Buyer not collecting horse?!

[jay2bee]

I’ve not come across this before, I have no idea what to do for the best?

Buyer came and tried a couple of horses I have for sale and then rang back the next day and agreed to buy one. They sent the full asking price the same day, and said they’d get back in touch with regards to vetting and collecting, great.
Didn’t hear anything for about five days but that included a weekend so wasn’t too concerned. Dropped her a message on the Tuesday, quick “hi, did you manage to get in touch with the vet, when can they come out”. She didn’t reply for two days. So I called and left the same message on voicemail.
Got a reply on the Friday along the lines of so sorry for delay/had covid/vet coming out Wednesday. Ok, great.(this was last week).
Messaged her on the Tuesday to ask which vets to expect and what time, was she going to be attending?
No reply. No answer to calls. Wednesday - no vets turned up. Since then I have had nothing. I have money sat in my account for this horse which I need to use, but now I don’t want to in case I have to give it all back! How long do I try and get in touch?! I have messaged and called every day since Wednesday last week, so over a week now. I don’t know what to do!

 

[EmmaC78]

If it were me I would message and say they have til Saturday to confirm arrangements and if you don't hear you'll assume they no longer want the horse and will re-advertise.

 

[bluehorse]

Put something in writing via email/recorded delivery letter telling her the horse is now her property and she is responsible for insurance including 3rd party, and liable for ongoing livery/farriery costs and all vets bills should the need arise, until she comes to collect it. Or refund the money and put the horse back up for sale. Not ideal but might be less hassle!

 

[jay2bee]

I don’t have her address ??‍ I could call the bank and see if they can give me any details

 

[mini_b]

I’d put something in writing and say if not collected by (date) horse will be readvertised and you will be refunded.
I’d go for the least hassle option - if you refund and hear nowt that is the VERY DEFINITION of a time waster.

You hear that term bandied around a bit but that for sure is it.

I know sh*t happens in life but surely they can find you 5 minutes in the day to let you know what’s happening, not sure I’d want my horse going to someone like that.

 

[Sossigpoker]

If she really has covid , could she be really unwell? People do actually die from it!
Is there any way to find out if she's actually in any state to communicate?
Have you tried calling ?

 

[bluehorse]

I don’t have her address ??‍ I could call the bank and see if they can give me any details

Your bank won’t pass on her details due to data privacy, but I think you can ask them to reverse the transaction. If you only have her phone number ring her repeatedly and leave voicemails. Also text. You would need to have evidence of trying to contact her if this situation resulted in a dispute. There may not be a dispute, she may just be a rubbish communicator but as it stands at the moment you have to protect yourself if things go wrong.

 

[Poingsettia]

As you have her money, I doubt she is time wasting. More likely to be ill, and possibly no one knows to let you know / other priorities. I’d be inclined to put the money aside, and if no update by the weekend, readvertise. Refund when she makes contact.

 

[Poingsettia]

Just a thought also, if she is very ill she may not have her phone, or it’s flat.

 

[bluehorse]

As you have her money, I doubt she is time wasting. More likely to be ill, and possibly no one knows to let you know / other priorities. I’d be inclined to put the money aside, and if no update by the weekend, readvertise. Refund when she makes contact.

i agree but the problem for me is liability. If the horse broke its leg in the field the buyer could reasonably think they were entitled to a refund, leaving the seller with no sale and no horse. In my one good experience of buying from a dealer I had to arrange collection pretty damn quick and not at my convenience. I get the urgency, once sold they should off the sellers property.

 

[Poingsettia]

I understand, but the horse could still be on sellers insurance till removed from the property and insurance terminated? Why did they pay in full before a vetting??
I think there has to be something going on, like illness, as they’ve paid in full. Too much to just walk away, unlike a deposit.

 

[Old school]

Maybe the buyer is on the thread below.......has yet to tell the OH. Hopefully it will all get resolved ASAP for you.

 

[bluehorse]

I understand, but the horse could still be on sellers insurance till removed from the property and insurance terminated? Why did they pay in full before a vetting??
I think there has to be something going on, like illness, as they’ve paid in full. Too much to just walk away, unlike a deposit.

Yes definitely odd the seller paid in full before a vetting, maybe just clueless. However why should the seller have the hassle of dealing with an accident, then potentially unable to transport plus care/livery and an insurance claim just because the buyer didn’t collect?

 

[GreyDot]

Quite possibly very ill. But really unusual to have transferred the entire amount prior to vetting! Hope you get it resolved soon.

 

[ihatework]

i agree but the problem for me is liability. If the horse broke its leg in the field the buyer could reasonably think they were entitled to a refund, leaving the seller with no sale and no horse. In my one good experience of buying from a dealer I had to arrange collection pretty damn quick and not at my convenience. I get the urgency, once sold they should off the sellers property.

Did you not write a receipt of sale etc?
Last horse I sold they couldn’t collect for a fortnight. As soon as the money was transferred I indicated they were owners and liable for all future costs. I gave free livery for 14 days and thereafter indicated I’d charge £25/day

 

[bluehorse]

Did you not write a receipt of sale etc?
Did you not get a receipt of sale etc?
Last horse I sold they couldn’t collect for a fortnight. As soon as the money was transferred I indicated they were owners and liable for all future costs. I gave free livery for 14 days and thereafter indicated I’d charge £25/day

Yes I did get a receipt, however I wasn’t given an option of livery for a couple of weeks, this was a pro dealer who wanted stables emptied once the horse was sold. I don’t blame him, i had to arrange transport hire as my lorry was in for respraying, not a big deal but not the most convenient. I don’t think we disagree, liability is the issue in my mind, free livery is neither here nor there if the seller doesn’t mind. The OP needs to make the buyer aware that liability for all costs is theirs one way or another.

 

[ihatework]

Sorry, got confused thought you were OP!

 

[SO1]

If she had Covid could she be really unwell or worse than that she could have died, perhaps one of her family now has Covid and needs caring for or is even in hospital.

What is the agreement if the horse fails the vetting will you have to return the money?

Maybe try and leave another message and ask them if everything is ok.

 

[Jellymoon]

Gosh, what a bizarre situation, to have got the money in full…and then nothing.
I think I would send a message saying if they don’t collect the horse by a certain date you will have to refund in full and re-advertise horse.
This is fair to both sides I think.

 

[honetpot]

I wouldn't refund the money, I would send a message that the horse is now hers, and she is now liable for any livery bills, insurance and vet bills, and if it's not collected by X date you will issue an abandonment notice, which means you can dispose of it.
https://www.*******.co.uk/hub/jump-to-abandonment-guidance/
If she changes her mind, and decides to collect, if it gets ill or injured you will be out of pocket. If you resell it you will cost time and money. I would create a 'paper trail' so if things do get nasty you have evidence of your attempts to contact her.
I never take deposits, it's cash/transfer on collection, that way it's clear who is responsible/paying for what.

 

[fawaz]

I would be inclined to think something has happened to the purchaser or their phone.

This does not help your situation at all.

You do need to make attempts to contact and let them know in writing (test, email or post) you are not liable for the horse and any costs she may be incurring since the sale and she is not sold 'subject to a vetting'... but sold with possession having taken place on the date you received funds and needs to be removed by (insert date).

Can you not hunt her down on social media or google? Put out a call out on forums for anyone who way know so and so from so and so?

 

[poiuytrewq]

This has happened before, there was a huge thread on here, possibly ages ago but I do remember following it.
So weird!
As above even if you don’t have an address I’d send an email or text, both of which you’ll have a trail of stating horse must be collected by x date or you will refund. I’m not sure but you could also request livery paid for the extra time your having to pay it?

 

[HBB]

This has happened before, there was a huge thread on here, possibly ages ago but I do remember following it.

I thought that too, I remember reading the thread.

 

[MidChristmasCrisis]

Money laundering????

 

[Reacher]

I thought that too, I remember reading the thread.

Me too - can’t remember whether / how the situation got resolved

 

[HBB]

Found it!

https://forums.horseandhound.co.uk/threads/horse-sold-and-not-collected.783075/

 

[Trouper]

For the sake of the poor horse I would back out of this now. If the buyer is so ill they cannot pick up a phone or find a way of contacting you, then they are not in a fit state to take on a horse. If they just don't care (or are money laundering!!) then in my book the same applies.

By now I would be so worried about the horse's future that I would back out today and refund.

 

[ycbm]

I would refund the money minus an amount for livery until the horse is resold and put him back up for sale. If you are asked to refund with some story about being terribly ill, do it to the same account as it came out of, you don't want to get caught in a money laundering scam.
.

 

[ycbm]

Dupe

 

[JackFrost]

ATM you have the chance to reverse this transaction and get out of it. The 'contract' for whatever reason has not been fulfilled.
I would send another text/message and say you consider the sale as cancelled, and refund the money. Personally I wouldn't complicate it by withholding any of it, just do a straight cancellation so you have an end to the matter.

I think there are others on the forum with expertise in contract law, but if you withhold money or charge for livery etc, it implies you consider the money is yours and the horse hers, so I would keep it very simple and just back out. Th contract, verbal or otherwise, was for her to pay and you to give the horse in return, this has not happened and the contract is not complete.