Clarify a botler and something that is running away.

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Agent XXX999

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Just to clarify, the below post has raised a point and people seem to disagree, however.

A horse that BOLTS is something that goes from 0-60 instantly, flat out gallop and with no regard for itself or rider. Stearing it into a gate/fence is likely to be met with it running through it. It is off on one and has no rational thought or reason, does not self preserve and is a complete nut job (nice word vicjip)

A horse that runs off will stop if you yank hard enough or turn it. It has self preservation and will stop if you point it at a tree, for instance (A bolter will run through trees/brambles/ fences whatever, without thought of injury)

The primary difference between a bolter and a horse that runs off is that one can be cured and the other is probably one of the most dangerous horses you will sit on.

To day a horse that runs off is bolting is like saying a country lane is the fast lane on the m40 - same thing (a road) but in reality completely different.
 
I'm still confused by this, I imagine everyone has different levels of strength, and one person may be able to stop or turn a horse that a weaker/in shock/unbalanced rider may not?? When I say bolter, I mean unprovoked (ie not spooking) and with no warning (ie not on its toes, prancing around etc) galloping off and rider being unable to stop or turn the horse, and yes self preservation does come into it. I can't imagine many horses galloping through a field of 5ft plus high, densely planted corn on the cob for about a mile without stopping, then along a main road. He also (I hadn't mentioned before) barged straight through fencing; electric, post and rail then metal mesh wire about 7ft high like you get in zoos last week.

having said that, because these riders couldn't stop him, isn't to say that no rider could...both are middle aged women
 
Hmmm, if he is going through fencing etc I would say its bolting, does he ever stop? As in, if you yanked his back teeth out and pointed him at dense undergrowth, what would he do?

Or if you pointed him at a ten ton truck? A bolter would take on the truck?
 
So if I have a little welsh cob who we know was badly abused, who flattens and runs for it with no thought for himself (full acceleration straight into the side of an indoor school on one occasion) is he a bolter?

He's not strong normally, if he gets a bit excited on a fast ride or XC he'll put his head down and take hold of the bit but he's not difficult to stop. When he's "gone" there is no sensitivity or reaction the end of the reins - a solid log and he's running with his head straight out in front of him

But what if when you are in a big enough area you can stay on top (he's flat out, not bucking or deviating) and eventually pull him round into a circle, sitting on him as "loosely" as possible, giving him no further cause for panic but talking or singing quietly until he does stop. I'm talking about only holding onto one side of his mouth, no STOP signals, just to keep him on a circle. And if you can work with him so that each time he "goes" the length of time it takes for the terror to subside and him to become controllable again is less. Is he then a bolter?

And further, what if you can modify his behaviour so that when you can recognise what signals his brain is getting giving him the run message you can take avoiding action to defuse the situation? So he visibly starts to flatten but you can reassure him and he stops after a couple of strides? How should he then be labelled?

That's where we are at now with the little cob. He may be a special case because he only "goes" if he thinks he's made a mistake for which he is going to be punished - but when he goes all you can do is physically pull him round. He now gets the trigger only if he has a pole down (which is probably where the abuse started) and he can be resettled almost instantly.

This pony will be staying with us for the rest of his life - we are aware how dangerous he is if you don't understand him but he has given us years of fun and taught us so much (including not to buy another one like him!) and I'm intrigued to know how he should be labelled.
 
If he did all that loose then don't take it into account. The horse was scared.
See, I would expect most horses to not think twice about galloping through a field of maize. I think you are giving them too much credit in the intellegence stakes!
 
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Not as a bolter, you can't circle a bolter.
Maybe 'a sensitive' ride.

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Took the words right out of my mouth so to speak.

You say it yourself - you can 'eventually' stop him.

With a bolter you cant. If you had a barbed wire bit in you would still not be able to stop/turn/whatever
 
To me a bolter is a horse that goes off in a blind panic completely oblivious to its surroundings and rider. I had a bolter that bolted straight across a main road and slipped over in the process. We sent her to a dealer and lets say she ended up as meat!

A horse that is running away to me tends to of taken a hold a bit, compeltely aware of its owner but with the correct riding will stop. My mare often does this in the school or when she is scared but we always stop.

A horse that bolts IMO there is only one thing for it and that is a bullet for its safety and for those around it
 
I have only sat on 2 that have seriously legged it, 1 ran headfirst into a tree and stopped pretty quick and the other went through a barbed wire fence onto a railway BUT they had both done something vaguely naughty beforehand and felt like they were expecting a proper hiding. Both had come from yards where i know methods were on the hard side, so - are bolters born or made??
 
I'm not sure you're quite understanding what he bolted through vicijp, as I didn't until I was shown.

maniscorse, I used to ride a tiny fine little show pony who used to just run like that, she'd run straight through fences without a second thought (I used to throw myself off!), I wouldn't classify her as a bolter tho, just scared and not particularly bright!

*edited as I can't type!*
 
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Bit of both really, same as rearers.
They have to have the mentality in the first place, but if treated right (riding and medical) it can be controlled.

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That's interesting. We have one of them at home turned out and retired now and she is really quiet but every now and again will have a turn which is completely over the top and unprovoked so it does make sense that, although you can usually manage them, they'll always have that side.
 
I had a horse that did that but kicking, she'd be as quiet as anything eating then start wildly double barrelling the air in the field
crazy.gif
 
I think bolting is one of those things where if it's happened to you (or even just that you've seen it happen) you'll know it for sure but very few people have actually had the *real* experience and so think all sorts of lesser situations are essentially the same.

They're not.

If you've ever really, truly been bolted with you know it does not feel the same as a horse getting strong/refusing to stop/running off in excitement. The second horse has control of the situation (barring slippery ground, unexpected turns etc - it's not exactly a safe state of affairs either!) and is still thinking somewhat rationally about what it's doing. A horse running in panic feels completely different, physically and mentally. The body feels "away" from the rider and unaffectable and the mind is just sort of a red haze. It's terrifying.

Often bolters are not particularly strong the rest of the time although in my experience they often show unacceptable levels of tension routinely, even when they don't actually "crack". Often the reaction is highly situational and probably motivated by pain/fear/memory of mistreatment etc. Once the horse is gone, it's gone.

Horses that won't stop (for whatever reason, and I agree this is a bit subjective) feel "normal" just not in the control of the rider. I suspect more people than would admit it work in this area quite frequently. I talk to to people all the time who don't really have what I would consider reasonable control of their horses but don't seem to consider it a problem but I guess to each their own. Often horses like this are really only doing a faster/stronger/less acceptable version of something they do quite a lot of the time and the real variable is the rider's ability to control the situation.

I'm not sure about bolters being "incurable". I've worked with some that have really come around although it takes time, patience, effort and management. I would say they aren't horses for inexperienced riders or people who aren't prepared to "manage" the situation but then they were probably unsuited for that position in the first place by virute of temperment etc. I wouldn't rule out a physical cause, either - I've known quite a few bolters who were diagnosed sometimes well after the fact and "cured" with veterinary/therapeutic intervention.

I've also known a few that I suspect were mentally ill or pathalogical in some very deep way. One eventually developed symptoms of a brain disturbance, possibly a tumour. Two more came from the same mare's family and the whole lot of them were very odd indeed. One remains the only horse I've ever got on for the first time and immediately wanted to get off. She ended up hurting three people quite seriously (me included) and her siblings were little better.
 
my horse bolted once - there was no-one riding her thank the lord - the lightening struck in her field and hit the wall, terryfying her - she jumped out the field, galloped down the lane and smashed straight thru the middle of a 5 bar wooden gate, snapping it clean in half - i swear to god she didnt even see it in her blinded panic - she then proceeded flat out towards her stable - can only preseume she was heading for safety, unfortunately my brothers van was parked in the way, she saw it at the last minute, attempted to jump it, crashed thru the windscreen, slid off and galloped off into a field where we got her. she was v v lucky and only had minor cuts. that is a bolt, she was blinded by her fear
 
Toff has bolted with me once, I ended up in the bottom of the ditch as I had NO control and NO steering. Quite often she has run away with me and I have managed to circle and slow down but fortunately she has only bolted the once, and I hope she never does again, it was terrifying and took me a while to trust her again.
Although part of me wishes she could recreate that speed but in a controlled way
grin.gif
Twas breath-taking, literally!!

ETS - can a horse "bolt" the once? I wouldn't say she was a bolter but she hasn't done anything like that before or since?? She was in an open setaside field and seemed to panic and freak out??
 
Think in the whole time I have been riding I have only sat on one bolter, I have also sat on a horse that was called a bolter, but that really just ran off. The first was a welsh pony, who was only 11hh but when he went there was nothing you could do, as he was only tiny, you just had to come off, he went through hedges, over roads nothing stopped him.

The other was Hector, when I got him he had a reputation as a bolter, but I had seen him 'go' with someone and wasn't convinced. When he did go with me there was no one home, BUT I managed to steer him into a huge hedge and he went halfway into it and then stopped. So wouldn't say he was a bolter, just incredibly strong!
 
Im not sure tbh.
I've known a horse as you say. The time she bolted I ended upside down in a hedge, but she never bolted before or since.
I would suspect her problem was down to bursting blood vessel.
Your horse sounds like a 'bolter' that has been managed by a good rider/someone that knows her.
With a lesser rider on would she become more of a handful?
 
Possibly. I do now avoid situations that could result in it happening again eg large open spaces on my own, she never does it in company. I have never gone back to that field!
She does take the p**s with others, the first time my mate rode her in the schooling field she bucked and ran off with her....
She has had many homes in the past and I have tried to find out more about her but failed.
In the winter the Waterford is my friend
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The horse that bolted with me went from 0 - 60 in o seconds
absolutely nothing i could do. it ran along one fence that seriously injured and i bailed out seconds before it ploughed through a school fence and five bar gate. I swear it's not right in the head. i never sat on it again
 
We had a horse that arrived for the riding school around 10 yrs ago now and he was a nightmare and a bolter, he would take off in a blind panic at a flat out gallop whether in a field or in the school. On one occasion he bolted and was pointed at a 6 ft plus hedge which is proceeded in jumping, landing in the road onto a car bonnet- luckily only the car was injured!Another time he bolted and the rider pulled so hard to pull him up that the rein snapped off the bridle and the rider had to bale out- terrifing!

We worked hard to re school him and we still have him now and he is one of the best horses in the school!
 
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