bits - please give me your advise

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pipper

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i have a lovely but strong pony. Out hacking i currently ride him in a rubber pelham with roundings and a loose-ish elastic curb. (in the school i ride in a loose ring french link) the trouble is that he is tucking behind this bit. i have tried 2nd hole of a 3 ring jointed gag and he hated it. was behind the bit the whole time. i am wondering what to try next. he tends to lean a bit and just ignores my aids - he isnt really naughty just goes much to fast for my liking......
any ideas what i could try next? i was thinking a hanging cheek snaffle - dont know why?? what do you guys think?
Many thanks
 
Have you tried a waterford? they are fab on horses that lean, although they are not dressage legal
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they should be!
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Twisted snaffle is good for horses that lean, less severe than a waterford and they are normally quite happy to take up the contact too.

Cherry Rollers can be a good choice too.
 
A hanging snaffle does apply some poll pressure, so it depends why he is tucking behind the rubber pelham.

A loose curb chain doesn't always equate to a milder action with a pelham as the bit will rotate further, depending on the length of the shanks.

If you have the curb loose-ish, then it might be the poll pressure he doesn't like. Maybe try the curb a little tighter first to see if that is the problem - a tighter curb puts pressure on the chin groove area, but stops the bit rotating so much so there is less poll pressure.

Just make sure the curb chain is padded so it doesn't pinch as it comes into action.

If he still tucks behind, try a bit with less poll pressure perhaps as suggested above a waterford or cherry roller etc.
 
After trying loads of bits I bought the Neue Schule Universal Tranz Lozenge (link attached). It is FANTASTIC. My cob took to it straight away, he mouths away on the salox! He came with a Myler comfort snaffle and I had no brakes at all, was really leaning and really strong. This bit is so good 'cause you can use it in so many different ways - (like a hanging cheek, like a gag, with a curb strap or without, or with roundings) it is really adaptable to different activities, and makes it good value too. The mouthpiece is gentle with its shaped lozenge, but you can experiment with different types of poll/curb etc pressure to find what works best for your horse. In the Myler he would tuck his head in to evade, but he doesn't do that with the Neue Schule.

I've been really pleased with it and would definitely recommend it, particularly if you're having trouble finding the right bit for your horse.

Link to Neue Schule Universal
 
If you decide on the Waterford, you will need half an inch bigger than your usual size, I use a Dutch Gag, i have tried various bits for my steam train and the Dutch Gag is amazing, would not dream of changing it now, even controlled the beast when i went hunting.
However, this may not be for you, maybe a Dr Bristol could help?

Are you sure there are no other issues you could explore without changing bits?
 
[ QUOTE ]
A hanging snaffle does apply some poll pressure, so it depends why he is tucking behind the rubber pelham.

A loose curb chain doesn't always equate to a milder action with a pelham as the bit will rotate further, depending on the length of the shanks.

If you have the curb loose-ish, then it might be the poll pressure he doesn't like. Maybe try the curb a little tighter first to see if that is the problem - a tighter curb puts pressure on the chin groove area, but stops the bit rotating so much so there is less poll pressure.

Just make sure the curb chain is padded so it doesn't pinch as it comes into action.

If he still tucks behind, try a bit with less poll pressure perhaps as suggested above a waterford or cherry roller etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

thanks for that info! i will try tightening the curb first before thinking of using anything else. It isnt a chain its a sort of material/elasticated one so do you think it will pinch?
he is such a complicated chap that it isnt easy to know what is best!
thanks for all the suggestions x
 
which bit is he tucking behind in, the pelham or the french link? if he tucks in, you don't want a hanging cheek, or poll pressure really - if he ducks behind as an evasion then i'd ditch the pelham.
umm, it could be that he's leaning because of the way you use your hands, not because of the bit(s).
i'd try a single jointed snaffle, see if that helps, it has more nutcracker action than the french link obv.
for jumping etc, if he leans i would try the waterford, because of the many joints it's impossible for them to lean in. it's a bit of a marmite bit though, some love it, some hate it. you mustn't use a sawing motion with it though, quick tug and soften is more effective. i'd disagree with Katt, i think twisted snaffle is far more severe than a waterford.
you could also try: copper roller snaffle, copper ridge bit (single joint with tiny ridges along copper, another marmite bit, some really respect it, others totally ignore it)
old fashioned cheltenham gag is useful for raising head slightly and giving good brakes, (does he lean and pull down, or lean and stretch neck out?), but if you only have it on bottom reins be aware that some cheeky/smart ones realise that your steering has gone a bit indirect and do naughty run-outs accordingly... two reins is better but a bit of a handful.
 
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