Banning whip use in racing (except for safety)

Ban use of whips to make racehorses run faster (but use for safety still allowed)?


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fburton

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How would you feel about banning use of whips to make racehorses run faster (but use for steering and/or safety still allowed)?

In case people did see the other thread, "shown not to make any difference" refers to a recent study claiming to demonstrate statistically that whipping horses didn't make them run any faster.

(ETA: Option 1 should be "... whether or not ...")
 
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Wagtail

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I think it would be a good thing, but it needs to extend to show jumping too. No whips allowed for punishment! Elimination for yanking/sawing mouth.
 

amandap

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I voted ban whether it makes a horse go faster or not. I voted that because It will still be a level playing field and the millions watching will no longer see whipping daily and see it as just part of horse sport or management and so something you just do to horses.
 

BigRed

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How would you like it, if you were not allowed to carry a whip when you rode your horse, or if spurs were banned ? This is the next step for the anti's. Ultimately they would like to ban racing because horses die during races, next would come eventing and show jumping.

I think the felt covered whips that jokeys use are not likely to really hurt a horse and you see far worse happen at a local SJ event.

I think Jockeys should be fined for over-use of the whip. Unfortunately if a Jockey is seen as having not tried hard enough to win, he is also punished, so they can't win really.
 

A1fie

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How would you like it, if you were not allowed to carry a whip when you rode your horse, or if spurs were banned ? This is the next step for the anti's. Ultimately they would like to ban racing because horses die during races, next would come eventing and show jumping.

I think the felt covered whips that jokeys use are not likely to really hurt a horse and you see far worse happen at a local SJ event.

I think Jockeys should be fined for over-use of the whip. Unfortunately if a Jockey is seen as having not tried hard enough to win, he is also punished, so they can't win really.
Agree with this ^ ^ ^ Whips are not just used to make horses go faster.
 

sunleychops

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the Pro-Cush whips that are a legal requirement now are very soft and giving and will not cause any pain to the horse in any way. You are very stupid and naive if you think otherwise or that the BHA will let jockeys cause a horse any suffering or pain.
 

fburton

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I think Jockeys should be fined for over-use of the whip. Unfortunately if a Jockey is seen as having not tried hard enough to win, he is also punished, so they can't win really.
So let jockeys carry whips but not use them to (try to) make horses run faster. Then over-use becomes a non-issue.

They could still be used for steering and safety reasons.

Presumably horses do feel and/or fear the whip, even if it's cushioned - otherwise how does it work?
 

amandap

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I think Jockeys should be fined for over-use of the whip. Unfortunately if a Jockey is seen as having not tried hard enough to win, he is also punished, so they can't win really.
As I've written on another forum... if whip use for encouragement is stopped than the owners, trainers and punters will have to accept it! The jockey is off that hook and perhaps trainers etc. could learn to trust them more and observe the horse to see how much he is actually trying rather than use hitting and enthusiastic hitting as the measure.

I've also been wondering how much whip use, assuming it does work, contributes to horses over exerting themselves and collapsing or pulling ligaments, tendons or even breaking legs. Just musing here...
 

Haha

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the Pro-Cush whips that are a legal requirement now are very soft and giving and will not cause any pain to the horse in any way. You are very stupid and naive if you think otherwise or that the BHA will let jockeys cause a horse any suffering or pain.
Sooooo you'd be willing to let a happy whipper whip you and know it won't hurt??:confused:
 

Zuzan

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Given that there is evidence to suggest that whips don't make horses run faster what are the reasons for continuing to use them..... ???
 

fburton

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A 700kg animal with much thicker skin and a body being fuelled by adrenaline is not the same as a 9 stone human with thinner skin and a body fuelled by McDonalds, Carling and Nicotine tbh
Yet they are "sensitive" enough that whacking/tapping them with a whip does make a difference, despite the thick skin and adrenaline - supposedly.
 

Wagtail

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A 700kg animal with much thicker skin and a body being fuelled by adrenaline is not the same as a 9 stone human with thinner skin and a body fuelled by McDonalds, Carling and Nicotine tbh
700kg!!:eek: What size race horse is that?

Horses can feel a fly landing on them. So go figure...;)
 

Elf On A Shelf

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You guys need to go watch some of these Amateur/Conditional Hands And Heels Jump Races! They are classic!

Basically the jockeys are only allowed to use the whip 4 times in the entire race and ONLY in the final 4 strides before a fence if the horse is drifting and may cause a danger to others. They are allowed to Show the whip but are NOT allowed to strike the horse in the drive for home. Now ok these are young lads - 16-18 years old who are just starting out their careers and they are very good learning curbs for them but they are incredibly funny! Most of these lads are too scared to even move their whip hands incase they get disqalified!

So yes, the use of the whip is not necesarry for the finish but they are useful for keeping straight and concentrating. You would also be surprised at how much easier it is to balance with something to stick out the side of your hand!
 

glenruby

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7/8 times per race? Honestly, who can be counting when they are busy trying to win the race? I think that number is a bit ridiculous to be honest. To say something like 3 times inside the last furlong/2furlongs wouldnt be difficult as at least thats an easy number to count to when under pressure!

(As an aside, I know 2 jockeys who started off in showjumping and swithced to racing as they consitently missed the 6th fence out on sj courses - how will they fare?? Haha!
 

Shantara

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I think a little 'reminder' tap wouldn't be the end of the world, I've seen plenty of local shows (someone mentioned this above) where the riders just go "smacksmacksmacksmack" with the whip and "jabjabjab" with the spurs!

I don't think the whip should be allowed if the horse is extremely exhausted, however!
 

Elf On A Shelf

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I don't think the whip should be allowed if the horse is extremely exhausted, however!
Trouble is very few horses show just how tired they are until they finish the race and are slowing up as the adhrenaline is thundering through their bodies. I have lead horses in that have been bouncing off the walls after finishing their races but by the time they have got their saddle off they are truly knackered. Yes there are some that really are beggered but these horses would have already been pulled up or are so far behind that even if htey do finish they will not be in contention so the jockeys would really only be cajoling them back to the unsaddling boxes.
 

Laura_Grey

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I think the current suggestions are a little far fetched personally. How a jockey is supposed to keep count throughout the race is beyond me. I agree that in some races the whip is overused towards the end of the race, however the jockeys are punished strictly and accordingly. My friend was banned in his first boys hands and heals race for lifting his whip....it's a natural reaction when a horse hangs.

Just a thought....how many of you have come to an open ditch at 30 mph when your horse is backing off? Not nice I can tell you; a quick slap down the shoulder to refocus the mind is quite often all it takes.

Banning whips outright would be ludicrous. Eventing, show jumping etc will be next.....
 
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I disagree what the whips don't hurt. I have watched closely and see that although the end of the whip, the part supposedly for hitting with, (much like the flappy leather bit on a short crop) don't look hard. The stick part is still hard. And these horses are getting belted, full on, repeatedly with the whole length of the whip. don't try to tell me my own eyes are not telling me the truth.

Anyway, i think it's a pointles part. Yes, ok for straightening when jumping etc, a tap is ok. Not repeated belting to get a nose ahead at the finish line. If a horse is with lots of other horses running hell for leather, it's going to go fast. The only way to make a horse go faster at this point is fear and pain. If that's not what the whip is for then i don't see why it is needed. A dul thudding with no negative emotional reactions would not make these horses go faster.
 
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