Coffin joint DJD

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sitting_pretty

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Would love some advice/experiences from anyone would has dealt with coffin joint issues!

Long story short, sport horse been 2/10th lame since March, got to the point where he was pretty much sound on concrete but lame in the school. After initial vet visit, I was advised to ride gently to keep him moving but he would be slightly lamer after a gentle hack.

First trip to the vets, nerve blocks made him sound when the coffin bone was numbed, but still lame when numbed futher back seeminly ruling out navicular disease. X-rays clear.

Second trip to the vet last week, nerve blocking to the coffin joint made him sound and although his x-rays are completely clear he was diagnosed with suspected degenerative joint disease in the coffin joint. Vet injected the joint with steriods and has told me to box rest him for 2 days then turn him out (with flat pads fitted on his front feet), and gentle hacking for 20 mins only for the next month before a reassessment.

I was a bit taken aback/unaware of the implications of the diagnosis when I was at the vets so really didn't ask as many questions as I should have. The vet said that it may be that he only needs one injection to get him back to being sound again long term, or it might be the case that he has to be reinjected every 3ish months. I asked whether he would ever get back to normal (competing affiliated BS) and he said it wouldn't be definite but he hopes so... He's only rising 10 and started properly jumping last year so hasn't done too much too young.

I should say that he has never had any swelling or heat anywhere, and what confuses me is the fact that his x-rays were near perfect. Is this common for a DJD diagnosis? Could joint inflammation be caused by a one off injury, or does the joint usually only become inflamed at the onset of arthritis?

Sorry for the long post... any feedback would be appreciated!
 
we had this diagnosis - which I think essentially occurs when no changes on x-ray but lameness blocks to the joint.

He also had some reverse rotation to his pedal bones (but the same in both, only lame in one- heels low and under run) and assessing his movement suggested it might well have a soft tissue contingent too as he landed laterally- worse on the lame foot, so I suspect some collateral ligament damage. - He was 19 though.

He was rested, shod in bar shoes and we managed to get the heels up but didn't improve soundness. He was then injected but went lame as soon as he started trotting again. 6 months post diagnosis I took his shoes off and started walking. He has never looked back, is 22 this year and was hunting this winter again.

Would you consider taking his shoes off for at least a period of time (if mine was younger I would poss shoe him again for the competing season but not an issue anymore, then let feet have a break after)? I do think the feet have a remarkable ability to get themselves better and put their own supportive structures in place. The problem with pads is that they can often result in thinner soles in the end.

We can give you loads more info on the shoes off approach if you want it but thought I'd just suggest it/tell you my experience first ;). I went against by gut by agreeing to go the conventional approach first but I always had a time limit on how long I would give it before I tried something else.
 
I'm more or less the same as ester, my boy was 17, shod with wedges as feet angles were awful, steroids injected, no real improvement so took shoes off with vie to retiring, came back in to light work after a while, went lame again though with hindsight repeat lameness coincided with massive changes in his hoof angle. sound again now and still unshod, so have started light hacking again almost 18 months on.
 
sitting_pretty, my first horse's problems started with this exact scenario, I followed vets advice to the letter and I "thought" she was getting better, but time and time again further more drastic remedial shoeing was neede until there was nowhere left to go. I used adequate, steroids, the lot. I lost her in 2000, aged 13.

I am now a barefoot trimmer and I save other peoples horses (and my own) from the same fate.

Each person has their own journey to go through, but I firmly believe these coffin joint problems are man-made and are reversible through using barefoot methods.
 
I agree Andalucian, when I look back at my poor boy's feet when I first got him, I can't believe he was even sound then. His feet were awful! So glad I trusted my instincts and took shoes off.
 
See Frank's didn't look awful with shoes on, better than a lot I see about, they did look worse when you took the shoes off but they also looked better post remedial shoeing but I think that although the shell looked better the internal structures weren't. There's a TB on my yard whose feet I wince a bit when I pick them out, but if they aren't cracking they are deemed good (I may have had to say everything is relative when someone said 'his feet are good at the moment') He is shod by a very good farrier but I suspect he will get to a point where he goes lame from his feet eventually. The surprised comments I get from a huge range of people about having a busy barefoot native always amuses me a bit, if they are surprised at that I'd hate to see their reaction to a TB!
 
:) sheep. My current two horses are both 20, both taken barefoot at 10 years old after navicular confirmed on X-ray. Both 16 hands plus TB/warm bloods, both still eventing! Joy.
 
Can completely relate! My horse was diagnosed 3 years ago! Now she seems to have turned a corner, being on a new yard, lots of turnout, flat fields and a new joint supplement! She still goes lame occasionally but after 3 years I've been learning what she can or can't cope with!
 
Hi all, I've chanced across this thread when I was researching other peoples experiences with arthritis. My 10yr old ISH has recently been diagnosed with coffin joint arthritis. He had steroid injections into joints with no improvement and bar shoes (also haven't seemed to do anything). Vet was out again yesterday and has said unfortunately it looks like bute will be the only thing going forward to keep him sound. I'm keen to explore any option I can to try and make him more comfortable and have a few more years of active life. Have tried turmeric also to no avail as yet!

I'm interested to hear more about going barefoot. His feet aren't great and I've recently put him on a biotin supplement in the hope of improving his hoof structure but obviously results from this will be long term. But does barefoot literally mean you just take their shoes off and go with it? Do they have to be trimmed? Do you need to use a special 'barefoot' farrier for this? I imagine if I just took his shoes off they'd be soft and crumble to start with as they are poor, with maybe with the biotin and as he got used to having no shoes they'd harden up?


PLEASE let me know your experiences. I really want to help my horse and not keen on subjecting him to a life of being buted up! Thanks!
 
Hi AJT,

The usual important steps for transitioning

Diet - low sugar (may need grass restricting)
supplements - biotin won't usually do it on his own, use a good all round based no iron supplement like forage plus, or pro hoof (from pro_earth on ebay- they send you sweets too!) I use equimins advanced complete as my horse is fussy and he will at least eat that and let me add some more magnesium as our grazing is very high in calcium.
Micronised linseed - available from a few online suppliers and some local merchants too - about £25ish a sack which lasts me about 5 months. I think it is usually fed at 100-200g per day, in my world he gets one mug in summer (when I don't want any additional weight) and 2 a day in winter ;).
Depending on hoof quality/amount of lameness you might want to feed this for a bit before removing, although you can remove and boot if necessary.

Movement- feet need stimulating, however to start with the stimulation has to be appropriate and within the horse's abilities. I can only tell you what worked for F as they are all a bit individual. We set up a 'paddock paradise' track with electric fencing round the edge of our 4 acre field instead of strip grazing as they move more. Shoes were removed in the April at end of shoeing cycle and nothing trimmed. I started walking on the road in hand for 5 mins a day, slowly increasing it, sometimes doing 2 shorter trips. On week 6 he got sore (this happens quite a bit as the feet self shorten, blood flow increases and they sort of wake up) and most work on the roads was in boots for the rest of the summer, I took them off on grassy stretches and we cantered in the september and have never looked back.

Re. farrier/trimmer yes some do need trimming and I think it is good to have someone on hand who knows about transitioning to bare, my farrier admitted he was a bit clueless taking lame horses bare so I got a UKNCHP trimmer on board who I am still in contact with now and was a good hand holder. If you go with a farrier get one who has done it before/has hardworking barefoot horses on their books.

trimmer qualifications in the UK are: UKNCHP, EPAUK and DAEP. Not that regulated but at least something and you can go with how you feel about people too.
helpful forum: http://phoenixhorse.myfastforum.org/
 
Hi Ester.

Sorry I have only just seen this response, apparently I don't get notified all the time to responses on threads!

All that information you've given is so useful and it's definitely something I'm going to try. I'm just trying to get all of my ducks in a row and find suitable supplements, barefoot trimmers etc then I'm all set for barefoot.

Thanks for all of the advice and support, it's nice to be able to talk to people in the same boat.
 
An update on my boy, he's been back in work since June and is totally sound (not on bute, just a joint supplement, and flat leather pads on both front feet) and been jumping better than ever at BS competitions.

I still worry that he could go lame again at any time and am very careful, but hopefully this info will give others some hope!
 
My horse has had three coffin joint injections in an eleven and a half year period. His xrays showed moderate to severe changes, his last xrays showed virtually no difference although there was a few years between the xrays so its very slow progression.

I am interested that your vet says it may be that your horse only requires one injection to get him back to being sound again long term. I was under the impression that steroid injections were only effective for about 12 months and then needed to be repeated, although this is not the case obviously for my horse.

I have always wondered if he was misdiagnosed at the time of the xrays as he had an active splint at the time and i thought maybe the xrays were just showing something up that wasn't actually the cause of the problem. I tried the Equipak with my horse who is a 17.1hh WB approx 690 KG. I didn't find them very effective as they broke up after about four or five days. The rubber pads are better but then I was told by my vet or farrier (can't remember which) that they do not provide concussion protection, just stop debris getting under the foot.
 
It is interesting isn't it, my vet would give 3-6 months max with 12 being unusual so perhaps something was going on with your chap re his diagnosis. F had the diagnosis on joint nerve block as no change on xray so should have been an ideal candidate but limited impact of injecting. I guess that is partly why I think we would have found other issues if we MRI'd
 
ester said:
It is interesting isn't it, my vet would give 3-6 months max with 12 being unusual so perhaps something was going on with your chap re his diagnosis. F had the diagnosis on joint nerve block as no change on xray so should have been an ideal candidate but limited impact of injecting. I guess that is partly why I think we would have found other issues if we MRI'd
Click to expand...

Hmmm makes you wonder.
 
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