Connemara ponies - grading and showing

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PonyIAmNotFood

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We are going looking at registered connies next week. This is for my friends daughter as a show horse. She currently shows local level but has high aspirations so we want to make sure the pony is eligible to go higher just in case.

I have been studying breed standards and looking at winners, I have a good idea of what we're looking for.

It's the grading that stumps me. I understand the criteria for each grade - so if the pony is class 3 but has 2 class 1 parents, he can be eligible to be put forward for class 1 grading (provided no odd colour - is dun considered eligible for class 1? And provided not over height - we're looking at 14hh-14.2hh). Is that right?

Also need to check at what level you can show a class 3. And would this restrict say county or affiliated showing? If it does restrict, would you still be able to put a class 3 in for affiliated workers and the like as opposed to m&m classes?

The kid the pony is for will want to do m&m classes.

Sorry for the ramble, I can't get my head round it all. Also, any reviews or experiences of connemara's Wales would be appreciated!
 
Have a look on CPBS (connemar pony breeders socy)website, itts all explained on there. You can search for pedigree, grading etc of any particular pony. Dun is fine to be class 1, blue-eyed creams can only be class 4. There is also the UK society- BCPS (British connemara pony socy) I think,
 
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Only breeding stock has to be graded, but if you are going to show it may or may not help decide if its a show winner.
Obviously an animal that is graded grade 1, should conform to all the breed standards, it will have been assessed by a vet for any hereditary diseases, or unsoundness, but this is not a vetting as in buying a horse. There are some good ponies that are graded below 1, just because of their colour which is bonkers.
If its a ridden animal, its like any pony, it may look lovely but ride like a plank and be an absolute a*se. It all depends on the rider ability but I would never buy a pony just on its looks or whether its going to win showing.
As someone else has said look on the BCPS web site, if she is really trying to go for HOYS, RI etc ,I would have it measures as well as it could have been graded at 3 as under 148cms and grown a couple of cms. There are a lot of big ones about.
 
Thank you, I've asked for more info from the seller and the ponies are ungraded but they are registered with CPBS and their parentage is known. There is one in particular that I like, she looks well put together as well as sane and nice. If whether they're graded or not won't matter in the show ring, that's great. All ponies will be well tried and not just bought on merit of their looks :) the kid has to be able to school them herself and they will be expected to do 'normal' things as well as be a show pony.
 
Honeypot, the reason behind blue eyed creams not being graded 1 isnt 'bonkers' as you put it. A blue-eyed cream, if mated to another dilute colour, especially another of the same colour, can produce a 'double dilute' which can be carry a lot of faults, just like breeding merle to merle in collies, or frame paint to frame paint in pintos (in America). There is a gene called the 'lethal white gene' and this can cause congenital problems.
Blue-eyed creams couldnt be registered at all a few years ago.
 
I never heard of any health problems with double dilutes in horses based on studies. Lethal white syndrome, tends to be a disease of paint horses as the carry the overo gene.There are a few well known double dilute stallions which carry the dilute gene which dilute coat colour and is present in many breeds. Now hoof wall separation disease in Connemara's is a problem and breeding stock should be tested for it.
 
Will you be looking at geldings? If so, if they're in the uk, and have both class 1 parents they are automatically a class 1 - as long as they're 148cm or under.
 
I have just been through the breeding for the ponies we are viewing, 3 of 5 have two class 1 parents (including the mare that is my fave so far). Two have one class 1 parent and one class 3 parent. So all the ponies are currently uninspected class 3 connies, but from my understanding, the 3 with two class 1 parents would be eligible for grading and possibly elevating to class 1? But we would only need to do that if they were going to be bred, and showing to any level should be fine with a height cert and uninspected class 3 grading? All ponies are grey, dun or dark bay.

Sorry for all the questions, I can't wrap my head around it all. Friend can't either lol. We just want the kid to have a pony that she can keep for years and not be restricted on what she can enter with said pony.
 
Is your friend's budget big enough to acquire a pony which already has a few decent ridden results under it's belt? If this is her first venture into County Level/Qualifiers this is what I would strongly reccomend.
 
Cross posted Tiarella - 2 of the ones with two class 1 graded and inspected parents are geldings but I don't like them as much as the mare with two class 1 graded parents. When I search the geldings on CPBS website, they all come up as class 3 uninspected. I don't do showing and this is why haha.
 
minesadouble said:
Is your friend's budget big enough to acquire a pony which already has a few decent ridden results under it's belt? If this is her first venture into County Level/Qualifiers this is what I would strongly reccomend.
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I don't believe so. They have another daughter who has recently been bought a new horse so they are tied to a similar budget in the interests of fairness. It's hard. Hence she will likely get a well put together project (she is more than capable of producing one to the standard). It's more just making sure she gets one that is eligible for anything she wants. She may decide she doesn't want to show after all this, and pony could end up jumping or something instead, but we are just trying to keep her options open as her current pony has restricted her something awful with what she can do with him.
 
honetpot said:
I never heard of any health problems with double dilutes in horses based on studies. Lethal white syndrome, tends to be a disease of paint horses as the carry the overo gene.There are a few well known double dilute stallions which carry the dilute gene which dilute coat colour and is present in many breeds. Now hoof wall separation disease in Connemara's is a problem and breeding stock should be tested for it.
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Exactly! Dont be ridiculous! A double dilute is a cremello or perlino. Neither of those are lethal whites. Thats to do with the overo gene which is not found in connies in any shape or form! You cannot bred single dilutes, aka buckskin or palomino without a chance of breeding a double dilute. Which makes it even more ridiculous! You can have two class one connies and breed a double dilute

http://www.animalgenetics.us/Equine/Coat_Color/Frame_Overo_(LWO).asp
 
PonyIAmNotFood said:
Cross posted Tiarella - 2 of the ones with two class 1 graded and inspected parents are geldings but I don't like them as much as the mare with two class 1 graded parents. When I search the geldings on CPBS website, they all come up as class 3 uninspected. I don't do showing and this is why haha.
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I was totally confused when I bought my Connemara gelding in November. Basically my 4 year old came over from Ireland on a cpbs passport, he was a class 3 gelding with no inspection, but had 2 class 1 parents. I registered him with bcps and because he was 14.2 and had 2 class 1 parents, he automatically became a class 1 which means I can show at any level. It's all on the bcps website :)
If I typed his name in on the cpbs database he would still be a class 3, but now I've registered him with bcps he is automatically a class 1.

Not sure on mares though....
 
Tiarella said:
I was totally confused when I bought my Connemara gelding in November. Basically my 4 year old came over from Ireland on a cpbs passport, he was a class 3 gelding with no inspection, but had 2 class 1 parents. I registered him with bcps and because he was 14.2 and had 2 class 1 parents, he automatically became a class 1 which means I can show at any level. It's all on the bcps website :)
If I typed his name in on the cpbs database he would still be a class 3, but now I've registered him with bcps he is automatically a class 1.

Not sure on mares though....
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That is very very good to know! Thank you!
 
Good quality Connies command good prices, we have a yard of them owned by YO, incl a stallion that has been Breed Show supreme champ twice and been to HOYS 3 times. Beautiful ponies!
 
Crackerz said:
Good quality Connies command good prices, we have a yard of them owned by YO, incl a stallion that has been Breed Show supreme champ twice and been to HOYS 3 times. Beautiful ponies!
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We've quickly realised the price part lol, but kid is set on a connie. Trying to find some 'diamond in the rough' types for her to have a go with. The showing ambitions may or may not die off, but I'm certainly not going to tell the kid that she doesn't have a hope in hell because shes been bought one on a budget (mainly because that may not be true, hard work can get you places) - working within current options and budget, we're planning on getting the best we can, and kid will make the best she can of the pony :) I bet it's some of your yard owners horses that I've been browsing and lusting over then, the top class connies really are lovely.
 
She should be able to enter M&M, working hunter and connemara classes with no problem what ever grade the pony is, as long as its registered.
Clifden Connemara sales are on this month.
 
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Not sure how it works now but I had to get my mare graded to get her full registration and adult passport she is 10 now and had to be dna tested and graded to get her full green passport so only graded horses could be shown in registered classes. all the rest were still on simple registration passports and so not eligible for the reigstered classes. She is grade one the whole process was complicated and expensive to get right
 
its different now. you used to get foal papers then got passport on grading. But now that by law all horses over 6 months have to have passports you get the passport when you register the foal- 6 months or 1 Qctober of the year its born, whichever is earliest...
 
be interesting to know when it changed and if the change in law affected horses born before it was introduced as it would make a difference to older ponies eligibility to be shown The date seems to be 2012 so lots of older ponies must have had their passports upgraded
 
Why does she want a Connie so much? If you have a limited budget and not much experience of the breed so you won't necessarily know if you are getting a good one or not you may be taking a bit of risk and you may not end up getting a top quality pony that will do well at county/national level.

They are super ponies but with a price tag to match especially the top quality ones and there will be professionals or those with a lot of experience with the breed looking for a bargain too.

New forests are a similar build to Connemaras and have the ability to do the WHP classes and they now have their own HOYS section. They are also about half the price. You would also be supporting a minority breed. Maybe something to think about if you want a top quality pony but don't have a big budget as you are not paying a premium for having a fashionable breed so you may get more for your money.

PonyIAmNotFood said:
We've quickly realised the price part lol, but kid is set on a connie. Trying to find some 'diamond in the rough' types for her to have a go with. The showing ambitions may or may not die off, but I'm certainly not going to tell the kid that she doesn't have a hope in hell because shes been bought one on a budget (mainly because that may not be true, hard work can get you places) - working within current options and budget, we're planning on getting the best we can, and kid will make the best she can of the pony :) I bet it's some of your yard owners horses that I've been browsing and lusting over then, the top class connies really are lovely.
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I would definately look at getting one from Ireland, Clifden sales,one of the good breeders with a prefix, or even checkk out Donedeal.ie, some good ponies on there, and some previews of the some of the ones going to Clifden as well.
I believe IrishGal on here will probably be able to help you.
 
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