Bit suggestions.

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LadyRascasse

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Hi,

I have a new horse who with flat work is lovely and soft in a french link eggbutt snaffle and a cavasson noseband. However pop a jump and up he get incredible strong and I have no breaks or steering. I got offered to go to a show today so had no chance to play with bits before he went so I popped him in a rubber pelham with 2 reins and a loose curb as it was all I have. It was very much overkill and he was backing off fences a touch (nothing major) and as a results knocking the back rails. As all my bits have magically vanished, any suggestions on what to try him in? I have a grackle I can try, drops don't fit his face shape. But other than that I need to hire a few bits to play with but I have no idea where to start. HELP!!!

:D
 
You could always try a three or four ring dutch gag (scary name - nicknamed the bubble bit) I used that on my mental pony, big bubble works as a snaffle, but if you drop it down to either of the two smaller bubbles you have extra control as it puts pressure on the poll. Dressage was snaffle bubble, SJ was the middle bubble and XC the bottom bubble. It took ages to find the right bit for him, he had a soft mouth but was very excitable when fences are introduced. I didn't want to harden his mouth, or put something too strong in his mouth, just so I had more control over fences and I found this a very flexible bit, much easier than changing bits every time you want to jump! Just pop the reins down a bubble!

Edit: this is something similar to the one I used http://www.thesaddleryshop.co.uk/P/...ch_Gag_pinchless_jointed_dutch_gag-(779).aspx
 
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That looks like a 3 ring bubble, my four ring was the next strength up (extra bottom bubble) I do like the flexibility they give, you can change bit strength much easier and the large central bubble is equivalent to whichever snaffle design you get (bar, link etc). We went through so many bits trying to find the right one before hitting on the four ring, we could have started our own bit bank!
 
Yer, it is similar to a dutch gag but it has the option of using a leather curb with it. I wish I knew where the blooming thing is. I know what you mean about a bit bank I have one of those for my mare who is sadly 1/2 smaller than him.
 
Aw no! I can imagine that is annoying, to have one so close and be so little different! Luckily my old retired monster who still gets the occasional lunge and road walk has an apple loose ring snaffle, softest thing I could find and pulling too hard on that (when we were little and still riding about) would cause an abrupt halt and backwards advance, I've never ridden any other horse so soft, I think it made me much better at feeling horses mouths but I find myself being far too gentle with hard mouthed beasties and making very little difference to anything!
 
I have just got one of these for my horse with the same issue:

http://www.thehorsebitshop.co.uk/product.php?xProd=30&jssCart=9f1d5961670973864043b4cdc6a33416

It basically has the same effect as a bubble gag but is a bit more mild (less leverage overall) - and if it makes any difference, it's a bit neater and looks nicer. I have found that going from a normal loose ring snaffle (fine for flatwork) to this is a more gentle step than using a bubble gag (which I use for XC).
 
We have one of those in the bit bank box! Unfortunately we needed the extra poll pressure as he had a nasty habit of biting his bit and just running for the hills, so I still had the control with the poll pressure...something to think about if your horse grabs their bit and goes! I ended up half way across Tweseldown in a drop cheek two week after purchase because he grabbed his bit and went! (First XC on him - defo needed a stronger bit!)

In the little word doc I sent with him to Jersey I put which bubble each discipline needed. She was very grateful, and told me that she was glad that the little girls who share/loaned him from her at his yard could feel his strength SJ but as they had dropped to the middle bubble still felt they had a little control...much more flatwork needed! I think she said...
 
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Depends exactly what he does. Mine jumps in a dutch gag as for bigger courses she needs the precision, smaller ones it doesn't matter if she isn't spot on. Dutch gags do work more like a pelham with the downwards poll pressure than other gags. They should be used with two reins though. If he's raising his head, I'd definitely try a dutch gag with two reins & a mouthpiece exactly the same. And with two reins you can ride on the snaffle as usual but just have the second rein for back up. Incidentally my mare hates pelhams, & doesn't go well in them ever, despite going well in a double, regardless of the mouthpiece.
 
Abacus said:
I have just got one of these for my horse with the same issue:

http://www.thehorsebitshop.co.uk/product.php?xProd=30&jssCart=9f1d5961670973864043b4cdc6a33416

It basically has the same effect as a bubble gag but is a bit more mild (less leverage overall) - and if it makes any difference, it's a bit neater and looks nicer. I have found that going from a normal loose ring snaffle (fine for flatwork) to this is a more gentle step than using a bubble gag (which I use for XC).
Click to expand...

Abacus, REALLY interested in your reply! Dave is in a loose ring copper lozenge french link (this: http://www.shiresequestrian.co.uk/shop/product.php?productid=809&cat=572&page=1). He is very light in the mouth on the flat and general hacking, however on a fast hack, or xc (as we were at weekend) we can lose the brakes a wee bit! Initially he would open his gob and run through the bit so it was suggested to use a flash just for fast work. I don't tighten it as much as perhaps I should but it has helped. We were XC training last weekend and when we strung a mini course together and he was absolutely "in the zone" I was VERY glad he had everything sorted because, although he wasn't out of control, I had to pull awfully hard to get even the slightest check. So I've been looking for something with essentially the same mouthpiece so that he stays settled but that might give me a bit of help when I need it. In the past I've tried a bubble gag but it sat him right back on his quarters and I couldn't get him up into the bridle so we lost all impulsion. He loves to jump but lost all his exuberance as he backed off the bubble. Where do the reins go on this NS bit? Have read the blurb about it having 2 "settings" but none of the sites I've found the bit on show it on a bridle soI'm a bit befuddled....
 
I was recently doing some refittening work (for me!) at a local yard, I joined with their WPs for a few weeks, but with no mucking out duties! (Yay!) and I was saddened to see some of the ponies/horses with 3 or 4 ring bubbles being ridden with the bit wrong. It is such a gentle bit and to see some of the WPs just yanking on strong horses on the middle or bottom bubbles instead of playing gently with them was horrible, the poor horses were all up on their hocks and confused, and the WPs were getting angry at the poor things...it's a very strong bit, and very tricky to get the hang of, a much much lighter hand is needed the lower the bubble you use, but the powerful control is there if your horse goes for the hills!

Also as little legs says, you can use bubbles with two reins, so you have the stronger bubble as backup...
 
My mare is schooled and does stressage in a sweet-iron loose-ring snaffle with a copper lozynge and drop noseband, she too gets very strong when jumping and hacking in company.......

When jumping (XC and SJ) and hacking in company, I use a Magenis snaffle with a grackle noseband - this works a treat!
 
I get where you are coming from Destario and have seen this myself.....but one thing I have been assured of by various instructors is that I have light hands. Dave wouldn't even go forward with the bubble (I only had rein on the ring below the snaffle).
 
That's really interesting - he sounds so similar to my boy. He backed off everything when I tried a Pelham, and started putting in unnecessary little half-strides (not nice for XC). In fact not even half-strides; probably smaller than this.

I hope I am using this new bit right - the cheekpieces are attached to the upper 'ring' and the reins can either go in the lower ring or just on the bit like they would with a normal snaffle. I am using them in the lower ring. Does that make sense?!

It's like a bubble gag but with the bubbles inside the ring of the bit rather than outside.

It seems to work - he is much more polite and attentive when jumping. I also have a flash but have removed it for now (the website recommends not using a flash to start with, when using this bit).
 
Was going to suggest a beval/wilkie bit....:)

My mare can get strong for jumping and we have been using a waterford at home (she normally leans and tanks) its worked fine the 2/3 times Ive used it at home and then at a competition last weekend we had the complete opposite reaction from her - head right in the air and going flat out so definately not the one for us if thats how she reacts - its obviously too much for her!

I ue a neue schule universal in her for the xc and this works a dream (going to try it sj) its actually a fairly gentle bit but still gives you the chance to say 'oi come here' when jumping.
 
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