Barefoot! Giving up...

R

rugrat

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thehorseloader.co.uk
Further down I see a post from a new barefooter and her horse appears to be doing great. My horse has gone 7 weeks so far without his shoes and I am leaning towards putting them back on, just the fronts though. I should clarify myself - he has been without back shoes for a year and did fine, took the fronts off 7 weeks ago and it has been a rollercoaster. I think he is progressing well but we have so so much road planings and stony tracks in our area that it is all a real pain and I am finding the whole thing very restrictive. He is perfectly sound otherwise and moving very well and freely without his fronts when on grass, smooth tarmac and the arena. Each day I swing between putting the shoes back on or not. Struggling to find him some hoof boots, the foot is wider than long. I do want to be able to event and hunt him again. What to do? Would appreciate readers experiences.
 
If you want to keep him barefoot you need to make him comfortable. You can get boots to fit hooves that are wider than long, this place gives good advice, and you can hire before you buy. http://www.thesaddleryshop.co.uk/
Road work shouldn't be a particular problem, are you finding that it is? What is his diet? Why don't you get in touch with these people to see if they can give you any useful advice. http://www.rockleyfarm.co.uk/
 
If I knew that I was surrounded by stoney tracks etc, I would of probably kept the fronts on in the first place!!!

But now you need to make him comfy as Woe says, wether that be to put the shoes back on or an alternative!
 
Barefoot doesn't work for all horses and I feel for each the decision must be made individually.I have 4 horses
One of them a TB 21 years old and now in retirement he is 17 hh.He had back shoes off for 1 year and was just fine So then took the fronts off during the next year he had nothing but problems despite foot supplement and regular attention from an excellent farrier This year he got another abcess on a front foot that was so bad and so deep he looked like he had fractured a pedal bone.The vet x rayed and found very deep seated abcess we thought we might have to have him put down it was so bad.
Anyway after 6 weeks of treatment he was ok and we had front shoes put on ( seated out) plus a pad to cover the enorous drainage hole that needed to be cut into the foot .Now 3 months later he is absolutely fine looks better than ever so front shoes are staying on.
This was a horse that wasn't EVER ridden or taken off grass or concrete tracks! Do what you think is best Barefoot definitely does not wotrk for all.
I have another horse who has always been barefoot and is ridden and is fine
 
Old Macs G1's are for horses with feet wider than they are long. If you struggle to get hold of them here, go to the EasyCare website and you can order them from the US. They have some very helpful fitting charts too. One of my horses has this shape of foot.
 
Yes, that's why I started by saying "if you want"... I've got 4 barefoot horses and they're fine. I've not had problems with abcesses. I've had some "footy" times and dealt with them. I do believe that barefoot is better than shod, and I do use a very good trimmer. (That's mainly because when my farrier moved I couldn't find another good one, but the trimmer does a very good job). So I'm prepared to put myself out a bit to make things right for my barefoot horses.
Horses get abcesses when they are shod and when they are not. I don't find any marked increase in abcesses among my many friends who have barefoot horses. Maybe they are getting the right trims? Some years back I knew someone having abcessing problems, but she was using a Strasser trimmer. I hope to goodness nobody is using anyone from that school of thought.
If you don't feel that strongly then it might be best to put shoes back on. It sounds as if you would be happier and more confident that way. Mind you, when I look at the problems some of my friends have with shoes and shod horses I wonder if either option is easier.
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Sorry, I meant to say. I believe there may be some evidence for it being more difficult to get older horses comfortable barefoot, if they have been shod for most of their lives. (Talk to Rockley Farm, I'm not a fount of information here, I just look after my nags). They have a lot of recovering to do.
Having said that... the one I have to look after most is my pony who has never been shod. The two boys who had their shoes taken off at ages 9 and 12 did really well from the start. So go figure.
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The only time they had problems was when I used a farrier who took too much off their toes, meaning they were footy for weeks. They couldn't walk on gravel, whereas before his visit they were fine. That was frustrating.
 
Put fronts back on. My last horse was barefoot and I had a trimmer. Absolutely no problems.Newbie came with fronts on.Went down barefoot route.Didn't suit him at all. Now has fronts on.He is much happier and was from the very beginning.
 
I have barefoot ponies and also a shod horse so have experienced both. I tried competing a horse barefoot a few years ago but it just didn't work when I began SJ and eventing as he began sliding on grass. Therefore IMO to compete on anything other than a surface, you do need shoes purely so you can use studs. My horse is shod all year except now when his shoes are taken off and he has a break for 2-3 months. For retired ponies etc. I think barefoot is ideal and I know of quite a few endurance horses who are barefoot, I guess they get used to stoney ground etc. With mine, one is absolutely fine on stones, the other one is lame as hell (but like yours, fine in a field)!
 
You could always compromise, OP, as I do? My pony is shod during the months I do a lot of riding and has a 'shoe holiday', normally from the end of October to sometime in Feb. Mainly because I struggle to find boots that fit/are comfortable (I will have another go in Jan, during his shoe holiday!). My pony does get LGL if I'm not careful, though, so I use the shoes more as a precaution, as I really need to work him hard during grass growth season - it's all rocks and stones round here, so we need that extra lift that the rim provides (or boot!!).

There is also a new boot that's beeing raved about, called Hoofwings. On the IHDG there are a couple of people who go on about them like they're better than sex, so they MUST be good! Major advantage for horses with difficult to fit feet are that they can be made to measure. Thinking about trying those next...
 
Rugrat, I must say my horse does seem to be coping really well barefoot but he wouldnt cope going down a stney track whne ridden, we have a stone footpath that has been recently laid on the walkway to our field and he can do that fine but only because its soft and gives at the mo. Believe me around 7 weeks I was pondering whether or not to put the shoes back on, dont!! Find some hoof boots that suit your horse, my horse has narrow, long feet so boas work for him, maybe old macs can work for you. Please give it time, you must be at that same point I was, its like history repeating itself, give it time, it could work for you, good luck and do pm me if you wish xx
 
7 weeks is not a long time rugrat for a horse that has been shod longer term to recover from that.

I would give it a couple months more and see how it goes.

I gather the gloves are pretty good, but I use the bares myself.

If you want to have a discussion about it (free of the normal hysteria that seems to surround barefoot discussions on this forum) then feel free to PM me. We can discuss diet and so on and perhaps give you some ideas.

Sounds like you are doing really well so far! Well done.
 
It can take up to 6 months for a horse to become 'sound' from barefoot and the front feet take the longest due to their weight bearing for the head and neck. He is bound to be footy over little stones, imagine walking barefoot your self , you would feel it if you stood on a stone! but after a while your feet would harden and you would no longer be footy, but it takes time!

A pair of good Boa boots or equivelant will help, don't give up after just 7 weeks - you surely have only had no more than two trims in that time, not even long enough for the nail holes to grow out!

Older horses CAN succesfullly be taken barefoot, having personally adapted a 27 year old to barefoot - not without it's issues, she was very footy for 6 months without boots and developed an abscess in her heel/ coronet area which made her very poorly (in her back foot mind) which may have been due to barefoot or just one of those things that happen. I thought many a time about putting shoes back on, to the point of being in tears regularly over what to do, but it paid off long term and her feet are still (as far as i know) very good.

I took my mare barefoot so she could retire with great feet, instead of deciding to one day retire her, whip her shoes off and her be crippled (as I saw happen to another horse)

Give it time and in the meantime get your horse some boots to wear. You will find the feet may actually shrink so you may need to get a smaller sized boot further down the line. You may even have to get two pairs if your horse has one foot a different size to another! The boot should require a good shove or hit with a rubber mallet to get on and you should be able to slip a finger in around the coronet band but otherwise they should be a snug fit. There will be boots available for wider feet if you do some digging.

Make sure that you get all the little stones out of the white line everyday, those stones can cause footiness if left in and could allow infection in, so careful picking is required!

Any more info PM me.
 
Has he been seen by a barefoot trimmer? The barefoot trim takes more hoof wall off than a farrier trim as farriers tend to trim as if they were still going to put a shoe on, which generally means they leave more wall. A proper barefoot trim might reduce the width v the length. There are hoof boots that will work for you - talk to the people at The Saddlery Shop... hire out some boots and give them a try.

Also seven weeks isn't very far down the line of transitioning your horse from shod to barefoot, so try and give it more time if you can. Diet is also crucial - if you can restrict his grazing, make sure there are no molasses in his feeds, feed only no sugar feeds (Allan & Page L Mix is great), unmolassed sugar beet, alfalfa pellets rather than chop, no carrots or apples. Many horses are footy when fed the wrong diet - you might have to experiment to find out what suits him as some horses are more tolerant of sugar in their diet than others.

I'd also recommend getting some Keratex Hoof Hardener - put on his sole and frogs every day for a week, then every other day for another week, then once or twice a week after that - it's great stuff, just be careful not to get on on yourself when applying it.
 
My cob has feet wider than long, and has Old Macs G2s on his front feet - bare behind. He went barefoot a year ago, at 16, and is more foot sure with the boots than shoes, now when I think back to those metal shoes on the steep tarmac hills around here it gives me the creeps!
 
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Has he been seen by a barefoot trimmer? The barefoot trim takes more hoof wall off than a farrier trim as farriers tend to trim as if they were still going to put a shoe on, which generally means they leave more wall.

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That is a myth put out by barefoot fanatics im afraid. Farriers are perfectly capable of distinguishing between barefoot and shod horses when they trim. They spend a long time training and its not just about putting shoes on!

OP- I would say that 7 weeks isnt long for a horse to become accustomed to barefoot. You have to make the horse as comfortable as possible during this time, which may involve compromises. However some horses just cant go barefoot and cope with stones, however long they have been without shoes. A friend of mine has several horses barefoot and quite frankly they are lame on stony surfaces. They cope in a school and on smooth tarmac but thats it! And they have been barefoot for ages. The ones that event are shod because of the work involved in keeping them fit, they cant do it without shoes on.

I took my retired horses shoes off recently and was worried he wouldnt cope after 20+ years of shoes. But because of toe cracks the vet and farrier thought it was worth a try and he could have shoes back on if he wasnt comfortable. To my amazement he has been absolutely fine, with no lameness. but he lives in a field and doesnt have to go on stony tracks! The cracks are growing out and he will remain barefoot.

Every horse is different and i am not anti barefoot but i am sceptical that horses can event and hunt comfortably without shoes. At the end of the day if the horse is lame on stones then he is in pain and shoes do prevent this.
 
As i said, every horse is different. Not everyone has access to miles of grassland and grass moors to ride on like the video though! And you cant actually see the stride length of the horses on the short stony track.

Many eventing courses have stony take offs and landings these days, theres not many that have grass take offs like in the video.

My friend is very in to barefoot but her event horses just cannot go without shoes, even though she would like them to. And the ones she does dressage/unaffiliated jumping with are lame on a stony or gravel surface, even without a rider. She is a knowledgeable owner, experienced and her brother is a vet. She also pays a very expensive farrier to travel a long way to do their feet!

So yes, some horses can go barefoot but some need shoes.
 
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That is a myth put out by barefoot fanatics im afraid. Farriers are perfectly capable of distinguishing between barefoot and shod horses when they trim. They spend a long time training and its not just about putting shoes on!


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Not a myth in my case - just going from my experience of fifteen years of using farriers. I know there are farriers out there who can do a great barefoot trim - I just haven't come across any of them personally in my area. In fact the last farrier I used didn't have the foggiest of how to trim a hoof - but he's just a bad example of a farrier. There are plenty of good ones out there.
 
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Has he been seen by a barefoot trimmer? The barefoot trim takes more hoof wall off than a farrier trim as farriers tend to trim as if they were still going to put a shoe on, which generally means they leave more wall.

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That's kind of a very misleading statement. The barefoot trim (a good one) will roll the wall at the right place, by the right amount so that the chance of wall ravell is reduced and there is a comfortable round edge for the horse to break over - but the amount of hoof wall that is removed will depend on the hoof in front of the trimmer. The farrier will often leave it flatter because that is what is needed for a shoe.

Very often when trimming, I will simply reapply the roll and that's all - even after 6 weeks - much of the time the horse self trims, but often if there has been a lot of roadwork the roll will need re-applied and tidied. Sometimes there is some wall height to remove and sometimes flare is taken away - but a good trimmer will give very much more consideration to what they leave rather than what they take away.

A good trimmer will also look into the diet of the horse and make recommendations based on the horse & hoof in front of them.

Personally I am not a fan of using hoof hardeners or conditioning chemicals of any kind on the hoof. I've found the hardener tends to make the wall less flexible and more prone to splitting, and in any case I don't like the idea of putting formaldehyde on my horse's feet!
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Has he been seen by a barefoot trimmer? The barefoot trim takes more hoof wall off than a farrier trim as farriers tend to trim as if they were still going to put a shoe on, which generally means they leave more wall.

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That is a myth put out by barefoot fanatics im afraid. Farriers are perfectly capable of distinguishing between barefoot and shod horses when they trim. They spend a long time training and its not just about putting shoes on!



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I agree completely with teddyt (again!) Unfortunately it is this sort of statement that starts the huge slanging matches.
 
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Every horse is different and i am not anti barefoot but i am sceptical that horses can event and hunt comfortably without shoes.

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I have evented five different horses affiliated barefoot. And having given up eventing I now hunt two others. A friend of mine has hunted at least seven and hires out barefoot hirelings. Most of those are navicular rehabs.
 
Thanks everyone for the info and input, you have given me lots to think about. My reason for going barefoot with my horse was to hopefully avoid some of the foot trouble going on around me with other peoples horses eg navic changes etc. I think that barefoot really suits his foot health and he seems very balanced and doesn't slip on the road etc, it is just me I think it doesn't suit at the moment although am trying. Have worked hard on trying to provide him with good environment, cut down sugar, looked at additives such as seaweed, magnesium etc. I just don't know how long the piece of string is until/if he will cope with the gravel/stones around here, although it sounds like there are boots out there to fit him in the meantime. I haven't had a specific barefoot trimmer to him, I am working with my farrier who is pro 'no shoes' and the nail holes are already gone, as the foot chipped back I ran the file around them to tidy up. I looked at the course for the Milton Keynes 3DE and the roads and tracks involved a lot of stony bridleway track and then on the xc there were quite a few stony take offs and landing so then I began to doubt my decision. As yet I have not made up my mind but have taken all of the comments on board, thank you and those that offered me to pm you I may well take the offer up!
 
Good luck Rugrat. It's always easier in company, so if you want a supportive forum where you can meet other barefooters who have been through the same trials and tribulations then please PM me and I'll pass the address on.
 
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