_MizElz_
Well-Known Member
This is a rant - I will warn you now.
I posted the other day with a query about 'normal' procedure regarding refunds when withdrawing from a competition. I entered two weeks ago for an event set to take place this weekend; however, due to a problem with my mare's back, I am no longer able to compete. The entry fee for this event (unaffiliated) was £50.
I shall start at the beginning. The show centre in question is highly renowned in our area - famous for its good facilities and for the quality of service it provides. I have been competing there since the age of five - 17 years. It has always been my favourite venue, right from my Pony Club days through to when we jumped BSJA. When we qualified there for the Trailblazers finals in 2002, we made sure that as much mention was made of the centre as possible, and when we went on to become Reserve Champions, we ensured that the centre was given the credit it deserved in the ensuing press and media coverage - it seemed only fair. After giving up show jumping six years ago, we have not been there half as much as we used to (although we have done a couple of dressage comps).
Last year, I emailed the centre early in the summer to offer my services as a helper. I fancied getting out and about and seeing some 'proper' horsey action whilst waiting to go back to Uni, and because I had always enjoyed going there it seemed a nice idea to volunteer my time. They practically bit my hand off; within a couple of days I was there doing some dressage writing and some stewarding for them, and I was also a XC steward in the collecting ring for two whole days at another event (BE) that the centre's secretary was organising.
Ok, so that's the history. Never had any problems; always found it to be a very welcoming place with amenable, friendly staff.
In light of our 'history' with the centre (at the forefront of my mind was the fact that I gave up so much time for them - without recompense - last year), I hoped that I may be able to negotiate a return of some of my entry fee. I emailed the centre on Friday to let them know of my decision to withdraw - it was Friday that I made the decision that Ellie would not be fit to ride, and I wanted to let them know ASAP. I fully expected them to retain some of the fee for administrative costs; it seemed only fair.
This is the email I sent:
Dear XXXX
My horse and I are all entered up for your horse trials next weekend. Unfortunately, I think I am going to have to withdraw - she's got a fly bite under her saddle area that has gone septic, and there is no way I am going to be back in the saddle early enough to get her fit for the competition.
I wanted to let you know ASAP in the hope that I may be able to salvage at least some of my entry fee - I know you state on your schedule that you do not refund when competitors withdraw, but I wondered whether this may be possible as I have been able to inform you a week in advance? I have helped out at several of your events in the past and would be happy to do so again throughout this summer.
I had no reply for nearly two days, and when I rang to speak to them I was asked to phone back; when I did, there was no answer. On Sunday, I had an email back stating, quite bluntly, that if I worked there on the date of the ODE, then they would refund my fee (or half if I worked half a day.) At this point, a friend of mine at the yard said she'd be happy to take over my entry fee and pay me separately - she'd entered over the telephone, and not yet paid. I emailed them to this effect, but received no reply. My friend then rang the centre on Monday to let them know, and they flatly refused, at which point I decided I needed to speak to them properly.
If I'm honest, I'm still in shock about the conversation that followed. The secretary - the same lady I have dealt with so many times in the past, the same lady from whom I have emails requesting my help at events - denied any knowledge of me having helped there in the past - apparently they have 'no record' of me whatsoever. When I then said that I would be happy to work there over the summer but that it would be tricky for me to help this weekend, she laughed and said that I obviously wouldn't have been able to compete anyway, if I had other plans (the implication being that I simply wanted to wriggle out of the event, and that there was nothing wrong with my horse at all. In actual fact, my 'plans' for the weekend consist of an appointment with the saddler to check that Ellie's saddle is not contributing to the problem, and secondly of going to my aunt's birthday party, which I was going to have to miss had I been competing.) She then told me that if I had withdrawn prior to close of entries (last Monday) then they would have refunded me...this made me incredibly cross, because last Monday there was no problem - I fully expected Ellie to be rideable by now!
I then questioned the fact that my friend - having not yet paid - would be able to withdraw without losing her money, to which her initial retort was 'she would not be welcome here any longer if she withdrew and then didnt send us payment' - however she later backtracked and said something along the lines of 'but then X is a valued and loyal client.' So it's one rule for one, and another for others I think! For what it's worth here, I have another good friend who jumps there regularly, and I know for a fact that they have accepted telephone entries from him without payment, in spite of the fact that their schedule states otherwise. Something is very unfair here.
I did not lose my temper - God knows how - and I said nothing rude nor offensive, but she eventually lost patience with what I consider to be my perfectly rational arguments and told me that if I 'carried on in this way' then they would never accept an entry from me again. At this point, I thanked her for her time and hung up - I was fuming.
I phoned Mum to let her know what had happened, and she rang them almost immediately. She is obviously more rational than I am - perhaps because she has run numerous events herself and dealt with many such problems in the past. She also reminded them of Trailblazers and the publicity they received because of us, and she backed me up (although I cant believe she needed to) about me having helped there last year. The bottom line is, she has negotiated a 50% refund.
Maybe I am out of order for expecting any money back, but I fail to see how it is justifiable for a centre to retain 100% of a £50 entry fee when they are given 9 days' notice of withdrawal. I never expected a full refund, so I like to hope I was not being unreasonable. Mum said that in her experience of running shows, she always included a 'no refunds' clause in the schedule, but that in reality, she always made sure that she considered each case on its own merits.
I think what has also really, really got to me is that I gave up my time willingly last year, and now, because it doesnt suit them, the centre are pleading ignorance to this fact. Somewhere in the depths of cyberspace I still have the emails requesting my help, and the people I worked with on the days I was there would also back me up if necessary - not that it should be the case. I never expected anything in return for helping, but what shocks me is that I have been made out to be a liar, as well as being insulted and laughed at. When Mum spoke to the secretary on the phone, she denied having told me I wouldnt be welcome there, but to be honest, now I have really had the chance to consider the whole thing rationally, I don't ever want to give them another penny of my money again.
I'm sorry for the rant; I just needed to get it off my chest. I'm quite hurt by the way it has been handled; I like to think I am not a confrontational person - certainly it is not something that has been levelled at me before - and whilst I didnt want to come over as a whinging brat, I did feel that my arguments were justified. I'm beginning to wish I hadnt started competing again; times have obviously changed a lot.
I posted the other day with a query about 'normal' procedure regarding refunds when withdrawing from a competition. I entered two weeks ago for an event set to take place this weekend; however, due to a problem with my mare's back, I am no longer able to compete. The entry fee for this event (unaffiliated) was £50.
I shall start at the beginning. The show centre in question is highly renowned in our area - famous for its good facilities and for the quality of service it provides. I have been competing there since the age of five - 17 years. It has always been my favourite venue, right from my Pony Club days through to when we jumped BSJA. When we qualified there for the Trailblazers finals in 2002, we made sure that as much mention was made of the centre as possible, and when we went on to become Reserve Champions, we ensured that the centre was given the credit it deserved in the ensuing press and media coverage - it seemed only fair. After giving up show jumping six years ago, we have not been there half as much as we used to (although we have done a couple of dressage comps).
Last year, I emailed the centre early in the summer to offer my services as a helper. I fancied getting out and about and seeing some 'proper' horsey action whilst waiting to go back to Uni, and because I had always enjoyed going there it seemed a nice idea to volunteer my time. They practically bit my hand off; within a couple of days I was there doing some dressage writing and some stewarding for them, and I was also a XC steward in the collecting ring for two whole days at another event (BE) that the centre's secretary was organising.
Ok, so that's the history. Never had any problems; always found it to be a very welcoming place with amenable, friendly staff.
In light of our 'history' with the centre (at the forefront of my mind was the fact that I gave up so much time for them - without recompense - last year), I hoped that I may be able to negotiate a return of some of my entry fee. I emailed the centre on Friday to let them know of my decision to withdraw - it was Friday that I made the decision that Ellie would not be fit to ride, and I wanted to let them know ASAP. I fully expected them to retain some of the fee for administrative costs; it seemed only fair.
This is the email I sent:
Dear XXXX
My horse and I are all entered up for your horse trials next weekend. Unfortunately, I think I am going to have to withdraw - she's got a fly bite under her saddle area that has gone septic, and there is no way I am going to be back in the saddle early enough to get her fit for the competition.
I wanted to let you know ASAP in the hope that I may be able to salvage at least some of my entry fee - I know you state on your schedule that you do not refund when competitors withdraw, but I wondered whether this may be possible as I have been able to inform you a week in advance? I have helped out at several of your events in the past and would be happy to do so again throughout this summer.
I had no reply for nearly two days, and when I rang to speak to them I was asked to phone back; when I did, there was no answer. On Sunday, I had an email back stating, quite bluntly, that if I worked there on the date of the ODE, then they would refund my fee (or half if I worked half a day.) At this point, a friend of mine at the yard said she'd be happy to take over my entry fee and pay me separately - she'd entered over the telephone, and not yet paid. I emailed them to this effect, but received no reply. My friend then rang the centre on Monday to let them know, and they flatly refused, at which point I decided I needed to speak to them properly.
If I'm honest, I'm still in shock about the conversation that followed. The secretary - the same lady I have dealt with so many times in the past, the same lady from whom I have emails requesting my help at events - denied any knowledge of me having helped there in the past - apparently they have 'no record' of me whatsoever. When I then said that I would be happy to work there over the summer but that it would be tricky for me to help this weekend, she laughed and said that I obviously wouldn't have been able to compete anyway, if I had other plans (the implication being that I simply wanted to wriggle out of the event, and that there was nothing wrong with my horse at all. In actual fact, my 'plans' for the weekend consist of an appointment with the saddler to check that Ellie's saddle is not contributing to the problem, and secondly of going to my aunt's birthday party, which I was going to have to miss had I been competing.) She then told me that if I had withdrawn prior to close of entries (last Monday) then they would have refunded me...this made me incredibly cross, because last Monday there was no problem - I fully expected Ellie to be rideable by now!
I then questioned the fact that my friend - having not yet paid - would be able to withdraw without losing her money, to which her initial retort was 'she would not be welcome here any longer if she withdrew and then didnt send us payment' - however she later backtracked and said something along the lines of 'but then X is a valued and loyal client.' So it's one rule for one, and another for others I think! For what it's worth here, I have another good friend who jumps there regularly, and I know for a fact that they have accepted telephone entries from him without payment, in spite of the fact that their schedule states otherwise. Something is very unfair here.
I did not lose my temper - God knows how - and I said nothing rude nor offensive, but she eventually lost patience with what I consider to be my perfectly rational arguments and told me that if I 'carried on in this way' then they would never accept an entry from me again. At this point, I thanked her for her time and hung up - I was fuming.
I phoned Mum to let her know what had happened, and she rang them almost immediately. She is obviously more rational than I am - perhaps because she has run numerous events herself and dealt with many such problems in the past. She also reminded them of Trailblazers and the publicity they received because of us, and she backed me up (although I cant believe she needed to) about me having helped there last year. The bottom line is, she has negotiated a 50% refund.
Maybe I am out of order for expecting any money back, but I fail to see how it is justifiable for a centre to retain 100% of a £50 entry fee when they are given 9 days' notice of withdrawal. I never expected a full refund, so I like to hope I was not being unreasonable. Mum said that in her experience of running shows, she always included a 'no refunds' clause in the schedule, but that in reality, she always made sure that she considered each case on its own merits.
I think what has also really, really got to me is that I gave up my time willingly last year, and now, because it doesnt suit them, the centre are pleading ignorance to this fact. Somewhere in the depths of cyberspace I still have the emails requesting my help, and the people I worked with on the days I was there would also back me up if necessary - not that it should be the case. I never expected anything in return for helping, but what shocks me is that I have been made out to be a liar, as well as being insulted and laughed at. When Mum spoke to the secretary on the phone, she denied having told me I wouldnt be welcome there, but to be honest, now I have really had the chance to consider the whole thing rationally, I don't ever want to give them another penny of my money again.
I'm sorry for the rant; I just needed to get it off my chest. I'm quite hurt by the way it has been handled; I like to think I am not a confrontational person - certainly it is not something that has been levelled at me before - and whilst I didnt want to come over as a whinging brat, I did feel that my arguments were justified. I'm beginning to wish I hadnt started competing again; times have obviously changed a lot.
, take it as experience ready for next time 
