Are owners less able or willing to deal with things with horses themselves.

[setterlover]

As title.Just musing are horse owners now less able or willing to deal with things themselves
Twisted shoe. I am 3rd generation horsey and my dad taught me how to take a shoe off if it was twisted .I have the tools to do it and can remove a shoe in a few minutes.
Cuts I generally clip the area to get a good look and flush with running cold water to assess whether to get the vet .
Horse off colour take temperature count resperation and heart rate (pulse)
Suspected abscess.clean foot thoughly scrub sole in warm water to check for anything obvious call the farrier .(Dad always said foot was farrier first)
If I do need a vet I can give them vital signs and other relevant information in the initial phone call.
These are things that I was taught as a youngster.We made checks ,assessed the situation and called vet or farrier as required.
Maybe people just run to the vet first now.
I'm not saying no vet but unless it is blinding a vet job (heavy bleeding obvious colic )assess and then make the call if necessary but even if it is blinding obviously a vet call know what the do while waiting.

 

[Alibear]

I get what you're saying, but as a counterpoint, aren't people being led in that direction, too? There are so many more people to consult now; podiatrists, physios/chiro/osteo/massage, and saddle fitters have been around for a long time, but now we have bitting and bridle fitting experts, nutritionists, weighbridge people, etc. Back in pre-covid days there were even people with mobile 3.5-tonne lorries travelling around offering washing and spa services; I haven't seen those in recent years
The push to make sure you consult a professional almost takes away from the do-it-yourself approach.
I admit I have the tools to remove shoes, and I have been shown them once, but there was such a long gap before I needed to do it that I did ask for help. With how often Amber removes hers, it's something I should revisit, although so far, she's very good at removing them completely and cleanly. Which I'm grateful for.

 

[Bonnie Allie]

I think it’s the opposite now that we have so much information sharing.

Vet only called for colic, blood, catastrophic injury or ongoing unsolved illness. Most people can pull a shoe, deal with an abscess, flush a wound, know the early signs of laminitis and bandage effectively. Plus if you have done your PC certificates you have loads of practice!

The non-health related services that I scratch my head at are the plaiting services or tack cleaning services. Can’t do that yourself?

 

[setterlover]

I think it’s the opposite now that we have so much information sharing.

Vet only called for colic, blood, catastrophic injury or ongoing unsolved illness. Most people can pull a shoe, deal with an abscess, flush a wound, know the early signs of laminitis and bandage effectively. Plus if you have done your PC certificates you have loads of practice!

The non-health related services that I scratch my head at are the plaiting services or tack cleaning services. Can’t do that yourself?

From amount of times I am phoned to pull a shoe I'm not sure most people can pull a shoe.
A neighbour who has owed horses for 50 years called me to look at her horse she thought wasn't right .I asked have you taken temperature answer no respirations no pulse rate no .
I think a lot of us can deal with these things but by no means most people.

 

[SEL]

There are some people I wish would call a vet more often / more quickly!! Using Dr Google isn't always the best way forward.

I've dithered over my Appy's eyes a few times, especially as she seems to get flare ups on weekends. Two of those times I got the vet and perhaps that was overkill but it gave me peace of mind. I also had to get them when she stuck blackthorn up her nose. The cut itself wasn't horrendous but I knew we'd need antibiotics purely because of the plant. There have been plenty of times when I wish they'd been a bit more like farm vets though and just dropped me off the drugs rather than needing to come out to clean a cut nose / puffy eye / another hole.

I'm ok with shoe removal, abscesses and normal cuts. Temperature / resps fine. Expert at bandaging! I hardly ever used a poultice until I was on a yard with rye grass fields and it was abscess after abscess - you get good very quickly.

Interested to hear what others think plus you've made me wonder if my thermometer still works and if my first aid kit needs stocking up.

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

I think many people buy a horse with very little experience of horse care and no back up from close family, so they need input from professionals. I'm not sure that they then build up their own knowledge though.

 

[reynold]

Also if on a livery yard the staff may be reluctant to assess/treat and instead will insist on calling a vet/professional in case the horse owner subsequently sues them if things go wrong.

The american 'litigation culture' is now well embedded over here sadly.

 

[lynz88]

I think many people buy a horse with very little experience of horse care and no back up from close family, so they need input from professionals. I'm not sure that they then build up their own knowledge though.

there seems to be a general lack of willingness to learn and build knowledge that extends beyond the horse world. I had never heard of a bitting or bridle fitting expert until a few weeks ago....I guess people can make even a partial living if there are people who are unwilling to learn and would rather just pay. It makes me think of the number of people who don't know how to paint a wall....they just call someone.

 

[Surbie]

I think many people buy a horse with very little experience of horse care and no back up from close family, so they need input from professionals. I'm not sure that they then build up their own knowledge though.

Absolutely agree. I don't think there is a baseline amount of training for new owners, particularly those who start as adults and perhaps this is something the BHS could do more on? I know I found it quite daunting.

I was lucky - for a while I had a helpful, knowledgeable YM & soaked up what I could, have a great farrier, and I want to learn.

Lots of new owners don't have those resources or realise it's stuff they SHOULD know. Equally not every busy farrier has the time and not every YM is that knowledgeable either.

I've been surprised at how little plant knowledge there is, to add to basics of husbandry. Including being able to recognise ragwort, hemlock or sycamore.

However I have no clue how to bandage and that's on my list to learn this summer. Just in case.

 

[Lucky Snowball]

I remove shoes, have all the tools. Happy to release abscess etc but usually only on my own horses in case of litigation.

 

[teapot]

In a world of increasing knowledge, the average human’s actual knowledge is declining imho. Whether that’s how you treat a minor cut on a horse through to finding out about something yourself.

No one seems to want to learn anymore, instead it’s whack into google, or for horses, fall for decent marketing and end up paying through the nose for advice your more worldly wise bit old school yard manager could provide over a cup of tea.

 

[Barton Bounty]

I agree OP if your of the generation that had to do things yourself your more inclined to.
The only time Ive called a farrier for an abscess was because it was a stone bruise and needed pairing back.
Otherwise , vet only serious and above.

If we thought about it they really instinctively know what to do.

Sometimes the older methods are the best anyway, rather than a 20year old vet coming out thats scared to pick a hoof up

 

[Kaylum]

there seems to be a general lack of willingness to learn and build knowledge that extends beyond the horse world. I had never heard of a bitting or bridle fitting expert until a few weeks ago....I guess people can make even a partial living if there are people who are unwilling to learn and would rather just pay. It makes me think of the number of people who don't know how to paint a wall....they just call someone.

Seeing how people have no knowledge on how bits or bridles fit or work, there is a great need for people to up their learning on this subject. I was showing a couple whose horses had Dutch gags how they work. They had no idea they needed a strap to stabilise them. They just used them as they were told to by their friends. Go to shows and I cringe at the bridles and how badly fitted they are. This is basic stuff.

 

[lynz88]

it just surprises me that none of this seems to be taught even in the riding schools??? I remember we would have "learning nights" which would be focused on bandaging, fitting tack, braiding, etc. This was many many years ago and not in this country and you wouldn't be an expert on doing any of these by the end but you would come away with at least some basic knowledge

 

[reynold]

Lack of people joining Pony Club and instead going straight to the competition systems of BE, BD, BS

Also the fact that the old 'working pupil' way of learning from experienced YOs and horsemen have been replaced with college courses with teaching very narrow and the 'call a professional' taught as the 'safe' thing to do. (and yes, I know WPs were exploited a lot but they did generally learn 'useful' basics)

Also riding schools not having the time/resources to push/help interested adult learners into doing the basic BHS 'stage' exams. I did stage 1 and 2 long before I ever got my first horse and then went on to do stage 3 and the AI out of interest rather than as my main career.

 

[Nonjumper]

Tack fitting and tacking up I learned at riding school, along with how to skip out a stable and groom during one of their summer camps; other stuff I learned at Pony Club. Minor cuts and scrapes I can deal with but I have to say I wouldn't be going anywhere near an foot abscess. I wouldn't remove a shoe either.

However I'm not sure how much of the care and management side is still taught by riding schools, you have to do formal qualifications instead which the majority of the horse owning public just aren't interested in.

 

[teapot]

Just from a riding school perspective - we used to organise training sessions, two hours, not too expensive on a range of topics, and it was always the same few people booking on. Those who needed those courses most felt they already knew it all so never booked. We tried everything to remove the formality, make it fun, interesting, guest speakers etc - nothing.

I’ve heard from now ex-colleagues that trying to teach teenagers has a whole new dynamic of being ‘a tik-tok rider’ ie they only care about what they can post on their social media. Knowledge, learning, progression, relationship with horses etc isn’t why they are riding.

I am sure the same could be said for those who buy a horse, go xc schooling once and head off to an BE event to then post all over Facebook for their mates to congratulate them, while the horse is fat/unfit/had three stops/four poles/rider can’t sit over a fence etc

(Am being awfully cynical here but I see it time and time again )

 

[lynz88]

that's really sad teapot. I remember growing up, if you were riding and taking lessons via a school, then you were interested in everything. But then again, I grew up in the age where the internet first became commercialized and that was later in my childhood....textbooks and library based research were the norm for much of it

 

[Pearlsacarolsinger]

Seeing how people have no knowledge on how bits or bridles fit or work, there is a great need for people to up their learning on this subject. I was showing a couple whose horses had Dutch gags how they work. They had no idea they needed a strap to stabilise them. They just used them as they were told to by their friends. Go to shows and I cringe at the bridles and how badly fitted they are. This is basic stuff.

It is a while ago now but I was looking in a local tack shop for a 6" French link bit for my ID. I was offered a Dr Bristol!
Not by the owner who I'm sure would have known the difference but by the middle-aged horse owner who worked there on Sundays. I was surprised that she had so little knowledge.
Its a good job that knew what I needed, a less experienced customer could easily have been sold a more severe bit than they were looking for.

Also, the saddle-fitter complimented me when I pointed out the lumpy flocking that I was asking her to rectify. She told me that many owners wouldn't have recognised the problem. I was amazed as it was obvious and I am not the most diligent tack cleaner

 

[Gamebird]

Well I'm going to disagree with the bit/bridle comments! I am neither lacking in knowledge or unwilling to learn. In fact that is why I have booked an appointment with one! For context I have decades of riding/owning experience (competing, schooling, selling), and have worked professionally on yards. I do dentistry on horses most days, and have a good knowledge of anatomy and physiology. I have 40 or 50 bits in my tackroom and understand the principles of how they work. My current horse goes OK in his bit, but I think that he is not yet in the perfect bit for him. There are so many minor variations in bits now - brands, materials, angles, lozenge size/angle, curved/not-curved, tongue pressure/tongue relief etc. etc. I figure it could take me a year or more to go through all the different variables and work out exactly which is the optimum bit for him. If I can cut that process short and get to the end point more quickly and cheaply then that for me is worth consulting a specialist for. And I will add to my knowledge bank in the process.

Like someone else said, the people who think they have it all sussed are the people least likely to have an open mind and seek further education.

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

Most people can pull a shoe, deal with an abscess, flush a wound, know the early signs of laminitis and bandage effectively. Plus if you have done your PC certificates you have loads of practice!

I find the exact opposite unfortunately, most people around here anyway, and when I lived in the UK absolutely can not do those things. I do agree that if some have done their PC stuff they will probably be more knowledgeable, but so many adults and children seem to just learn to ride for a few months then buy a 'made' horse or pony and off they go with hardly a clue how to care for the poor beast.

 

[Highmileagecob]

Possibly a generational thing. I also deal with scrapes and cuts, early lameness, abscesses, thorns etc.. The young people on the yard used to be amazed - aren't you calling the vet? that looks bad to me, oh gosh, are you getting the farrier out? and so on. Five years down the line, the younger ones now clean wounds, poultice for a couple of days, set their own box rest etc.. Maybe it's a confidence thing as well, you have to want to learn and there are still those who call the vet out for absolutely every small detail.

 

[AShetlandBitMeOnce]

I can deal with most basic things but sometimes I'd rather just spend the £50-£100 to make sure I've not missed something/got it wrong

 

[Surbie]

Just from a riding school perspective - we used to organise training sessions, two hours, not too expensive on a range of topics, and it was always the same few people booking on. Those who needed those courses most felt they already knew it all so never booked. We tried everything to remove the formality, make it fun, interesting, guest speakers etc - nothing.

I’ve heard from now ex-colleagues that trying to teach teenagers has a whole new dynamic of being ‘a tik-tok rider’ ie they only care about what they can post on their social media. Knowledge, learning, progression, relationship with horses etc isn’t why they are riding.

I am sure the same could be said for those who buy a horse, go xc schooling once and head off to an BE event to then post all over Facebook for their mates to congratulate them, while the horse is fat/unfit/had three stops/four poles/rider can’t sit over a fence etc

(Am being awfully cynical here but I see it time and time again )

Your riding school sounds ace. As an adult returner to riding, none of the riding schools I went to offered any kind of additional sessions other than riding, unless you wanted to do the BHS stages, which they marketed as for people wanting to learn to teach. The kids sessions that had 'stable management' tacked onto them were focused on grooming and points of a horse.

 

[teapot]

that's really sad teapot. I remember growing up, if you were riding and taking lessons via a school, then you were interested in everything. But then again, I grew up in the age where the internet first became commercialized and that was later in my childhood....textbooks and library based research were the norm for much of it

Attitudes were definitely changing while I was there, not helped by let’s Google that parents who also thought horses = bike/toy. ‘My daughter has nothing to ride, want a substitute’. That’s because your daughter doesn’t understand you can’t rag a pony silly during half term and expect it to keep on going.

So we even tried parent only sessions, like fittening, loading, traveling, what to look for if you want to jump on grass ground wise. Absolute tumbleweed and it wasn’t for want of trying! You can’t educate stupid, or arrogant. Meanwhile you had to take a step back and make a judgment call as to when you step in for the sake of the horse. One of the many reasons I walked away.

I’m of that read a book, read H&P mag every week, ask questions, help out generation. Kids especially have lost some of what we had and that undoubtedly will have a negative impact. That said you try to offer an alternative and it was tumbleweed so…

 

[ihatework]

The average horse owner really has lost a lot of basic knowledge on horse care, for some of those maybe it's confidence too?
FWIW I pull shoes, rasp foot, will have an initial scrape for suspect abcess (but wont go properly digging), will monitor mild swelling/lameness for a few days and will go with my gut as to whether is a vet job or not. I fit my own saddles and would only get a pro in if I had an issue. Will do my own initial lameness checks, I have a pretty high strike rate on those. More than happy to inject and although I have been shown IV I generally avoid that.

 

[Snowfilly]

I think it’s because there’s a lot of one horse owners who might be on livery yards and not had the depth of experience that comes from seeing dozens or hundreds of horses across the years.

If you’ve always been around horses and multiple horses of different backgrounds at that, you’re far more likely to have seen X, Y and Z in real life and know what to do with it.

I tend not to bother with vets unless it’s colic, teeth or weird ongoing lameness related and since having had a vet be awkward about a PTS, I no longer involve them for that unless they’re already on site either.

But where do you pick up this knowledge? College courses preach call a professional, pony clubs are only an option if you have your own pony, riding clubs are often focussed on competition stuff and riding schools do far less unmounted stuff than when I was a kid.

I see some places do structured lessons on stable management but where do you get the gradual experience of ‘this horse was being an idiot in his field yesterday and is 1/10th lame so let him have a few days off’ v ‘this normally honest horse is beginning to lay his ears back in transitions and is 1/10th lame on the right rein, let’s call the vet’ when it looks so similar and you can’t magically produce sick / lame horses for lessons!

 

[teapot]

Well I'm going to disagree with the bit/bridle comments! I am neither lacking in knowledge or unwilling to learn. In fact that is why I have booked an appointment with one! For context I have decades of riding/owning experience (competing, schooling, selling), and have worked professionally on yards. I do dentistry on horses most days, and have a good knowledge of anatomy and physiology. I have 40 or 50 bits in my tackroom and understand the principles of how they work. My current horse goes OK in his bit, but I think that he is not yet in the perfect bit for him. There are so many minor variations in bits now - brands, materials, angles, lozenge size/angle, curved/not-curved, tongue pressure/tongue relief etc. etc. I figure it could take me a year or more to go through all the different variables and work out exactly which is the optimum bit for him. If I can cut that process short and get to the end point more quickly and cheaply then that for me is worth consulting a specialist for. And I will add to my knowledge bank in the process.

Like someone else said, the people who think they have it all sussed are the people least likely to have an open mind and seek further education.

Brilliant example - you recognise the gaps in your knowledge and no doubt have ensured everything else is 100% with the horse before making that phone call.

Whereas I’m sure we’ve all met people who have rocked up with their new shiny three figure bit because it’s ’what they recommended’ and found it’s made the horse worse/doesn’t fit/not the miracle worker it was sold as because hey guess what it’s not actually a bitting problem.

That’s where I think it gets dangerous because it’s all too easy to ring the bit person, whereas the horse could literally be telling them it’s a rider issue. That art of self reflection has been lost too I think?

 

[lynz88]

Well I'm going to disagree with the bit/bridle comments! I am neither lacking in knowledge or unwilling to learn. In fact that is why I have booked an appointment with one! For context I have decades of riding/owning experience (competing, schooling, selling), and have worked professionally on yards. I do dentistry on horses most days, and have a good knowledge of anatomy and physiology. I have 40 or 50 bits in my tackroom and understand the principles of how they work. My current horse goes OK in his bit, but I think that he is not yet in the perfect bit for him. There are so many minor variations in bits now - brands, materials, angles, lozenge size/angle, curved/not-curved, tongue pressure/tongue relief etc. etc. I figure it could take me a year or more to go through all the different variables and work out exactly which is the optimum bit for him. If I can cut that process short and get to the end point more quickly and cheaply then that for me is worth consulting a specialist for. And I will add to my knowledge bank in the process.

Like someone else said, the people who think they have it all sussed are the people least likely to have an open mind and seek further education.

This makes sense and I gather those that have properly been around horses would do the same for the same reason (I know I would). I suspect that those people are fewer and farther between though I'm happy to be wrong about that!

 

[Gamebird]

Attitudes were definitely changing while I was there, not helped by let’s Google that parents who also thought horses = bike/toy. ‘My daughter has nothing to ride, want a substitute’. That’s because your daughter doesn’t understand you can’t rag a pony silly during half term and expect it to keep on going.

So we even tried parent only sessions, like fittening, loading, traveling, what to look for if you want to jump on grass ground wise. Absolute tumbleweed and it wasn’t for want of trying! You can’t educate stupid, or arrogant. Meanwhile you had to take a step back and make a judgment call as to when you step in for the sake of the horse. One of the many reasons I walked away.

I’m of that read a book, read H&P mag every week, ask questions, help out generation. Kids especially have lost some of what we had and that undoubtedly will have a negative impact. That said you try to offer an alternative and it was tumbleweed so…

We have always found this when trying to set up client education evenings at our vet practice. The people that need to come are the people who won't. The people who turn up are the people who generally already have that knowledge! And you cannot get people to turn up for talks on vacccinations or worming for love nor money, yet every day I am met with 'I don't vaccinate him because he doesn't go anywhere' - which shows a complete knowledge gap of how you 'catch' tetanus, how flu is transmitted, and the concepts of herd immunity. The same for worming - no-one will come to hear how we can do this best, avoid overworming and resistance, and keep our horses as healthy as possible, yet every day I meet people who worm once a year, or once a month, never test and use totally inappropriate products.

I could guarantee that no-one with an overweight pony would ever turn up to a talk about weight management!

I'd love to educate people, but the ones who need the education just won't turn up.