Desperate situation, ideas needed, please!

maxine1985

maxine1985

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This may be long (sorry) but need suggestions/ideas anything….
Have a 4yr old ex-racer, finished racing in July this year, got her home took her shoes off and turned her away in the field with my other 4yr old with the plan to bring her into work after xmas and event next season
3 months in, all going well, sound barefoot, looking good weight wise and generally a very chilled happy mare!
Then 4 weeks ago (Sunday afternoon), found a small cut on back of knee, didn’t look too bad but called vet to be on safe side!

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Was quite abit deeper than first thought, had punctured tendon sheath, no idea how she did it, have walked the field hundreds of times but no sharp pointed objects!
So box rest commenced, initially everything seemed fine, big leg cast to minimise movement and lots of antibiotics, she seemed very settled, big American barn stables with horses next to her and opposite all the time! Vet coming daily to change dressings

3 days later displaying colic signs, so vet called (already been that day to change dressing!) and large solid impaction in intestine, 6 days starvation and 22 –yes 22!! vets visits of tubing fluids every 4 hours, including being hooked up to an IV drip the impaction eventually softens and is passed, one extremely thin and depressed mare finally allowed to eat!! Wound on leg isn’t healing as quick as hoped, still needing proud flesh cut off each visit. Unfortunately mare is now very unhappy and not settled one bit, she regularly stands on hind legs is bucking and kicking out at walls of stables, numerous cuts to face and legs as she is literally throwing herself around, is extremely dangerous!! Now cannot change dressing without vet sedating, cannot bring out of stable without sedation.
Fast forward to this weekend (Saturday) 4 weeks after initial injury, vets come to look at cut with the hope of getting her out as it has healed enough and have tried every calmer and sedative (acp, sedalin etc) and cannot stop her literally throwing herself around and kicking walls, tried different horsey neighbours, different stables, radio, stable mirrors, treats hidden in stable etc etc but nothing is helping for more than a few hours! So went to get out of box and she is hopping lame (completely non weight bearing) behind  Vet and farrier dug a huge hole & eventually found a tiny abscess, poulticed and everyone agreed for her safety we need her out, so turned her out small paddock! Very happy horse, just eating grass very chilled!!

However vet came again yesterday and him and farrier strongly suspect she’s fractured her pedal bone, she’s still too lame after poulticing and strong pain killers so x- raying tonight, other possibility is infection in bone (praying it’s not !)

If she’s fractured her pedal bone she can’t stay out, it will never heal being walked on, she won’t stay in tiny stable sized electrified pen in field (she jumps out) and making it really high she kicks out and likely to get tangled up in it! And this was caused by her being in so can’t have her in the stable, she’s just dangerous and will genuinely end up killing herself, vets agree and them and I have never seen anything like it, she throws herself around with no preservation.

Vets, farrier, yard owner, myself really have no idea what to do with her, she is an emaciated wreck at the moment, and mentally cannot cope with anything other than in the field with her friend

Vet believes we are x-raying to confirm fracture, pretty convinced that’s what she’s done constantly kicking walls, so what can I do….. any ideas??

Had thought of round pen type thing in field but think she will kick out at it and charge round and round!!

Thank you in advance!!
 
This may be not want you want to hear. But if no small area (grass paddock or sand paddock) can be found I would PTS. I have always said I would put mine down if she required box rest (she is a real outdoor type and can't even deal with one day in!) it sounds like you really care for your Horse and whatever you choose I am sure its right for her :)
 
Just a musing here, but.......

If she's happy and calm out that's were I'd leave her (broken pedal bone or not). Sure, I'd go with a smaller area, so paddock rather than field, with a calm and kindly field mate. But, I wouldn't put her on further box rest.

It's a gamble, but either way you're looking at loosing her - and for her sanity, and everyone's safety, this would seem to be the best option.
 
Oh I'm so sorry, I really feel for you, all that from a little cut...I have no advise as have never been in the situation but didn't want to read and run. If it were me I would have a serious think about PTS if she is that unhappy but hopefully someone will come up with a good idea to help you out.
 
BentleyBelly said:
If it were me I would have a serious think about PTS if she is that unhappy but hopefully someone will come up with a good idea to help you out.
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The horse is not unhappy, though - and there may well be a good prognosis if the horse can be kept calm (and slightly uncomfortable) whilst out.....
 
Could you find somewhere with some kind of barn area she could share with a companion, large enough for two, but small enough she wouldnt be moving around on it too much, a bit like a crew yard?

Really feel for you OP, you've been through a lot, cant imagine how it all feels. I'll be keeping everything crossed for you!
 
I bet you are exhausted, let alone the horse.

Fingers crossed it is not a fracture. Agree with Amy May I would try the smallest enclosure you can manage with her friend. If she has a bone infection then it is very very painful (have had one myself) and takes a lot of anti biotics to clear it up.

She must have lived in when she was in training but I guess all the box rest has blown her mind. A friend of mine had a TB that would go crazy in the box for no particular reason, just erupt with no self preservation. I was in there with her once :o
 
I would also leave her out in the smallest practical area

I cant see her tolerating any more box rest so you'd possibly end up losing her if you didnt take a punt on leaving her out
 
What an awful awful situation. I hope someone comes along with an idea for you I really do. If it was one of mine as heartbreaking as it would be I think I would consider pts. Sending you lots of vibes and hope you get an answer
 
LaurenBay said:
This may be not want you want to hear. But if no small area (grass paddock or sand paddock) can be found I would PTS. I have always said I would put mine down if she required box rest (she is a real outdoor type and can't even deal with one day in!) it sounds like you really care for your Horse and whatever you choose I am sure its right for her :)
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Thank you, this is what i've began considering, need to do whats best for her!

littlelegs said:
Can you do a high solid mesh fence round a stable sized paddock?
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Had considered this but think she'll kick out at it, causing further damage :-(

amymay said:
Just a musing here, but.......

If she's happy and calm out that's were I'd leave her (broken pedal bone or not). Sure, I'd go with a smaller area, so paddock rather than field, with a calm and kindly field mate. But, I wouldn't put her on further box rest.

It's a gamble, but either way you're looking at loosing her - and for her sanity, and everyone's safety, this would seem to be the best option.
Click to expand...

Thank you, am considering this but need to get the pain managed better if i was to leave her out, shes back on 3 legs after 8 hours or so of pain relief being injected, bute doesnt seem to be touching it! Not looking good for her I know, but i dont know if there is anything else i can do for her now!
 
I'd agree with amymay, leave her out in as small a paddock as you can without her going ballistic. If the ACP or sedalin had any effect then I'd keep her on that as well to minimise her bouncing about. You could try putting her out in a larger area until she settles again and then reducing it down and making sure her hay and water are close to each other to minimise the need to move about.
 
I agree with amymay here (shock for me!) if being out keeps her sensible then do that, small paddocks and move them often - keep her in with a friend to keep her happy and if you need to get hold of some round pen type fencing (or heras fencing) that she cannot get out of - mine is a pain for jumping the electric too!

Box rest is not the solution for lots of horses, and as you've already found more often than not can cause more problems than it set out to solve!

Fingers crossed its not broken, but if it is - I'd at least give restricted constant turnout a try :)
 
Poor horse and poor you.

Perhaps the initial behind-knee injury was caused by her over-reaching into back of her knee with a hind hoof toe?

I would want to know more info from the vet and so I would ask these questions:

1. Is boxrest essential for tendon sheath injury? If so, how many months? What other specialist treatment will be needed (nursing care should not be under-estimated in terms of stress, time and cost to owner, esp over several months).

2. What is likelihood of tendon sheath injury healing 100pc so that horse can do full work? Is it likely to be liable to further infection? Is it likely horse won't be fully fit?

3. Is pedal bone fracture repairable? Is boxrest essential? If so, how many months? What other specialist treatment will be needed in terms of nursing care, etc.

4. What is likelihood of pedal bone injury healing 100pc so that horse can do full work? Is it likely to be liable to fracture again? Is it likely horse won't be fully fit?

Once I've got the answers to those questions, then I might know in my mind whether it's going to be worth trying to work out a way forwards with a mare that hates boxrest in a barn-stable or not.

Where possible, I would always want turnout/turn away rather than boxrest too.

Gentle hugs to you.
 
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I made the decision to keep Dorey out in a stable sized pen.

Twice she was either broken out of it or escaped and galloped round. It's hearbreaking to see them stuck in a small pen like that. We had our electric generators stolen so she ended up on box rest until I bought a new one (sick freaks, hope you rot in hell for stealing the generator off an injured horse!) and she couldn't go out when it was too wet, too cold or generally slippy because of her tendency to attempt sharp corners in the pen.

After nearly 8 months like this she failed to improve at all and died in her stable overnight.

I honestly wish I'd never bothered. It's hard because we didn't have a bad prognosis until it didn't get better but my poor girly spent her last 8 months stuck in a pen. It was no life for a horse.

I'd just leave her out. If, after time, it's showing no improvement, then you can let her go knowing she's been a horse again.
 
obviously the starvation was necessary to clear the impaction on vet's advice, but do you think she could now have developed ulcers as a result? Just wondering if that is why she went from quite settled to freaking out. Recent studies show that a very short period of stress can cause ulcers, and the combination of being stabled when she isn't usually and all the veterinary treatment she's had to have then the colic treatment could have caused them. Might be worth talking to the vet about it as a possibility?

Other than that I think I agree with the others, if she cannot settle in a box she'll do herself less damage turned out with a quiet companion in a very small area. Perhaps the vet could give her some sedalin for a few weeks and turn her out in as small an area as possible with company and ad lib hay? With a suitably quiet companion you could possibly keep her happy in a really tiny fenced off area if they've got plenty of hay to munch.
 
amymay said:
The horse is not unhappy, though - and there may well be a good prognosis if the horse can be kept calm (and slightly uncomfortable) whilst out.....
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Exactly this, shes so happy out, even though shes hopping around abit!

Hedwards said:
Could you find somewhere with some kind of barn area she could share with a companion, large enough for two, but small enough she wouldnt be moving around on it too much, a bit like a crew yard?

Really feel for you OP, you've been through a lot, cant imagine how it all feels. I'll be keeping everything crossed for you!
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This may work if i can find somewhere, although its the solid walls im worried about!

RebelRebel said:
I bet you are exhausted, let alone the horse.

Fingers crossed it is not a fracture. Agree with Amy May I would try the smallest enclosure you can manage with her friend. If she has a bone infection then it is very very painful (have had one myself) and takes a lot of anti biotics to clear it up.

She must have lived in when she was in training but I guess all the box rest has blown her mind. A friend of mine had a TB that would go crazy in the box for no particular reason, just erupt with no self preservation. I was in there with her once :o
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Yep, she was fine to begin with, her one saving grace is she hasnt gone needle shy yet!

WelshD said:
I would also leave her out in the smallest practical area

I cant see her tolerating any more box rest so you'd possibly end up losing her if you didnt take a punt on leaving her out
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What im thinking too!
 
If she's on three legs I wouldn't actually worry about her being out. She's not putting down the damaged foot thus giving it a chance to heal and she should be a bit quieter. If a full dose of bute gets her walking on it I'd be inclined to give her a partial dose to keep the worst of the pain at bay but not enough to get her walking on it. I'm not saying do this for any length of time but if it is an abscess causing so much pain then it will should go relatively quickly.
 
Not sure where you are in Bucks but a yard my daughter visits re-train ex racers over the winter (do Polox in the summer). They have an open barn sectioned off so their Tbs are together but individually stalled.
They are in Long Crendon.
 
My boy fractured his pedal bone in hind foot many years ago and he didnt have complete box rest. I have two stables with a small concrete yard in front and he was allowed to walk round the yard with stable door open . I kept him like this for 6 months and gave him lots of toys to play with and haynets all around the yard. He then had 2 months turned away in a flat field to be a horse before i got back on him. He has been absolutely fine since.
If it happened again to one of mine i would definitely turn them out in a very small paddock, obviously depending on severity of fracture but my boys heeled even though he was walking on it constantly.
Good luck with whatever you decide
 
amymay said:
Just a musing here, but.......

If she's happy and calm out that's were I'd leave her (broken pedal bone or not). Sure, I'd go with a smaller area, so paddock rather than field, with a calm and kindly field mate. But, I wouldn't put her on further box rest.

It's a gamble, but either way you're looking at loosing her - and for her sanity, and everyone's safety, this would seem to be the best option.
Click to expand...

I agree with this. I've had two TBs with pedal bone fractures. Luckily both coped well with box rest. One was only 8 weeks, but the other required 6 months! Your mare is highly likely to kick the walls and do it again. I would put her in as small a paddock as possible, and without much, if any bute (so that she looks after herself more) and use sedalin to take the edge off her. Pedal bones effectively have their own 'plaster cast' and so long as the horse does not hoon about, I see no reason why it cannot heal (eventually) in a small paddock.
 
Suechoccy said:
Poor horse and poor you.

Perhaps the initial behind-knee injury was caused by her over-reaching into back of her knee with a hind hoof toe?

I would want to know more info from the vet and so I would ask these questions:

1. Is boxrest essential for tendon sheath injury? If so, how many months? What other specialist treatment will be needed (nursing care should not be under-estimated in terms of stress, time and cost to owner, esp over several months).

2. What is likelihood of tendon sheath injury healing 100pc so that horse can do full work? Is it likely to be liable to further infection? Is it likely horse won't be fully fit?

3. Is pedal bone fracture repairable? Is boxrest essential? If so, how many months? What other specialist treatment will be needed in terms of nursing care, etc.

4. What is likelihood of pedal bone injury healing 100pc so that horse can do full work? Is it likely to be liable to fracture again? Is it likely horse won't be fully fit?

Once I've got the answers to those questions, then I might know in my mind whether it's going to be worth trying to work out a way forwards with a mare that hates boxrest in a barn-stable or not.

Gentle hugs to you.
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Thank you, I know a few of the answers but more questions for the vet i think, pretty certain it wasnt a high over reach as there is a 2cm wide hole about 3 cm deep, vet almost certain couldnt have been caused by a hoof! Never estimated the damage a few weeks box rest for a minor cut would cause! Although not essential box rest seemed best option to ensure cut healed and didnt get infected! Pedal bone fractures have a very good prognosis if managed well with box rest usually a few months a least-my main problem!

Serenity087 said:
I made the decision to keep Dorey out in a stable sized pen.

Twice she was either broken out of it or escaped and galloped round. It's hearbreaking to see them stuck in a small pen like that. We had our electric generators stolen so she ended up on box rest until I bought a new one (sick freaks, hope you rot in hell for stealing the generator off an injured horse!) and she couldn't go out when it was too wet, too cold or generally slippy because of her tendency to attempt sharp corners in the pen.

After nearly 8 months like this she failed to improve at all and died in her stable overnight.

I honestly wish I'd never bothered. It's hard because we didn't have a bad prognosis until it didn't get better but my poor girly spent her last 8 months stuck in a pen. It was no life for a horse.

I'd just leave her out. If, after time, it's showing no improvement, then you can let her go knowing she's been a horse again.
Click to expand...
So sorry to hear that, i dont want to end up in similar situation, shes been through so much recently!

ghostie said:
obviously the starvation was necessary to clear the impaction on vet's advice, but do you think she could now have developed ulcers as a result? Just wondering if that is why she went from quite settled to freaking out. Recent studies show that a very short period of stress can cause ulcers, and the combination of being stabled when she isn't usually and all the veterinary treatment she's had to have then the colic treatment could have caused them. Might be worth talking to the vet about it as a possibility?

Other than that I think I agree with the others, if she cannot settle in a box she'll do herself less damage turned out with a quiet companion in a very small area. Perhaps the vet could give her some sedalin for a few weeks and turn her out in as small an area as possible with company and ad lib hay? With a suitably quiet companion you could possibly keep her happy in a really tiny fenced off area if they've got plenty of hay to munch.
Click to expand...

Almost certain shes probably got ulcers, was going to give her a few weeks in field not being mucked about with then scope her but now shes lame behind! Small area might be only option

Thank you everyone whos responded, very grateful!!
 
If you manage to find a barn to share, you could try padding the walls. Something like those mats used at the base of bouncy castles, school gyms etc. The thick ones with tough covers, not cheap yoga ones.
If you are on your own land, would it be possible to get a bigger field shelter & convert it into a barn yourself? However I realise even if you find one second hand & sell it after it would be a very costly option, so apologies if its not practical.
 
stilton said:
My boy fractured his pedal bone in hind foot many years ago and he didnt have complete box rest. I have two stables with a small concrete yard in front and he was allowed to walk round the yard with stable door open . I kept him like this for 6 months and gave him lots of toys to play with and haynets all around the yard. He then had 2 months turned away in a flat field to be a horse before i got back on him. He has been absolutely fine since.
If it happened again to one of mine i would definitely turn them out in a very small paddock, obviously depending on severity of fracture but my boys heeled even though he was walking on it constantly.
Good luck with whatever you decide
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Wagtail said:
I agree with this. I've had two TBs with pedal bone fractures. Luckily both coped well with box rest. One was only 8 weeks, but the other required 6 months! Your mare is highly likely to kick the walls and do it again. I would put her in as small a paddock as possible, and without much, if any bute (so that she looks after herself more) and use sedalin to take the edge off her. Pedal bones effectively have their own 'plaster cast' and so long as the horse does not hoon about, I see no reason why it cannot heal (eventually) in a small paddock.
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Thank you, both sound very positive it may heal with time without box rest :-)
 
Wagtail said:
I agree with this. I've had two TBs with pedal bone fractures. Luckily both coped well with box rest. One was only 8 weeks, but the other required 6 months! Your mare is highly likely to kick the walls and do it again. I would put her in as small a paddock as possible, and without much, if any bute (so that she looks after herself more) and use sedalin to take the edge off her. Pedal bones effectively have their own 'plaster cast' and so long as the horse does not hoon about, I see no reason why it cannot heal (eventually) in a small paddock.
Click to expand...

I was always told this - the foot is the 'cast' so as said there's not a lot more damage can be done if you just put her in a smaller paddock. If she's in some pain then she's not likely to want to hoon about anyway but it seems she will be happier outside than in. It's a shame she had to be in in the fist place to be honest - I'd have been inclined to have put her on restricted turn out in the first place.

The only problem you coudl get if she's non-weight bearing is that she could ge abscesses in other feet (this happened with our old TB). The thing is, our TB was absolutely hopping lame for quite a while (we had to separate him as the others then decided to attack him!). he only had an abscess but it took vets and farrier visits to finally get tio the source and then he got one in his other foot so cue us hot tubbing and poulticing both feet!!

We did have some Boa hoof boots for him though - would it be worth getting yours some of these? This will help her a little bit as takes some of the pressure off and I would think would help either if a fracture or just a pesky abscess?
 
littlelegs said:
If you manage to find a barn to share, you could try padding the walls. Something like those mats used at the base of bouncy castles, school gyms etc. The thick ones with tough covers, not cheap yoga ones.
If you are on your own land, would it be possible to get a bigger field shelter & convert it into a barn yourself? However I realise even if you find one second hand & sell it after it would be a very costly option, so apologies if its not practical.
Click to expand...

Her stable was rubber matted on floor and walls, she still managed to injure herself, have got a 24ftx12ft field shelter in field but not big enough to shut 2 in, and she'd jump out if in on her own, only stopped her jumping out of stable by putting weaving grill up! Could possibly fence an area around this though!

ladyt25 said:
I was always told this - the foot is the 'cast' so as said there's not a lot more damage can be done if you just put her in a smaller paddock. If she's in some pain then she's not likely to want to hoon about anyway but it seems she will be happier outside than in. It's a shame she had to be in in the fist place to be honest - I'd have been inclined to have put her on restricted turn out in the first place.

The only problem you coudl get if she's non-weight bearing is that she could ge abscesses in other feet (this happened with our old TB). The thing is, our TB was absolutely hopping lame for quite a while (we had to separate him as the others then decided to attack him!). he only had an abscess but it took vets and farrier visits to finally get tio the source and then he got one in his other foot so cue us hot tubbing and poulticing both feet!!

We did have some Boa hoof boots for him though - would it be worth getting yours some of these? This will help her a little bit as takes some of the pressure off and I would think would help either if a fracture or just a pesky abscess?
Click to expand...

In hindsight, wish i'd never box rested, but having been so recent out of racing we thought she'd be fine and she was initally, all started after the colic and just got worse and worse! She's got a poultice boot on and hoof boots all round, her feet arent doing great now having been in so long and kicking everything!
 
I agree with the thought that any more box rest is just not going to work so I would be doing smallest paddock you can get way with with mega electric fences to inside of an outer fence and giving her a chance .
Barning her somewhere with a companion might also work if possible .
 
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