Backing youngsters

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Silvermiyazawa

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Those of you who have backed and brought on young horses, what experience did you have? Did you help others first, did someone help you or did you jump in feet first?

I ask as I have been window shopping (stress the WINDOW SHOPPING!) on the internet and the ones that appeal all seem to be under 4! Now I have been involved with horses for nearly 30 years (owning my own, competing, riding friends' and currently part loaning) but this has in no way equipped me to feel like I could do the job.

Please, before anyone jumps in and shouts that I'm obviously not up to the job - don't! I know I'm not and I'm not intending to try! I'm just curious/nosey :)
 
Read my old thread - did I make a massive mistake - that was buying a newly backed four year old - ok so 12 months on we're doing well but at what cost..? A hefty scar where back of my leg was cut away and alot spent on schooling. No way I'd buy a young one again but maybe I was unlucky , I defo bit off more that I could chew .
 
I did it. Went from no horse for 10 years to buying a 4year old. Would I do it again? No.

It was really difficult because I just didn't have the experience and I was too stubborn to sell him! Now after a lot of patience, sweat and even more tears I wouldn't change a thing! I have a great instructor (and sharer at the minute as I can't ride) he hasn't turned out half as bad as I thought he would ;-)

I did plan on having him schooled professionally but he used to rear etc in hand and I couldn't expect someone else to put themselves in danger so had to make a start myself. Once I was on board he was a piece of cake! x
 
I am in the process of :)

I'm only 16, had two loan ponies in the past but nothing serious, and now I'm full loaning a rising 6 year old who is being backed :) I have a tremendous riding instructor who has helped me no end.

I think it's possible for almost any one to back a youngster as long as the proper instruction is given along the way :)
 
Did the whole long lining/lunging with tack, also doing ride and lead out where I will take horse for first hack
Then leant over until horse was happy
Got on properly but still stayed low and was led around by my friend
Slowly started sitting up, until fully upright
Started off being led around in walk
Then went onto the lunge and did walk and trot
Then was led out on the hack that I had done the ride and lead
When horse happy did the same hack but not led.
When steering and breaks more established just hack and hack and hack until horse is turned away.
When bringing horse back into work, hack for a few weeks then gradually introduce school work.
 
As a teenager, I backed quiet a few horses, with the owners dad as anchor man. He was a great horse man, and I watched and learned from him for years. In 1997, I bought my first foal, he was a little accident, I asked the farrier said I'd love a foal. He came from the travellers, at 6 weeks, with a sad story that him mum was knocked down and killed. (As it turns out, she was pulling coal around Limerick city, so dont trust the sob stories anymore). Anyway, I hand reared him, he was so cheeky, he'd walk into the kitchen. I broke him myself, as a three year old, as he was brazen, and needed to be put to work. I had lots of experience backing,, but the groundwork was fairly new. He was great for the most part, only once did he take off in long reins, I learned to ski that day, but the funniest of all, when i sat on him for the first time, (on my own), he wouldnt go anywhere. I had to get off, tie up the reins, and put him back in the stable, go get my sister to get behind him. He flew it after that, and I was 8 weeks pregnant when I backed him. (i didnt know I was, wouldny have chanced it if i knew). Have been doing it since, on and off, and I would never tell anyone how long it takes, depends on the horse.
You should just go for it, and just remember, you are the boss(ie higher up in the herd), and you will be fine, no need for any violence, for the most part, when they misbehave when breaking, they dont understand what you are asking them to do.
Get yourself agood instructor, and you'll be sorted. xx
 
Don't encourage me!! Like I said I'm only really window shopping as I'm part loaning at the moment to get back into things after a 2 year break (I lost my old horse 4 weeks before I had my daughter). I just started wondering about folks' experiences after I started noticing some nice looking young 'uns.
 
Silvermiyazawa said:
Don't encourage me!! Like I said I'm only really window shopping as I'm part loaning at the moment to get back into things after a 2 year break (I lost my old horse 4 weeks before I had my daughter). I just started wondering about folks' experiences after I started noticing some nice looking young 'uns.
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I would comment that a young horse may also need another two years to grow and strengthen, it depends on the work you intend to do and the horse, but many young horses are ruined through over-straining mentally and physically, and this is part of the experience a handler needs to gain.
If you fancy doing it yourself, I suggest you get a strong pony, a quiet type, and halter broken. You can sell it after a year. Allow up to six months to have it backed and ridden away.
You can work through all the stages very steadily, you can't be sure of a time scale, as some horses are completely co-operative and learn quickly, seem pleased to have the attention.
Others, eg ones over four years old can be difficult, very very difficult, strong and bolshie, and NOT a pleasure to deal with. Beware of being sold a horse which someone tried to break, and failed!!!!!!!!! They are usually older, good looking, and cheap!
I speak from experience of breaking four over two years, two were kind and natural types, no hangups.
One was seven and unbroken [only discovered this when he arrived] ........ cue hospital and crutches!
One was an anxious type, easy enough to back but he has taken four years to fully mature, he struggled with strength and with balance. Still has his moments, he is still on magnesium calmer for good reason, he is not a first pony, but I could not have known that when I "rescued" him.
PS I used magnesium calmer on all my "breakers", also a really good lightweight rider to school, you probably occasionally need two people for most horses, but I backed three [out of four] mine bareback and alone, they were very very well handled, not rushed at all.
 
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It depends a lot on the horse, much more than most people seem to want to admit. Some horses are so easy they give a totally unrealistic impression ;), many others will take some care and effort but come out okay, others are very difficult and really need experienced handling (not just advice) to not end in tears. It is possible to get some idea of how a horse will be before you start but I'm not sure the average person without experience with young horses is going to see it, especially in the limited opportunity before purchase.

This means you have people saying, "It was so easy, everyone should do it!" while others say, "Never again!". "Young horses" are not a single group with limited characteristics!

I know that's not what you asked but I always think it's an issue on these "start your own" threads. I fairly often help people start their own and many times it's a great experience. But occasionally the experienced assistance I give is to say the horse in question is not suitable for the task at hand, however much it might be a horse they'd be fine with later on. You don't always get "do overs" in the breaking process and horses can pay a life time price if it goes really wrong.

Which is not to put you off, just to say this is why you will get really different responses and frankly, you can't really even guess what your own experience will be until you have an actual horse to consider.
 
My daughter and I backed our 2 3 year olds this year, and we had a fantastic experience.
It was the first time we backed any horse, and it will probably be the last as both are our long term horses.
I would love to do it again but I'm determined to stay at 2 horses only this time!

I think you will get wildly vearying replies as some are so easy, others are total horrors and only the bravest and most experienced can cope with them.

It's next year I'd expect problems as the teenage tantrums kick in, but we've brought on youngsters before (and a very trying one at that) so we feel well equipped to deal with them.
I think the following 2 years from backing is far more testing than the backing itself, the buggers throw everything at you.
 
I would rather buy a youngster and back it myself than end up with one that has been badly broken by someone else and sold on to rid them of the problems they have caused. Go for it but make sure you have someone solid to help you along the way. If you get the groundwork spot on then the actual backing and bringing on isn't a problem.
 
flying solo said:
I did plan on having him schooled professionally but he used to rear etc in hand and I couldn't expect someone else to put themselves in danger so had to make a start myself. Once I was on board he was a piece of cake! x
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I can assure you that most people with a difficult young horse will send it to be broken just to avoid dealing with the problem, anyway, no youngster should end up like that, it should have been properly handled when a baby.
 
Dolcé;11090852 said:
If you get the groundwork spot on then the actual backing and bringing on isn't a problem.
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Not always, some horses are sharp, ie they react so quickly that only a really good rider will stay on board, I knew a professional event rider who ended up in hospital after a youngster turned upside down, fast, that after three months of proper breaking and having been backed for six weeks.
I only came off once in first six months [met a "lion" in the woods], then was ejected twice on one hack a year later [horse was hyper, nervous and over-reactive that day].
 
I backed my first pony 9 years ago - I bought a 2 year old New Forest filly because she had just the temperament I was looking for. I'd ridden green ponies before but never been involved in the starting process, but figured that if I kept my end goal in sight (sensible, responsive pony to ride in all situations) and worked logically, calling on expert help when required, we'd be fine. And we were.

I'm currently backing my Kai-Pony who is a 4 year old that I've owned since he was 8 months old and he's just fab. I've done considerably more groundwork with him than I did with Dolly before backing her, and it's definitely paying dividends - after just 10 or 11 rides (about half of those without a ground person), he'll hack out sensibly alone or in company in walk and trot and is working nicely in walk in the arena.
 
I think it's down to the horse too and type of horse etc.

If you go buying some 17h fancy well bred youngster you might come a cropper

If you buy a pony or quiet small cob you will most likely be ok.

If you go ahead with it, be real sensible in your choice of horse.
 
I got my first youngster when I was 15- she was a 17hh 3yro filly and I was moving from my 14.2hh.

I'd never had anything to do with youngsters before but ridden a few green/naughty ones.

Thankfully my mare turned out to be the quietest, loveliest horse I could have chosen and I broke her myself with a book called 'The ABC of Breaking and Schooling'
She never put a foot wrong, never got her back up and was generally exceptionally easy until the day I sold her 5 years later :)

I have broken quite a few other horses since that and thank my lucky stars that first mare was so good- some of the others I had later I would have ruined if I bought them when I was so inexperienced and I think they would have put me off riding for life!
 
I bought my first youngster when I was 16. He was a backed 4 year old and we actually came out ok apart from a year later I started my a levels and my mum had to handle him a lot and he started taking advantage of her on the ground so we had to sell him.

Next young horse I bought a 2 1/2 year old when I finished my a levels and was having a gap year aged 18. I loved it! Had a few teething problems when he started to bronc when I rode him so sent him to a backing yard where I learnt a lot about reading the horse to prevent situations. He is now 5 and going fab! Going to be my dressage pony.

Next young horse I bought at start of first year of uni. A 2 year old exmoor pony. Backed her during second year of uni and did her completely myself and she went great! Had saddling issues due to her being so round but once sorted had no issues at all.

Now onto my 3rd, swapped the exmoor for a 3yr old connie x and have just started the groundwork and hoping to just have a sit on her this year and properly back her next year.

I think if you are at a livery, have a good Instructer and experienced people at the livery yard to help you, you will be fine although everyone makes mistakes but its just about learning from them. I find training young horses addictive and now would never buy a horse older than 5 as I find those backed and trained often have issues brought on by previous owners which can be harder to fix. I prefer having a blank canvas.
 
As a couple of people have mentioned it entirely depends upon the youngster. I don't neccesarily think breeding is the key either I think temperament is critical. Sadly you won't always know the horses temperament until you start it.
 
I love training any animal and get a lot of pleasure thinking out how to achieve my aims, but I'm an oldie and don't ride any more. There's an awful lot that can be done from the ground. We've recently taken two young Highland ponies (2 and 3) from tacking up to lightly backed in three short sessions, without one single buck or rear, simply because the preparatory work was very thoroughly done. I've now got experienced (25yo) help to complete the process and one will be ridden by a 12 year old on Saturday as she is going so well. All this just in the round pen so far, of course, but the foundations have been laid.

One of the yearlings let me throw a coat over her back and then drag it up over her head the other day so it was completely covered, she didn't move a muscle. I did this leaning over the gate! Another was sold as a 2yo and was to be vetted. The vet needed her in a dark place so she could examine her eyes. We simply threw a coat over her head and the vet disappeared underneath to complete the examination!

Highlands are pretty easy going anyway but it does help to desensitise from an early age so backing is just a gentle progression from earlier training.
 
I've just bought my 4th youngster, but he is only 6months old so got 3 years to wait to start him.

The first pony I backed was my 2nd pony, I was 12, I did it with the help of the yard owner. He was pretty difficult and you had to be calm and confident with him at all times (like you do with most youngsters).. If you got up tight he'd flip/freak out and you'd be 10 steps back before you knew it.

The 2nd youngster is my current mare, I bought her broken but got her and turned her away for 12 months to grow up and mature.. Re broke her myself and schooled her on.. She's now 6, hacks alone/company, jumps 1.20, schools to a reasonable level; half pass in walk/trot, counter canter, flying changes, halt to trot/canter, trot/canter to walk/halt etc. last year I took her to wales for champs of GB and she was placed twice :-) 4th and 8th out of 40 horses.. She was the youngest horse in the class.

The 3rd one was a section d mare, who I only got as far as lunging, long lining, leading out in hand and sitting on before I had to sell her to a friend (the person who backed my mare) because of a family fall out. That mare is now rising 5 and is a cracking child's pony.

And I have just bought myself a 6month foal, warmblood to make 16-16.2.. I'll start him at 3 and a half I expect, turn him away for 6-8 months once I have backed him and hacked him a few times and then bring him in for re backing at 4ish. Saying that; that's the plan but it does change depending on the horse.. He may not be ready to back until 4 or he could be ready to start at 3.. Time will tell :) but I am very excited!

I love babies and the only horses I have properly loved and bonded with have been youngsters.. Great fun if you have the time and patience!

:-)
 
Totally depends on the horse or pony that needs backing.

I have done a number of ponies on my own, they were quite easy to back and bring on, and I didnt require additional help.

My youngster now I did myself, but had help from a good friend getting him long-reining and then when I was first on him walking about, my friend had him on the lunge line so he could get youst to basic commands from me on board. He's big though, and quirky so in this case it was good to have an extra pair of hands for parts of his early stages of training.

No harm in getting help from others, or sending them away either if you do not feel like you can manage on your own or you dont have sufficient help to guide you.

It is very satisfying doing it on your own though, as you both learn together, and there is a sense of achievement doing it.
 
I recently got given a beautiful sec d 15.1 miteltroy mare @ only 3yo & unbroken. i haven't owned horses before but have ridden before on loaned ponys a few years back knew it would be a challenge but I've backed her myself, and she's been a diamond. Had her 8 weeks now & she's hacking out alone & in company. Trotting loverly haven't tried canter yet though :/ but she's pretty sensible, & learns fast. Lucky because Im in a livery with expirenced people with a instructor on standby if I should need anymore help :) :) if I get stuck @ any point I shall send her away to be schooled properly :) Sometimes you just have to jump in at the deepend. :)
 
Agree with what tarrsteps said about the horse. And I think as far as backing goes, the rider needs an independent balanced seat far more than anything else. My daughter backed & rode away her first last year aged 6. What made a massive difference was having owned the pony for 3yrs, & doing the right preparation beforehand. As I was always there, she had advice & support 24/7. And a pony who trusts her implicitly. It's not like at 6 she knew the aids for half pass, but she did have an independent balanced seat & confidence. Imo even with the best intentions, its easy to cause setbacks to a young horse because you aren't balanced yourself.
 
Thanks for your replies, nice to read about your experiences some interesting stuff there.

Sadly my internet window shopping will remain just that for now as I can't commit full time at the mo. I will (hopefully) continue to enjoy my part loan and work on finding my muscles again. Hopefully it's not too arrogant to say I am well balanced and do have an independent seat! There are some folks on the yard with youngsters - I will watch with interest (and hopefully not appear creepy!!).
 
I think "it depends"!! On the "horsonality" of the horse. Is he "laid back" or "hypo"?? The personality of the human "laid back" or "hypo"!!! Are you prepared to look at the horse and consider things from his point of view? Or do you "go by the book"?? Do you tend to "make assumptions"? This is far the commonest cause of problems!! It is so easy to overlook minute details....the first horse I started was great for about a year, then "suddenly" became hard to mount....yeah right!! I hadn't noticed the first signals she gave me!! And I continued mounting and landing in the saddle with a slight thump!! Yeah,,,,me....great rider "never landed with a thump"...yeah right!!! So spending time with her standing beside a log/mounting block/gate etc and taking the time to reassure her and mount QUIETLY made such a difference!! And I had had years and years of experience when I made this mistake!!! So you need to be very pragmatic and consider every option. Often it is better for a youngster to be taken as far as possible by the owner and then have a "professional" come and help with the final stages at the horses home, rather than sending the horse away "to be started" which is very very stressfull, for both horse and owner!!
 
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