Buying advice - wind noise and splint?

[poiuytrewq]

Can you find out more about the period of grass rest in 2021....just wondering if something has been medicated during this time? Could be due to weather/ lack of rider/ any amount of other things though!

Could also be covid related. Cancelled events etc made a lot of people turn away for a while. ?‍

 

[ALFF]

Update 2

I went for the second viewing today, I was game on. Rode him, jumped, tacked and untacked, hacked him on the road with cars passing, hacked off road, loaded him on the trailer, had clippers turned on in his face. Checked teeth, legs, picked feet. He was a saint throughout.

Now the noise. Does start in trot (like short little sounds at the beat of the trot) and there's the slight roaring in canter. He seems to make no extra effort, very willing, barely broke a sweat in the hour he was rode and jumped. No different from the first viewing.

He's a little delight temperament wise and there were more viewings tomorrow so I put the deposit down and going to have it 5 stage vetted + endoscopy this week.

Let's say he needs a wind op. Will this cause him to fail the vetting?

Also - anyone who can tell me the cost of tieback or hobday? Equine hospital never came back to me.

Thank you all

 

[Gloi]

Well the vet will have to mention the noise on the vetting and the result of the endoscope but what you do with the information is up to you.

 

[black and brown]

Will you be present at the vetting? It looks like you have a big decision to make and being at the vetting may help you to ask direct questions at the time. Good luck, I hope it goes well.

 

[nagblagger]

He sounds ideal for you, exciting times.
I agree with B&B that it would be useful to be there at the vetting so concerns can be addressed at the time.
Keep us updated

 

[ALFF]

Will you be present at the vetting? It looks like you have a big decision to make and being at the vetting may help you to ask direct questions at the time. Good luck, I hope it goes well.

Thanks! I won't be there but have agreed with the vet they'll call me in between the vetting and the endoscopy. They're also sending a senior vet (more ££ but whatever helps understand what I'm getting into!).

 

[ALFF]

Ps. Pic of the cute bugger to reward yall

 

[ihatework]

One I had done on a standing laser hobday came in at about £800

A tie back came in a 2.5k

 

[Lucky Snowball]

Let’s all hope the vetting goes well and you’ve found a bargain. Good luck

 

[GreyDot]

Sounds like you were really thorough with your second viewing. Good luck with the vetting, write yourself down a list of questions so when the vet calls you, you have them to hand as it is so easy to forget in the moment. This is your opportunity to ask their opinion for what you want to do with the horse. Depending on the result of the vetting and any future op you might need to do, I would bite the bullet and negotiate a lower price. The owner/dealer obviously knows you are interested as you have arranged for a vetting/paid a deposit but remember that they want the horse sold, so don't be afraid to negotiate, especially as you may need to shell out quite a bit if he needs an operation, plus your insurance may be a lot higher than you expect.

 

[Birker2020]

Hello all

I'm looking at an Irish gelding just turned 7 years old, lovely temperament, competed up to 1.25m. He's about 16.2-16.3hh and is for sale with a reputable dealer.

I've been for first viewing yesterday and he rides very sound, if anything leaning a bit on the forehand but I am happy to perfect his carriage. I watched him jump and he is calm and correct. But he does a little wind noise in canter and has a hard (looks old) small splint on right front leg. He's got a 10k price tag but the seller thinks 8k is likely to be accepted.

Now. Is this worth vetting with x-rays or best to walk away? Also, would insurance reject him for the bits above?

I'm thorn as the issues may be only cosmetic but also may not be. Presently he seems a happy, sane and sound horse but I am no vet...

Any thoughts would be so appreciated, I am not new to riding but I am new to buying I really like this horse!

Thank you
Ana

I went to see a horse advertised at 16.3 and he turned out to be about 17.3hh and he also made a noise. The first issue with the height was enough to put me off but I'm ashamed to say I still got on him at this point as we'd come a long way and I thought I'd just see what he was like.

The sales video looked amazing and he looked a nice horse but the noise he made was awful. And when I asked the seller about the noise she said "what noise?" although you could hear it 50ft away!

So I walked away.

 

[Flowerofthefen]

Any update on the vetting?

 

[hock]

I’d want to know if it had ever had its hocks etc done.

 

[ALFF]

An update for yall.

The horse went for a 5 stage vertting with endoscopy on Thursday. Turns out that this horse, who's never had a sick day or period of rest according to the seller, has already had a wind op at age 7.

The left side of his throat was very paralysed, the vet said between stage 3 and 4. He said he may be ok but may also not be and need a tieback in a year, and that tiebacks can have complications later. The vet also found the horse had two hard old splints and a hint of conjunctivitis.

The vet did a fail certificate and I smoothly got my deposit back. Obviously I was sad because he had the best temperament and also he may not have a good life ahead of him with that wind worsening, whoever owns it.

I just wish that owners and sellers were honest in these cases, and not let a buyer go spend 500 pounds in vettings and examinations, when the horse obviously has such past issues. Maybe there is someone out there looking for gentle casual jumping and hacking and he would be perfect for them - but honesty about the health management this horse will need is required to find the right home.

As to me, the search continues...

Thank you all for guiding me, your tips were truly helpful

 

[ycbm]

I'm honestly surprised you haven't bought him. If he hasn't already been tied back, and if you can still see the paralysis he either hasn't, or it has come undone, then presumably the previous wind op was just a hobday. He is still a candidate for a tieback which is done on thousands of horses, most of which (like mine) have nothing but good results from.

If he does the job you want him to do now, and he's as good a price as I think was being suggested, then he sounds like a good buy who you had a good time riding, and apart from the paralysed larynx (which due to the design of the nerve to the vocal cord is incredibly common in big horses) nothing significant was found during the vetting.

This sounds like an over cautious vetting, given the horse was known to make a noise before it was carried out. Am I missing something?
.

 

[ALFF]

I'm honestly surprised you haven't bought him. If he hasn't already been tied back, and if you can still see the paralysis he either hasn't, or it has come undone, then presumably the previous wind op was just a hobday. He is still a candidate for a tieback which is done on thousands of horses, most of which (like mine) have nothing but good results from.

If he does the job you want him to do now, and he's as good a price as I think was being suggested, then he sounds like a good buy who you had a good time riding, and apart from the paralysed larynx (which due to the design of the nerve to the vocal cord is incredibly common in big horses) nothing significant was found during the vetting.

This sounds like an over cautious vetting, given the horse was known to make a noise before it was carried out. Am I missing something?
.

I must confess that the lack of disclosure from seller / owner increased the risk in my eyes, and also encouraged me to rely more on the vet. I particularly was weary of the failed wind op.

Had they been honest from the get go I may have approached it differently, but in the end felt like too much of a risk. The vet specifically told me he wouldn't buy the horse himself. The noise he made was pretty bad for a horse that already had surgery as well.

If you want you can buy him yourself though ahah just pm me and I'll point you! He was thoroughly lovely and I would want the best home for him

 

[nutjob]

I would have walked away as well if the seller blatantly lied like that. They should have just disclosed the prior wind op and explained that the price, which was cheap, reflected this. They could have made the vet notes available instead of wasting your money on the endoscopy.

 

[chaps89]

But in all honesty would the general lay person know the horse had been operated on already? Or is it only when the vet scope is doing it’s thing that it’s obvious?
I feel as though if the seller/owner knew they wouldn’t have allowed the extra scoping to go ahead as they’d have known it would be found? It feels plausible anyway that it could have happened in a home prior to this, before the seller gets slated any more.
(Unless of course they owned up to it once the vetting was done but you don’t mention that?)
The eyes and splints wouldn’t worry me at all otherwise.
It’s a shame as he sounds a nice person and cheap in this market for what he is but I understand you walking away.

 

[ycbm]

I don't think the average owner who hasn't seen it done would ever realise that a horse had a hobday. Did the seller actually own the horse at 5 and know? It doesn't seem like they could hide anything to me, he was sold as a clearly audible roarer. The only thing a failed hobday would normally mean is that the stiffening of the throat through deliberately scarring it didn't stop the noise. A hobday doesn't ever cure the paralysis of the larynx, it just reduces the wind turbulence and noise. It isn't normally a "failed" operation in that the operation was done wrongly or broke down after , just one that didn't, as it often doesn't, stop the noise this time.

I do understand walking away after that vet's advice, but if the horse is a good price in this market (and if it's a genuine 1.25 showjumper then it was maybe £10k? off) and otherwise sound and able to do the job wanted now, and a tieback is still an option, and tubing is available as a final option (this was the op many racehorses had before tiebacks became available), then I'm a bit surprised they are being quite so cautious.


ETA I've owned two roarers who were scoped with laryngeal paralysis. One couldn't be operated on but I hunted him happily alongside another horse who made an equally loud noise. He lived a long life after leaving me as a low level dressage horse with no problems. The other I had operated on because I wanted him to event, and the tieback caused no issues at all. In the old days I saw a lot of ex racers with a plug in a hole in the neck that was removed when doing fast work. An extraordinarily high proportion of larger horses have laryngeal paralysis.

Just for info when others read the thread, not trying to convince you to buy him!

 

[ycbm]

A picture of what we are talking about for anyone interested. Left side laryngeal paralysis (is almost always left side due to the routing of the nerve) and a tieback wound shortly after surgery.

 

[SusieT]

I think you are entirely right to walk away. The vet findings simply gel with the idea that someone just wants to sell the horse and gloss over any 'minor' issues so you are entirely right to think what else haven't they mentioned.
I think you were encouraged too much on here anyway about how 'minor' a wind problem can be. Yes, lots do well but not all and airway issues re a definite issue for an active sporting animal . Why spend good money on an animal you know requires a surgery that is not without its risks.

There's a reason he was so cheap - hopefully he finds a nice home who wants to do things well within his capability.

 

[SusieT]

I'd also entirely trust a vet who was waving a big red flag and saying walk away- in my experience this is rare - and we have to remember vets see far more of the horses that didn't work out than the average lay person as they are the ones who have to try and fix them when it all goes wrong.

 

[ycbm]

I'd also entirely trust a vet who was waving a big red flag and saying walk away- in my experience this is rare - and we have to remember vets see far more of the horses that didn't work out than the average lay person as they are the ones who have to try and fix them when it all goes wrong.

Excellent point.