Comment about spurs... thoughts?

S

Switchthehorse

Well-Known Member
Joined
5 June 2009
Messages
516
Location
Nottingham
darcyandme.wordpress.com
I saw a comment on another post about spurs and it got me thinking (need a lie down now!) Someone had commented on that veeery long discussion about the horse with all the gadgetry saying 'why would you need spurs if you have all of that in your horses mouth'.

I don't have 'all of that' in my horses mouth but I do have quite a strong bit plus grakle plus martingale etc for show jumping/xc because she is a tank and yet i ride in spurs because in between the tanking she throws in nasty run outs and these happen more if I don't have my spurs on to give her a 'reminder' on the way into scary fillers.

I have heard the odd comments at shows about my bridle/bit/spurs combo.. but is it so wrong!!??? Seems to me I have a logical reasoning behind it...

Caveat with all the normal been riding for 30 odd years, know what i am doing, not a numpty beginner etc etc

Surely we each know our horses and so know what is needed? Wheres the scandal about my brakes/impulsion combo!?
 
well I use a Pelham for jumping (no brakes) and wear spurs because the big sod sometimes doesn't listen to me. a quick nudge is all it takes - I'm not using them to go faster :o

you might be wearing them
but that doesn't mean your using them :)
 
I have never ridden in spurs, but I can see why people would use them. In a moment of lost concentration on the horses behalf, you need to bring the horse back to you to avoid serious problems! Once you get to a certain level of eventing I think you HAVE to wear spurs whilst cross country.... I may be wrong.
Same with a whip, if you know your horse and you're experienced then you know what combination works best for you and your horse. With my old horse I always carried a schooling whip out hacking, got me out of many a sticky situation. But my new horse, I wouldn't carry a whip nor wear spurs, he's far too sensitive.

As long as the aids are not being used maliciously, then its whatever works for you and your horse.
 
I dont like to see kids with spurs and harsh bits but it depends on the kid, I mean those who kick like stink and then need a strong bit to haul the pony to a stop!

I think in terms of normal adult riders i think people misunderstand the use of spurs. They are not a go forward, leg on all the time tool, they should not be used to make the horse go faster. Spurs are for refinements of the leg aids, only used when concsiously (sp!) applied by the rider. Whether this to give sharper direct commands for dressage work or round a course of jumping.

Comments will be made regarding strong bits and spurs but it is down to the quality of the riding. Top level dressage, SJ and event riders more often than not will wear spurs but bet the majority of time they never touch the horse
 
I'd ignore it! It's very easy from the comfort of your sofa to wax lyrical about how all horses should go in snaffles and respond to your seat - however when you are sat on a horse and are trying to get around a course then it can be an entirely different matter! Horses don't pop out perfectly trained, and some are exceedingly hard to train into these snaffle mouthed saints (for what ever reason), so ride the horse you have. So long as you have considered what you need rather than wacking it on for fashion, then go right ahead and ignore the comments! Obv if you can improve your horse and so require less kit through schooling then that is ideal anyway.
 
I have never used spurs. I don't have any issues with people using spurs... Unless they aren't using them properly. I saw a horse with cuts on his sides from spurs at a BE event a few years ago, IMO there are many people who use them incorrectly.
 
I have a heavy cob type and yes i do use spurs, not to make him go but just to reinforce what i am asking him to do. I use the Mark Todd roller ones. They don't dig in but roll over the surface, it has helped a lot as i was starting to look like i should be doing pony club camp not simple dressage.
 
I used to hunt a horse in a dutch gag and spurs. He was a very nappy horse who would go up/down/sideways/backwards anywhere but where you wanted him to go either at the meet or out on exercise to the point where he would become dangerous, first time I ever sat on him he spun, backed into a bus shelter, scared himself, backed out and sat on the bonnet of a parked car. I needed the spurs to give my that extra 'umph' to get him going forward but he was a tank out on the field, hence the gag!

When my youngster is more established I'm contemplating using spurs on him, but purely for lateral reasons.
 
Anything can be misused, even the mildest bit for example in bad hands can still cause damage. I agree, having jump judged at many HT, I always hated the 2'/2'3" class, as that was where most abuse happened. At one event 3 mothers approached me (I was fence number 2) asking if they could 'help' their children over the fence with a lunge whip up the pony's bottom. The answer was no. These would also be the kids doing the 'pony club kick' wearing spurs matched with a strong bit. No wonder the pony didn't regard xc as fun.

A lot depends on what you are exposed to as the norm. I compete in an area where all spurs are banned, as are long whips, & in races on the final loop even short whips are banned. Many of the super fit horses wear strong bits, but 99/100 with a cavesson noseband. The horses are expected to work in self-carriage, with minimal interference from the rider. So to turn up to a ride wearing many gadgets, spurs, grakles would raise eyebrows (& stop you from being allowed to start). Different disciplines require different forms of control. I've turned up to a xc competition (went clear coming 6th), & caused major ripples in the warm up area because of the breed of horse (arab - but they don't jump, everyone knows that, why is it here....) & my coloured, synthetic bridle & breastplate which met all safety standards but omg wasn't leather and black/brown, how could you have a white bridle/ reins & a green breastplate....horrors!

If the tack is used sympathetically & for a purpose, then it should be left to the rider as they know the horse better than the spectator. Gadgets/ nosebands/spurs should not be used by inexperience people though as a shortcut instead of insufficient schooling.
 
These comments about why would you wear spurs with all that in the horse's mouth just demonstrate the ignorence of the maker. It clearly shows that they have so little understanding of equitation that they believe that kick means go and pull means stop. They obviously have no idea about refining aids or about things like using a bit to encourage flexion, or a spur for precision in lateral work.

You have to wonder what these people think when they watch GP dressage and all the horses have a "mouthful of metal" and the riders all wear spurs.
 
I'm thinking of wearing them at the mo for my rising 6yr old. I used them successfully with my current mare's dam. Both mares mother and daughter are nappy sods, bit argumentative and neither liked the whip but the mother would work beautifully when I wore spurs. If I ever forgot to put them on the b*gger knew. I used them merely as a reinforced leg aid as when you ask once and get nothing then kick a second time and still get nothing the spurs are used to gently nudge for a forward response. Both mares were in a snaffle bit without martingale so not over bitted. I have nerve damage down my left side due to spinal probs so wearing spurs is easier on me. I can't see a problem with using them as long as the rider is not a novice and they are introduced correctly to the horse.
 
OP, having seen your (gorgeous) mare in action in some of your vids, I can totally understand why you use the tack you do! ;) :D

Dressage horses are all ridden in double bridles and spurs. It's hardly unusual to see the two together is it?!:confused:

People can be funny beggars at times!
 
I would just like to point out that to control a strong horse, a strong bit is often not enough - control doesn't mean hold or pull, but to keep between hand and leg, therefore quite reasonably you might need support for your leg as well.
 
You can teach a horse to do most things you'd want it to by voice command...

I appreciate there being a difference between 'fancy lateral movement aids' and 'stopping it running out/refusing/napping' aids.

So, whilst I'm confident I don't like their use for the later I'm not even convinced they are often necessary (at amateur levels for certain) for the former.

'I wouldn't get a rosette/round the course/whatever without' is not sufficient reason for me... we don't ride because it is easy or because we don't want horses to be living animals!
 
Kat said:
It clearly shows that they have so little understanding of equitation that they believe that kick means go and pull means stop.
Click to expand...

My thoughts too. I dont ride in spurs. I would only ride in spurs should I need to make my aids clearer for lateral work, in the same manner that I use a schooling whip to refine my aids - not to punish my horse, which is the suggestion made for using spurs and gags on nappy/'tank' horses.... back to basics methinks ;)
 
arabheaven said:
My thoughts too. I dont ride in spurs. I would only ride in spurs should I need to make my aids clearer for lateral work, in the same manner that I use a schooling whip to refine my aids - not to punish my horse, which is the suggestion made for using spurs and gags on nappy/'tank' horses.... back to basics methinks ;)
Click to expand...

I'm guessing this bit in bold is a dig at my previous comment? I get what you're saying, and I agree, the horse should have been retrained/reschooled and previous to this I'd never ridden in spurs before - I was told to ride like this by my previous boss, had it been up to me I would have wanted to explore other options, but that wasn't possible.
 
I think what we use on OUR horse is up to us as an individual. Long whips, short whips, spurs or not. if i could be the best rider in the world maybe I would not need to use spurs. I am very sure that if i was to ride everyday and had loads of instruction and had a super horse ( I think he is brill by the way!!) I would not need spurs at all. I have a full time job, this time of year i am lucky to see my horse in daylight, I do not have a school, so ride only at the weekend. Spurs help me when i am schooling, they help me to "talk" to my horse clearly. They do not hurt him they just help him to understand. i also use a long schooling whip to make up for a very weak left leg. I do not HIT him, i just tap to show him what i want. In his mouth is a myler snaffle. i want my horse to be comfortable but i also want him to do his best when i ask him to work. I do not hack in spurs but would not think that anyone who did, was less of a horse person, i would assume that they have their reasons.
 
Kat said:
These comments about why would you wear spurs with all that in the horse's mouth just demonstrate the ignorence of the maker. It clearly shows that they have so little understanding of equitation that they believe that kick means go and pull means stop. They obviously have no idea about refining aids or about things like using a bit to encourage flexion, or a spur for precision in lateral work.

You have to wonder what these people think when they watch GP dressage and all the horses have a "mouthful of metal" and the riders all wear spurs.
Click to expand...

You don't need to wonder at all, certainly if HHO is anything to go by they think they are cruel and should have some riding lessons as they obviously haven't schooled the horse well enough :rolleyes:

I don't like spurs being compulsory at certain levels of competition though :) I used to wear them xc with my boy and will ride with them on the flat - normally in a lesson but don't tend to wear them otherwise :)
 
arabheaven said:
I use a schooling whip to refine my aids - not to punish my horse, which is the suggestion made for using spurs and gags on nappy/'tank' horses.... back to basics methinks ;)
Click to expand...

No it isn't. You use your schooling whip to back up your aids. Horse not listening to leg, quick tap of the stick. You are perfectly within your right to use spurs for the same reason. Some horses won't tolerate a stick being used. Some horses, like the OP's, IIRC, are just down right naughty and are big and know they can take the pee. OP is using her spurs to school the horse correctly. ie horse must listen to leg and go over the fence, out the side is no option. If it works for her and allows the horse to improve what is the problem? She could use a stick but I personally find it difficult to use my stick on the approach to a fence (lack the coordination) and would rather wear spurs if required. Equally, I'd rather ride quietly in a stronger bit than yank the teeth out in a snaffle.

Sorry to pick on you, other people have said the same, yours was just the first I came to!
 
I wouldn't wear spurs because I am a novice and wouldn't really think it a good idea to be riding a ned that required them, but as long as you're not gouging at the horse and both rider and horse are safe and comfortable, what's the problem? Prefer to see a stronger bit and spurs used correctly than a snaffle used badly...
 
Our boy, although not too speedy is extremely strong & powerful. He can however also be lazy off the leg so on advice from a very qualified & knowledgeable BS instructor, he is ridden, when jumping or xc, in a waterford gag, running martingale, flash & spurs - by an experienced 16yr old.

At home when schooling on the flat he has a jointed snaffle, no martingale & no spurs. I don't mind spurs being used by anyone as long as they have been taught how to use them. I hate to see someone just "chuck the spurs on" & kick, kick away. Same goes for whip use. Braying your horse on the neck whist pulling on both reins is not going to make it go forward.
 
I wear them when i feel i need to e.g. Hacking i wouldnt wear them, sj i wouldnt but hunting i would, only because she is a nightmare at the meet (spinning, going backwards etc) i find a nudge when reversing etc keeps her more under control but i dont tend to use them to go faster because i dont need to. I think if you understand your horse then theres no problem. My spurs are small rounded ones, i also have a cracked knee cap so my legs are not the strongest.:)
 
anna22 said:
Once you get to a certain level of eventing I think you HAVE to wear spurs whilst cross country.... I may be wrong.
Click to expand...

You do not have to wear spurs XC or SJ at any level of eventing. Here is a pic of Andrew Nicholson and Armada at Burghley 2010, quiet clearly wearing no spurs.

large.jpg


You do, however have to wear spurs above Advanced level in pure dressage and for Advanced, FEI 2*, 3* and 4* eventing in the dressage phase only.
 
As I said on that thread, if the tack/artificial aid combination works best for that rider/horse combination then I don't think it's an issue. As long as the rider isn't overusing or abusing the fact they have spurs on and knows how to use them correctly, then I don't see a problem with spurs :)
 
I use spurs when I feel the need - normally xc, or occasionally if I think it will be beneficial when schooling over jumps. I have hacked in them - I was wearing a pair for most of the "epic 7 and a half hour hack" last weekend (though not intentionally - long story) - but since I was in a dr sadde and the weren't swan necked, I couldn't apply them anyway :mad: :D

I use them for clarity when jumping (I can dictate take off spots more accurately with them - not to force him to jump when he doesn't want to :p) and I use them to re-inforce my leg. If I were schooling at the level where spurs would be useful for more advanced lateral work, I would happily use them then too.

Tinap555 said:
I hate to see someone just "chuck the spurs on" & kick, kick away. Same goes for whip use. Braying your horse on the neck whist pulling on both reins is not going to make it go forward.
Click to expand...

Ahhh, I must look mad when I use a whip out hacking - I don't hit Fergs with it so much as wave it up and down by his head :D It's simple, gets him off my leg, and involves a bare minimum of sickening violence :D
 
I don't like seeing them on little kids who kick with them to get their pony to go faster in a jump off but still have a standing martingale and gag on the bottom ring, as normally neither bit of equipment is used sympathetically. Neither are they used properly by someone I know who told me she uses them because 'it didn't understand leg aids' so spurs were the obvious way to teach it :confused:.

I don't mind a rider who knows what they are doing with them using them as a training tool. Having a horse who I can't use a stick on the way to a fence with then spurs are a very useful tool, they are not a punishment but encouragement to keep going forwards. I would much rather use a pair of spurs and know I'm going to be safer xc than not and potentially have an accident with a solid fence and end up with me or the pony injured and his confidence lost. In a rider with a secure position they can be used only when needed it's only when the riders not secure that it causes problems.

It's very easy to judge on first impressions but they may only be a temporary stage in the horses training, as may the bit, but people seem to forget that you can change tack as the horse becomes better schooled and more sure of it's job and if that involves the correct use of spurs then so be it.
 
JFTD - my sprog looks a prat with her whip too - well I'm saying whip - most of the times its invisible but if she takes her hand off his reins & pretends she's going to give him a crack , off he goes lol :D
 
I never used to ride in spurs with my mare because she was quite forward going but I started too because she doesn't really listen to the leg and tends to run off. Since I have been using spurs she listens a lot more, is straighter and collects easier.

But I hate to see a horse with spur marks! If you give your horse spur marks you shouldn't be using them and you need to sort out your leg position first!
 
dafthoss said:
I don't like seeing them on little kids who kick with them to get their pony to go faster in a jump off but still have a standing martingale and gag on the bottom ring, as normally neither bit of equipment is used sympathetically.
Click to expand...

And there's another misunderstood bit of tack, the standing martingale.

Surely a standing martingale is far kinder with a dutch gag than a running martingale.

In fact if the horse chucks its head up I would say a standing martingale is kinder anyway as it acts on the nose rather than the more sensitive mouth. Obviously sometimes you need a running martingale I'm not saying they shouldn't be used, but often a standing martingale would be kinder to the horse and give a better result.

I don't understand why people on here think that a standing martingale is up there on the list of evil tack :confused:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top