Bruised soles & lameness

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Nari

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If a horse is showing bruises on his soles when the farrier trims him would this be a reason for him coming up lame?

Jim's feet have been giving me nightmares for the last two months & at no point has he been fully sound. X-rays showed nothing except thin soles which we were already aware of. However the last two shoeings have shown bruising on the soles & frog when they were pared, although ironically his feet generally are in better shape than normal - the hoof wall is holding up, flare doesn't seem as bad as usual & there is far far less white line seperation
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The last few weeks we've been walking him out on the roads for very short hacks, the furthest he's done is a mile & a half, & he seems quite happy doing this. Although I have access to a school it's been far too deep to ride in
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. However if he's popped into trot he's lame, happy to carry on but lame.

Today I took him into the shool for my RI to have a look at. He was lame on the first short trot, better on the second though still not right. Mind you he wasn't helping - when he hasn't been schooled for a while he reverts to a tank with no flexion, bend or lift so went merrily ploughing round on his forehand & pivoting on the turns despite my best efforts. RI thinks, as do I, that he may almost be best doing a very little school work to get his carriage & flexibility back as that way he'll put less weight into his fronts.

Is it reasonable to think the basic problem is the bruising? Is he not going to come sound until the bruising has gone? I really don't want to lay him off completely as he becomes quite stroppy & rude - he had 4 weeks off but I think he ended up doing more damage to himself in the field than he would have done if ridden so we started quietly hacking, since when he's been fairly sane when turned out & back to his normal self to handle.

Well done anyone who got to the end
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What a worry and a nightmare for you. Its the not knowing which is the worrying thing. When you had Jim's feet x-rayed, did they do his hocks at the same time and have they suggested scans?

I have recently become a paranoid tendon and spavin woman, not to mention paranoid laminitic and stomach ulcer worrier
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What does your farrier say?
 
His hocks were x-rayed last year & were clean - the vet was actually surprised at how clean they were since he's a big lad who normally does a lot of schooling.

It's nice to hear I'm not the only worrier!

WHen he was shod I hadn't tried trotting him, I'd just kept him on 3 weeks walk work to see how his feet would hold up. Unfortunately he's now on holiday for a week so I don't want to call him - I spend far too much time bothering him as it is!
 
Hi, i have a TB and he pulled a shoe of in the feild and became lame vet checked him after a couple of weeks as he wasnt geting any better and he had a bruised sole took 10 weeks to improve he was ok in walk but lame in trot, he also doesnt have much sole at all, bruising takes along time to heal syas my vet
wish you luck
 
ozwolds that's encouraging to hear, I was starting to wonder if there was something else going on despite several vet visits, the farrier thinking his feet looked good (for him, for most horses they wouldn't be good) & common sense. The vets aren't always terribly reassuring when it comes to his feet, they seem to take one look & mutter something along the lines of "oh dear, you do have problems", "lets get x-rays" or at best "well at least you've got a good farrier" so I tend not to bother unless I'm really worried.

What did your vet reckon about work? I'm walking a fine line in that he gets bored if he's not worked & when he's bored he finds things to do. Rarely good things. At the moment short hacks are a real novelty to him but he could do with a bit of schooling too. I don't want to school on hacks as we're trying to convince him it's good & relaxing, he needs his confidence rebuilding hacking.
 
to be honest i didnt do any schooling with him just kept him at walks long lined out as he is doing a rehab programe after a kissing spine operation so i couldnt do anything with him as we artent rideing him at the moment but the vte just said to keep him at walk bruising takes a long time to heal, but he did have a pick at his sole as he had a hematoma if thats how you spell it ( a little bood clot ) on his sole so vet had a pick at it polticed it for 2 days and just then had to wait as it was the brusing causing the problem in total ours was 10 weeks,
Im affraid i think its just a matter of being patient.
ive put my horse on formual 4 feet aswell and i foot oil from the farrier which is like lard and his feet have improved greatly for a TB,
Good luck
 
That's really interesting - my TB was diagnosed with bruised heels and jarred legs by my farrier. She seemed fine on Tuesday so went out again as she gets extremely worked up in the stable and it agrivates her COPD. By thursday she was lame again, slightly. Not visible in walk but visible in trot. Yet she's still willing to walk forward.

Reading this has just calmed some of my panick - perhaps I've been too hasty I've never dealt with bruising before.

Ozwolds did you keep him in whilst bruised or turn him out?
 
i turned him out, no need to keep him in,
im glad your not panicking so much now but i know how you feel as i was the same and you think will they ever be ok as it takes such a long time to heal.
good luck
 
Well the silly sod really doesn't help himself at times. I was slightly late catching this morning & he was NOT amused - charging around & spinning in the field then bouncing around when led. The flints, stones & tarmac didn't seem to be bothering him one little bit but he's probably added more bruises. Stupid stupid horse!
 
My mare has severe bruising... I was told to box rest this week, which I have been doing, but was wondering whether she might be better getting out a bit too and moving around???
 
I don't know _JetSet_. If I could box rest Jim I would but unfortunately he then goes so mad when let out he risks doing himself an injury - last time he tipped himself over & went through a fence. Left out he's much calmer. Box rest is for emergencies! I am, however, standing him in on a deep bed in the day which at least makes him rest a bit & gives some cushioning but doesn't wind him up.
 
Yes, we've tried leather & gel ones but he hates them, he goes footy in them straight away & isn't sound until they come off. Maybe because he's so very flat footed & walks on his frogs as much as his shoes? It's frustrating because they'd seem to be the obvious answer. I've even tried getting boots to fit over his shoes but the ones that I can get in his size don't seem to fit his foot shape & won't fasten securely round the pastern. Aaaaaargh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
That & the fact that for a big horse he's one hell of a fairy. If Jim was human he'd never have a cold, it would be flu at the very least if not pneumonia!
 
[ QUOTE ]
If a horse is showing bruises on his soles when the farrier trims him would this be a reason for him coming up lame?

Jim's feet have been giving me nightmares for the last two months & at no point has he been fully sound. X-rays showed nothing except thin soles which we were already aware of. However the last two shoeings have shown bruising on the soles & frog when they were pared, although ironically his feet generally are in better shape than normal -

Is it reasonable to think the basic problem is the bruising? Is he not going to come sound until the bruising has gone?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes all this could well be down to bruising and thin sloes, and you probably just have to be patient while it sorts itself out.

Just be aware that there could be other problems going on that cannot be seen and obviously no-one wants to waste money looking while there's a problem that can be seen. With you saying your horse's feet are in better condition than normal and that he has problems with pads, it just rang alarm bells to me as my horse's have both had serious soft tissue damage inside the feet that went un-investigated for a while being attributed to, amongst other things, bruised soles and crushed heels.

I hope your horse improves soon. If he doesn't, encourage your vets to start looking for the real problem sooner rather than later, or you won't be covered by insurance. Good luck.
 
KVS what, if any, other signs were your horses showing? How did the vet diagnose? And how did they treat?

We've always had problems with his feet & I've owned him since a 2yo (he's 10 now). In the ideal world I'd chuck him out without shoes for a couple of months but for him it would be little short of cruelty.
 
What type of gel pads did your farrier use? My 22 yr old mare had suffered with bruised soles on her fronts repeatedly and we are now using the quick setting gel that is applied in liquid form. She was unsure about it for the first few days as I guess it felt odd to her but she is now perfectly happy with her new robust feet and is great on all surfaces. I also find that she has extra grip out on the roads and doesn't slip when going downhill. When they are removed her feet and frogs are in lovely condition underneath. They have really sorted her out.
 
Lol that may be what he was thinking of trying if we had to. Is it Equithane? The problem is he'd have to fit rim pads to get enough height to apply the gel & the angle of his feet makes fitting rim pads difficult. If he still isn't sound coming up to his next shoeing I'll give the farrier a call & see what he thinks, at this point I'm starting to think anything is worth a try!
 
I don't know if you want this much detail but when I go off on one I can't stop, lol. Feel free to ignore lots of my waffle.
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My last horse had lots of problems. He always had poor, flat, splayed feet. He was prone to corns, crushed heels and he was in heartbars constantly by the time he was nine. He never coped with competitions in the summer and would shine at indoor jumping and dressage in the winter. I just though he didn't do firm ground but with hindsight he was probably never 100% comfortable on his front feet because there was more going on than we could see which was aggrivated by the firm ground.

He also had hock problems which I think he had since I bought him at six but he coped with this quite well. He actually went very unhappy about work aged about twelve and he went from a pretty push button ride to stuffy, reluctant to canter and bits of stiff bucking. He felt like he had a bad back (which he partly did from all the compensating!). It took a lot of persistance to get to the bottom of his problem - I basically had to get past my vets
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, get past Leahurst and the surgical shoeing that they thought was helping but it wasn't
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and go to Sue Dyson.

I never read that horse's technical report because the phone conversation was so damning I knew he wasn't coming back so there didn't seem much point. He was PTS. I do know the state his feet were in was due to wear and tear and degeneration which was connected to his poor foot conformation. She's very thorough and she does find the root of problems, with the help of MRI where necessary.

After the fiasco of how long it took with that horse to find out what was really wrong with him, when the next horse quickly went the same way (collapsed heels, slight lameness on a left turn/circle on firm ground, generally naughty and miserable) and I started to get the same fob offs and time wasting crap I got the last time from the supposed experts, I insisted she went to Sue Dyson too. Again the horse needed MRI but it showed up severe injuries to the collateral ligaments in both front feet and damage to the DDFT in one. She's only got a 30ish% chance of ever working again. If I'd just gone along with the vets advice I'd be mucking about with surgical shoeing at Leahurst again about now with no idea what's going on inside this horse's feet.

This mare had shock wave therapy. Three treatments at two weekly intervals, during which time she also did two months of box rest. She's now turned away until next spring, unshod. Ideally I'd leave her even longer but I've only got until July to claim LOU so she needs assessing for soundness and possibly to see if she can stand up to some work before then.

I hope your horse's problems aren't as serious as mine, I think I have been particularly unlucky, chances are it REALLY IS just a bruised sole. However I also think there are lots of horses around who probably do have the same under-lying problems that people don't ever know about because not everyone's as awkward as me and determined to get everything totally diagnosed!
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Thanks KVS, that's actually really interesting. You've been so unlucky, I hope your mare comes back sound & copes with work.

I pray Jim's problems aren't that serious! Any information is useful though & if he doesn't improve it gives me something to think about.
 
I'm afraid I echo KVS here. Don't panic now but if in a month your horse still isn't right push for a diagnosis. I've had two TBs with collateral ligament damage caused partly by poor foot confirmation. The first time the horse was misdiagnosed with navicular and by the time he went to Sue Dyson for an MRI it was too late, he couldn't even weight bare. Like KVS when my second horse started going on/off lame I pushed for a diagnosis. Both my vets and farrier assured me it was bruised soles caused by paper thin soles and low lying pedal bones however after three months of on/off lameness I pushed for an MRI. Mine has chronic wear to his collateral ligament. He is now back in work although not competing currently. His x-rays were always clear and simply showed very thin soles.
I've now got my boy in natural balance shoes with gel pads. I can't keep him sound without the pads. I'd be sitting down and having a long talk with your farrier. There are other options such as Cyteks which are a type of shoe which cover the sole - controversial but a possibility, I tried them and found they kept my horse sound but I didn't like them. Good luck.
 
KVS and Marchtime, were your horses any better on a soft surface, say an arena?

My mare had bad bruising to the sole which was finally found on Wednesday. She could put no weight on the foot at all once the shoe had been removed, xrays were taken and she has very thin soles apparently. It is now five days since the lameness appeared following her looning about in the field, and there is a huge improvement, however she is still lame in walk.

I took her into the arena tonight because she was getting so stressed in her stable (she is on box rest) and she walked 'normally' in there.

She is supposed to be having her shoe put back on this coming week, and until then she is just having a dry poultice with gamgee padding.
 
Nari, Re GEL. It is made by bondtech you can have a look at the website if you type bondtech into your search engine, very informative. It is a polyurethane mix that sets in about 1 minute and does not require rims as a fine mesh can be put on with the shoes to keep the gel in place as it bonds with it. In this way it does not interfere with the integrity of the hoof wall. My girl has only the depth of the shoe to work with on her near fore in which she is boxy as well as flat footed.
Also if you type in farriers supplies you will find a lot of usefull info on the types of products that are available to help with thin soles and then discuss the options with your farrier.
I hope you find this helpfull as I was at my wits end with my girl but having sourced the info myself my farrier was more than happy to give it a try and thankfully it has worked for her.
 
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KVS and Marchtime, were your horses any better on a soft surface, say an arena?


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Both my horses were much better on soft surfaces than hard, but I think that's the way it is with all foot problems. I don't think its any indication of how serious the problem is. IMHO, you have to give a reasonable amount of time and effort to treating foot problems you can see. BUT, if the horse isn't improving or is responding badly to remedial shoeing or other treatments don't just keep plodding along letting your vets repeat x-rays and nerve blocks. There are more and better ways of finding out what's going on so insist on the best investigations.
 
You see that's what I find odd - Jim actually looks better on the hard ground. It's part of the reason someone said bruising (farrier thought borderline lammi) because if his soles weren't in contact with the ground he was comfier as less pressure on them. He was treated as if lammi anyway, I wasn't taking any chances, but then the next two shoeings showed some significant bruising on the soles & frogs.

I'm in a tricky position if it comes to more investigations - x-rays were clear but no vet in their right mind is going to want to nerve block a needle shy ID & from what I've heard of MRI there could be a few problems there too. Hopefully it won't come to that.
 
Heart is now pounding again for my mare; very glad I decided to get vet out just incase.

Thanks for the informative post!
 
This might be a silly idea but if a horse has bruised soles and is a nightmare to keep on box rest etc whilst they are recuperating surely those boots that people use when their horses are barefoot are a good idea perhaps with a little padding underneath or a proper poultice boot? Means the horse can go out and walk about etc getting exercise and not being such a nightmare to cope with.

Just an idea!!
 
I have to admit mine was worse on a soft surface and far better on hard ground, however I don't think this is any sort of conclusive diagnosis.
Nari don't worry about nerve blocking a needly shy ID, your vet should be able to find a way round this. My poor vet and the hospital had to deal with a nutcase of a TB who cannot ever be lunged safely. In the end we gave him sedation. Whilst it does mask some lameness it was the only option. Both of my horses x-rays were pretty much clear - some minor arthritic changes but that's to be expected. I totally agree with KVS give it time but if your horse doesn't improve push for a diagnosis. I didn't the first time and it was detrimental to his treatment. Nowadays the injury is more widely known (I was unlucky as the first horse got diagnosed 5yrs ago when MRIs involved GA and so diagnosis was pretty much unheard of) but still many vets attribute the lameness to arthritis/bruised soles/navicular even though x-rays suggest otherwise. Good luck and I will keep my fingers crossed that it is simply a bruised sole.
 
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