Bloaty horse(s)

[JackFrost]

Asking for some help in understanding issues with a horse I have. I am starting to look into it with the vet, whose thought is not gut.
Basically - two horses, seemingly same issue, but don't know what is either is/was. Long one - sorry!

Horse A - gelding, 10 years. A horse I knew a few years ago and was riding regularly. At grass 24/7, only hay in winter, nothing else. Chronic diarrhoea, spooky, grumpy, girthy, wooden and stiff to ride, tight behind and did a sort of jamming up in downward transition trot to walk. Often felt very bloaty, some days ok, some not, and the bloatiness was not static, I could kind of feel it moving and changing as I sat on him. For reasons unrelated to ridden issues, Horse A got sent off to be a pasture ornament for 8 months, and (here's the thing) came back totally different, forward, responsive, not spooky, all the previous issues gone and the bloaty feel no longer there. I now have a better level of knowledge than I did then, and with hindsight would guess he had ulcers (?) Horse A was never to my knowledge looked at by a vet, and I am not now in contact with him.

Horse B - mare 5 years. Also at grass 24/7, with extra hay in winter, small amount of Top Spec and chaff. Droppings always been normal, wormed regularly ( did have tapeworm once).
Not girthy, not grumpy with me but is with another horse, bit spooky and stressy. Was started 18 months ago, has always been happy about being ridden but a bit stuffy and spooky and tight behind. Recently, I have been getting EXACTLY the same sensations when I ride her that I did with Horse A, the bloaty feeling, movement getting stuck, sluggish, vague discomfort - what I would feel if I'd had too much to eat and was then asked to go for a brisk walk.
I tried a few days on danilon, just to see if it made a difference, seemingly it did, the stuckness got worse. Stopped the danilon and 3 weeks ago put her on Thunderbrooks Gut Restore (slippery elm) and a Forage plus balancer. Within a week or so, the spookiness has stopped and she seems much calmer and just very happy. I got the same bloaty feeling riding yesterday, after she had been out all night on rather a lot of grass and then some hay too. At one point the bloatiness came, and then sort of went again a few seconds later.

Interested to hear any thoughts, and particularly if anyone can relate to the sensations that I feel very clearly when riding both of these horses, which seems to me to be a key to understanding the issues. TIA

ETA - a good farrier has absolutely ruled out feet, a good dentist has ruled out teeth.

 

[Melody Grey]

Is your grazing rich or fertilised? Sounds like being a bit gassy to me. My son’s pony can get a but like this in summer, but improved with occasional charcoal, consistent brewers yeast and strip grazing/muzzling to control intake. I’m inclined to feed hay all round and have time off the grass- mine go out overnight but come in during the day for this reason.

 

[JackFrost]

Poor meadow grass, never fertilised, but land might be acidic - I am getting a soil analysis done. Thanks for your reply.

 

[stangs]

Sorry, can't be of much help, but my first thought was that it's an imbalance in the gut flora, maybe that makes her more susceptible to something in the grass/soil (or maybe the hay?) than other horses. Following with interest.

I got the same bloaty feeling riding yesterday, after she had been out all night on rather a lot of grass and then some hay too. At one point the bloatiness came, and then sort of went again a few seconds later.

Interesting - so did the bloated feeling come twice? If it's bloat like what humans get, surely it should only be present at the beginning of the ride and then fade away the more she moves around?

Does she poo while being ridden?

 

[JackFrost]

Only normal pooing while ridden (hacked), and not gassy. On the days it's there, it always there, but it comes and goes slightly, some days it's better, but becoming more of a problem. Not certain it;s a gut thing, trying to figure it out .

 

[pastit]

If Horse A goes somewhere else and heals, then it sounds like something in your pasture or forage. Is the problem seasonal? I'd be inclined to fence off a small baldish bit and feed more hay and see if the problem gets better or worse. Then perhaps you'll know if its hay or forage. Wonder if spring grass flushes their systems for instance or when there is more choice of plants than in winter. You could also get blood and urine tested. Hope you get to the bottom of it.