156931 - Research into dealing with Laminitis in Arabians

http://www.ker.com/library/Proceedings/08/5_Laminitis_p57.pdf - Research by Kentucky Equine Research
 
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