Bit for horse who leans and has verrry heavy low head carriage

[Twinkletoes]

Hi all - Am competing my friend's Clevelend Bay at the moment as am still horseless after losing Misty last month. Anyway, the gelding I am riding is a Very heavy 16.2, 9, and very inexperienced. He enjoys his work and tries hard, but I find him so, so 'clompy'. No better way to describe him than 'lollopy'. He is completely bomb proof, and a great character. So, we have a couple of ODEs and combined trainings coming up, and despite regular lessons, and various consistent schooling exercises, I feel like I am carrying his entire body weight in my hands. He leans down incredibly. He is supple, and stretches long and low, but I CANNOT get his head up, and its quite a battle at the moment. So, does anyone have good advice on a bit/tack I could try - I do appreciate long term this is a schooling issue. Currently jumped in wonder gag (french link). Instructor has suggested Elevator bit. Help much appreciated. x

 

[flyingfeet]

Hi there

A wonder gag won't help at all as the poll pressure encourages a lower head carriage

Best thing to try is a running gag, either lozenge or waterford. These are gags on special cheeks (nylon / leather), they encourage a high head carriage through a true gag action.

 

[AmyMay]

We occassionaly have to ride the big HW hunter in something stronger than his snaffle for the reasons you describe. We use a twisted W bit. But essentially it's like two snaffled joined together, individually twisted (don't know it's official name). It really makes the horse back off. However, he does go nicely in it (sorry it does sound as if I'm contradicting myself).

 

[Nari]

Sorry but the answer for me is schooling. He needs to work from behind & you must stop holding him up. Be strict with him, get him in front of your leg, lots of transitions, spirals, half halts, leg yield etc. By all means change the bit for xc but you can't do much for dressage & in the long term you need to get him carrying himself.

Having waffled on about schooling I assume that you've had his back & saddle checked to be sure there's no reason why he can't work from behind.

 

[K27]

It just sounds like he is a little green!- I wouldn't worry though- he is bound to feel like this if he's a bit green and inexperienced - he just needs to strengthen his muscles up and learn to carry himself (and you!!). It will take time and patience.
My 17.2 7 yr old was like this at first and I just did lots of suppling exercises, stretching him out on a long rein, loads and loads of transitions, leg yielding- to get him into more self carriage and bringing his hocks underneath him and working over his back. Try to allow him to stretch and give when he's soft for you,the worst thing you can do with a big horse is to hold them up and carry them for too long- they have to do this for themselves, in time. Try to keep the contact consistent.
I would suggest keeping the bitting as simple as possible for the flatwork and something stronger if you need it for hacking/jumping. You could try a Sprenger kk training bit or something similar. Pherhaps your instructor could help you or you could find a dressage trainer to assist with the flatwork. Good luck!...

 

[WishfulThinker]

My boy is like that, but just in a snaffle. He was in a dutch gag that gave him a really high but rather fake head carriage. Now however he is rather heavy on the hand, especially in canter, but if you gee him up a bit and nip his arse under him he is a lot better. Although he still leans when he doesn't want to do something.

He is croup high though so will always be rather on the forehand. But I did fine when I first got him that a lot of lunging (i used side reins though) and he learned to carry himself.

 

[fairhill]

We use a loose-ring waterford on my mum's heavy horse. She used to lean terribly, and this really lightens her forehand. Schooling has made the real difference, but this helps.
As soon as a snaffle goes back in I'm back to having sore shoulders!
I also pop a pelham in occasionally to remind her to carry her own head, but it does cause her to back off a bit too much.

 

[JessPickle]

Loose ring waterford, did wonders for pickle, and he is very Large (17.1hh) and it helps to higher his head carriage. ANy other bit and its like the old pickle back!

 

[Gentle_Warrior]

another vote here for waterford loose ring - mine is exactly the same. But I have to admit I needed something extra to pick his head up so have just invested in a english tom thumb lozenge as he has a tendancy to shiove his head down to buck.

but waterford for schooling and hacking alone is brilliant just not enough for me in company

x

 

[SAMgirl]

Hi all! Are the waterfords dressage legal?

 

[piebaldsparkle]

NO

 

[CentrestageSHS]

Hiya, one of the most elevating bits you can get is a running gag otherwise known as a cheltenham or nelson gag. Used by a lot of big heavy hunters and I have found them great for showjumping on big heavy warmbloods. These are the bits with rope for cheekpieces and the higher you fit the bit the stronger it is. I would definately try one as the difference is profound even just for a little while until he gets the idea and builds up the right muscles to hold his head higher

 

[GinaGem]

Have to say i agree with this. After a very bad rider riding my girl she learnt to heavily lean on your hands in all sorts of bits. Found out that the woman forced her into an incorrect head carriage and so Gem's only escape was to pull your hands forward and down, this then forced you to tip forward and she then had control. When i took her on my instructor and i spent a long time schooling her to give her confidence to carry her own head. It took a long time but she's now ridden in a snaffle.