Coming up to 4 months since the shoes were taken off... what do you think?

[BigGinger]

Personally I am very happy with the way they are going... Boots have been a god send!! At times i felt sorry for the guy as he was sore on stony surfaces (then again he is a tb )

Who would have thought leaving feet to their own devices (with the help of his boots) could totally change the shape of his feet.

Here a some pics of them at the beginning and how they look now.

this is front right hoof beginning of June

And now 3 month or so onwards

Front Left Hoof beginning of June

Front Left today

Front Left June 2012

Front Left Today

Front Right June

Front Right Today

To me his feet have moved backwards (if thats the right word to use, probably not lol), he has more heel to support his feet and his toes have moved back. You can see the new hoof is growing with quite a definate line...not sure if this is a good thing? and they dont look as flared as they previously had.

This is only the beginning of our transition and he may need boots for work all his life but feel i've made the right decision as when he was shod i always felt that something wasn't right.

What do you think? Any advice good or bad welcome

 

[Oberon]

Solar views would be helpful and what is he eating?

What is with that lump on his wall? Did something of note happen then?

 

[cptrayes]

I think that he is heading very much in the right direction but that at four months it would be normal to have almost a complete foot through to the floor and he seems only to have a bit over an inch.

Could he do with some diet changes, or perhaps more movement, or both?

It looks like his new hoof is a good bit thicker than the old one???

 

[BigGinger]

Solar views would be helpful and what is he eating?

What is with that lump on his wall? Did something of note happen then?

I was lazy and didnt want to pick his fett out on the clean floor but can get some more pics tomorrow.

He's at grass at the moment. Feed wise he yets:

Alpha a Oil
Allen & Page c&c
Brewers Yeast
Magnesium
And at present a Gut Balancer from my vets as he was on box rest with a knee injury and poo's went sloppy.

The little vertical indent, I'm not sure what he has done there I only noticed it today just feels like a flakey bit off hoof.

 

[BigGinger]

I think that he is heading very much in the right direction but that at four months it would be normal to have almost a complete foot through to the floor and he seems only to have a bit over an inch.

Could he do with some diet changes, or perhaps more movement, or both?

It looks like his new hoof is a good bit thicker than the old one???

It does seem that the new hoof is thicker than the old.. is this good or bad? I've added in the above post what his current diet is.

 

[mightymammoth]

I *think* that the alpha a and calm and condition will have a lot of sugars in them. I feed fast fibre and a handful of pure feeds fibre balance plus pro hoof supplement and micronised linseed. Hopefully oberon or cptrayes will see this and comment also

 

[9tails]

I think that he is heading very much in the right direction but that at four months it would be normal to have almost a complete foot through to the floor and he seems only to have a bit over an inch.

I thought a whole new hoof would take about a year to grow all the way down, I think he's going great guns to grow super new hooves there.

 

[BigGinger]

I did alot of searching for feeds that will maintain his weight but low in sugars and hes done well on this so far and they have a very low % of sugars but please proove me wrong if i am.

He's prone to stomach ulcers also so his diet was looked at closely so that it is low sugar, high fibre

 

[thatsmygirl]

From what I understand alfa a is low in sugar/starch but can and is known to make horses footy and nobody seems to know why. So worth keeping in mind if you get problems or no more improvment. C&C is also quite high in starch ( more than the 10% combined) aaa general rule.
I worried about weight gain with my lad as he's a tb and was on conditioning feeds but he's now feed fast fibre, linseed, calmag,salt, equimins advance complete and ers pellets. He's doing well on this and put a lot off weight on since iv cut out the high sugar/starch feeds.
I would add a vit/min supplement to make sure your horse is getting all he needs.
My lad also has a ridge like the wall is growing thicker. My trimmer isn't worried

 

[Holly Hocks]

His feet look similar to how my TBs went - she also had the ridge on the hoof which seemed to be timed with when the shoes were taken off and the new hoof started growing. She had her shoes taken off last November and has only just grown a whole new hoof so I think you're doing fine. I also thought I would always need boots, but we're now hacking out happily unbooted with no footiness at all. I agree with Victoria1980x re the feed. I fed exactly the same as her, although I've now changed the Fast Fibre to the Pure Feed Company Pure Easy as she went off the Fast Fibre.

 

[ribbons]

You're quite right 9tails.
A new hoof from coronet to ground Takes around 9 to 12 months to grow at the toe.
6 to 8 months at the quarters and 4 to 5 months at the heel.

 

[Oberon]

I was lazy and didnt want to pick his fett out on the clean floor but can get some more pics tomorrow.

He's at grass at the moment. Feed wise he yets:

Alpha a Oil
Allen & Page c&c
Brewers Yeast
Magnesium
And at present a Gut Balancer from my vets as he was on box rest with a knee injury and poo's went sloppy.

The little vertical indent, I'm not sure what he has done there I only noticed it today just feels like a flakey bit off hoof.

If he has been on box rest, that will explain why the growth is slower than you would normally see. Movement = stimulation and stimulation = growth.

Alfa-A Oil is a choice - some horses don't do as well on alfalfa (my personal trouble was the high calcium messing with my forage balance).

Calm and Condition is only 5% sugar.....but it is 13% starch. You need to consider both figures as starch and sugar are both non structural carbohydrates within the body (NSCs). So combined you are feeding 18%. Recommendations is never to go above 10% in a bucket. You have to consider the NSCs in the grass as well.

http://www.safergrass.org/pdf/excess_carbs.pdf

The reason I am focusing on diet is that despite your careful choices for him -the ripples in the wall, the footiness and need for boots, the sloppy poops and the slow growth suggest issues.

It may all be related to the problems he's had....but it's worth thinking about diet if you find yourself hitting a plateau in improvements .

 

[cptrayes]

It does seem that the new hoof is thicker than the old.. is this good or bad? I've added in the above post what his current diet is.

It's GREAT !

I thought a whole new hoof would take about a year to grow all the way down, I think he's going great guns to grow super new hooves there.

You're quite right 9tails.
A new hoof from coronet to ground Takes around 9 to 12 months to grow at the toe.
6 to 8 months at the quarters and 4 to 5 months at the heel.

I think you may be judging that from your barefoot brood mares Ribbons? All my barefooters have been a lot quicker than 9 months to the toe. If you take a look at the pictures on Rockleyfarm.co.uk, you will see many horses produce at least an inch of foot in the first month that they are there. Movement is essential and with movement, growth is a lot faster than you are suggesting, which are more typical of rates for a shod horse than a working barefooter. The fact that the horse has been on box rest would account for the slow growth.

 

[LucyPriory]

All my barefooters have been a lot quicker than 9 months to the toe. Movement is essential and with movement, growth is a lot faster than you are suggesting, which are more typical of rates for a shod horse than a working barefooter. The fact that the horse has been on box rest would account for the slow growth.

I agree - and would add that a hoof grown by an otherwise sick horse may come down slowly too - but most of the ones I do (sick ones excepted) will replace a hoof capsule in 5-6 months

 

[TigerTail]

If he has been on box rest, that will explain why the growth is slower than you would normally see. Movement = stimulation and stimulation = growth.

Alfa-A Oil is a choice - some horses don't do as well on alfalfa (my personal trouble was the high calcium messing with my forage balance).

Calm and Condition is only 5% sugar.....but it is 13% starch. You need to consider both figures as starch and sugar are both non structural carbohydrates within the body (NSCs). So combined you are feeding 18%. Recommendations is never to go above 10% in a bucket. You have to consider the NSCs in the grass as well.

http://www.safergrass.org/pdf/excess_carbs.pdf

The reason I am focusing on diet is that despite your careful choices for him -the ripples in the wall, the footiness and need for boots, the sloppy poops and the slow growth suggest issues.

It may all be related to the problems he's had....but it's worth thinking about diet if you find yourself hitting a plateau in improvements .

As above - Id be adding micronised linseed and if really necessary growing oats instead of the Alpha A oil and c+c

The other thing is that if you always boot him his soles wont callous up enough, presuming they arent being trimmed, so whilst its not nice to see him footy, unless he's hopping id be doing 10-15 mins in hand over different surfaces to help with this process

 

[BigGinger]

Thank you for the advise..

Oberon, i have been looking at the c&c and was quite shocked really at the combined starch and sugar content. He is a good weight and does seem to hold his weight so was thinking of moving him onto fast fibre which has alot less % of sugar/starch. and add micronised linseed for condition if needed..
Do u think theres a need for chaff/alpha to be added into the diet and is so what would u reccomend?
Seems like everyday is a new learning day.

 

[BigGinger]

Tigertail, he only wears boots when being worked(being brought back into work) and that depends what terrain we are on.. he does walk on unlevel ground, hard ground and some stoney (i let him pick his way) i can probably up his work without boots on different ground as i know this is the whole journey. I've just got in the habit of putting boots on for work.

 

[ester]

Its interesting what some are saying about growth rate.. Franks growth line is down a bit more for the same time point but certainly less far than the rockley horses seem to be. I'm a bit impatient with it tbh but not sure can do anything different? be curious whether you guys think his is also particularly slow.

19 weeks I think!

BG Frank gets fastfibre.. he isn't particularly enamoured with it and doesn't like it too wet, have pondered whether he might be better with a bit of chaff with it but is now eating it all better! He also gets linseed for coat and joints (not req for condition in his case!)