Difficulty Mounting

Kittyheaths

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Now you have probably heard this 1000's of times but I am having difficulty mounting now Im an experienced Im an AI coach or whatever they call it these days, so I bought an ISH last year and it was obvious that this boy have been abused you could not even groom him without him flipping out so fast forward a year and a hell of alot of patience and love and we are there he trusts he is being ridden and once mounted besides being abit on edge and spooky type he is fine but somebody has to hold him on the ground for mounting now ,but if you try and do it on your own (so much fun lol) I have tried everything he has had chiros dentist tack i fine etc... endless practice at the mounting block the problem is not when you put your foot in the stirrup to mount it is the second you pick up the reins now I mean just by the buckle the second you touch them he tenses and either backs up or shuffles away from the block we have changed to bitless and have the exact same reaction does anybody have dealings with this? because Im up against a wall with it things I would try with other horses you can not do with him raising of voice etc.. will just make things worse for him he will shakethank you
 
He's remembering pain somewhere along the line. Yes I know you have checked, quite rightly, every possible pain issue there is, but he is remembering something negative/painful about being ridden.

I bought a mare last autumn, couldn't get her anywhere near the mounting block, so checked for pain issue, got physio out, etc, and rested her.

Hope you can sort this.
 
My ISH was the same when he arrived, we took it slowly and found the biggest help was to practise mounting after he had been exercised when he was more relaxed, a helper held the reins and rider used a neckstrap until he was less reactive, he also walked off before you could actually sit down but luckily did nothing major, again little by little he was restricted and stopped until he was waiting, it did take a long while to be well established but he has become a civilised horse.
 
Can you mount without touching the reins?
you can but not on your own because he will run off even holding the neck strap only he does the same its very sad and not knowing his full history I will never know what happened to this big beautiful chap, but I know we will get there Im just out of ideas :)
 
He's remembering pain somewhere along the line. Yes I know you have checked, quite rightly, every possible pain issue there is, but he is remembering something negative/painful about being ridden.

I bought a mare last autumn, couldn't get her anywhere near the mounting block, so checked for pain issue, got physio out, etc, and rested her.

Hope you can sort this.
we did the same he rested for a few months just to be a horse with other horses then did months and months of groundwork very slowly not forced we worked at his pace and he has come on leaps and bounds and when it is all too much for him he drops his head down on my chest and we leave it there always giving him time inbetween. Have you started work with you mare again yet ? :)
 
Now you have probably heard this 1000's of times but I am having difficulty mounting now Im an experienced Im an AI coach or whatever they call it these days, so I bought an ISH last year and it was obvious that this boy have been abused you could not even groom him without him flipping out so fast forward a year and a hell of alot of patience and love and we are there he trusts he is being ridden and once mounted besides being abit on edge and spooky type he is fine but somebody has to hold him on the ground for mounting now ,but if you try and do it on your own (so much fun lol) I have tried everything he has had chiros dentist tack i fine etc... endless practice at the mounting block the problem is not when you put your foot in the stirrup to mount it is the second you pick up the reins now I mean just by the buckle the second you touch them he tenses and either backs up or shuffles away from the block we have changed to bitless and have the exact same reaction does anybody have dealings with this? because Im up against a wall with it things I would try with other horses you can not do with him raising of voice etc.. will just make things worse for him he will shakethank you
Can you not reward him for standing still with a herbal treat, and then pick up the reins and reward again if he stands still even for a split second. He will soon get the idea. Eventually you can replace the treat with a scratch or similar. Mine's the same - but its with the stirrup - as soon as I put my foot anywhere near the stirrup she's off, but if I reward her with a treat for standing still she will be inclined to stand still next time. I just have to repeat a few times and she soon grasps the idea. It is very bad manners to not stand still but I'm a bit naughty in that regard and most of the time let her get away with it as I don't personally see it as much of a problem, I'm used to it now and always manage to get on board in time!
 
Can you not reward him for standing still with a herbal treat, and then pick up the reins and reward if he stands still even for a second. Mine's the same - but its with the stirrup - as soon as I put my foot anywhere near the stirrup she's off, but if I reward her with a treat for standing still she will be inclined to stand still next time. I just have to repeat a few times and she soon grasps the idea. It is very bad manners to not stand still but I'm a bit naughty really and let her get away with it as I don't personally see it as much of a problem, I'm used to it now and always manage to get on in time!
I suppose we could try and treat him but when I did this with groundwork he was way more interested in my pocket and we ended up not getting anything done lol. I would not say it is bad manners from him something has happened to him what I will never know, my mare however should know better and quite often she will walk as soon as I am halfway over but she doesnt run off and she is now 25 so whatever with her :)
 
I would practice lengthening and shortening the reins from the floor to start with.

I dislike mounting issues as I have a bad hip/back and need them to be good - so I put loads of effort into getting them bulletproof.

When I was still hiring myself out for teaching/sorting tricky horses I did help a lot of people/horses with this. It can take a while, or sometimes it can be done in 1 session...

I start with faffing on the ground with as above, I also like them to be good a long reining so I can make sure they understand rein pressure. ave them learn to stand wherever, including near the mounting block.

I will cut loads of stages out, but have previously given a huuuuge answer on here, ut basically I think of all the skills they need and then get them confident with each skill. Such as lengthening and shortening the reins on the ground, making sure they understand rein pressure and how to have it yeild from the ground and also long reining. Then feeling comfy with the mounting block, and I won't go further than that until they will park themselves at the block and accept fuss and pats, slaps, knees, booftering with a foot..

All of which I do a stage at a time, with them knowing that if they stand well they will be walked away. I do it in such small increments that I don't usually get any reaction. I also teach them to be repositioned, reversed, represented etc while I am still on the mounting block. I jump up and down on the block. Pick up the reins and re position with them.

Through all of that I won't so much have put a foot in the stirrup, much less mounted.

If you are getting a reaction then you did too much too soon and did not give a break soon enough.

Before I put a foot in the stirrup I also like them to be OK with the mounting block falling. I use a sealed barrel, so it is kicked away from them, we chase it, it goes under them....

I then make sure they are confident with weight in the stirrup and know how to rebalance by bracing against the pull of the stirrup by pulling on it. The finally a foot in, out, scratch and walk off. In fact, we spend longer chilling and walking round as we do at the bloc, but I always give them a break before they need a break. A bit more each time so they realise that if they can just stand a second longer they will get a break.

I will lean over, pat the other side, play with stirrups banging round, make noise, jump up and down with my foot in one stirrup and eventually stand up in one stirrup. Not all in one go, but a bit at a time, wit a scratch and a walk between. With reins tighter or looser, no issues r we take it back a step.

I do all of this from both sides.

By the time I actually mount the horse is just pleased that we are finally getting on with it!

I have had a couple of horses take longer than an hour to mount, but they were both 'cured' after a few sessions.

The being able to reposition without getting off the mounting block is a biggie. Otherwise they just teach you to get off the mounting block!
 
You need to get him to associate standing still with something good. And then you need to get him to associate the mountain block with something good. I'm not sure why you would think raising your voice at a horse who has an anxious habit is going to help?

My horse knows what WOAH means. I spent an evening dedicated to teaching him that when I say WOAH, he needs to stop what he's doing and stand still, which has also helped immensely for clipping. You do this by getting him to stand, saying WOAH when he is standing (and not moving about, or he's going to think WOAH means move about), and then you give him a reward. Slowly build the time from when you say WOAH, to when he stands still, to when you give the treat.

Then you need to repeat the process by the block. Walk him over to it and then second he stands still by it, say WOAH and give him a treat. It doesn't matter if he stands only for a millisecond - you need to be really sharp with your reflexes. Rinse repeat until you can take him to the block, say WOAH and he stands.

And then you repeat the process but you lead him to the step, step up onto the block, treat him when he stands still, and then walk him away from the block.

My horse will genuinely walk to the mountain block on his own accord and place himself perfectly for me to get on. I don't even need to put my foot in the stirrup or pick up the reins anymore.
 
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I would practice lengthening and shortening the reins from the floor to start with.

I dislike mounting issues as I have a bad hip/back and need them to be good - so I put loads of effort into getting them bulletproof.

When I was still hiring myself out for teaching/sorting tricky horses I did help a lot of people/horses with this. It can take a while, or sometimes it can be done in 1 session...

I start with faffing on the ground with as above, I also like them to be good a long reining so I can make sure they understand rein pressure. ave them learn to stand wherever, including near the mounting block.

I will cut loads of stages out, but have previously given a huuuuge answer on here, ut basically I think of all the skills they need and then get them confident with each skill. Such as lengthening and shortening the reins on the ground, making sure they understand rein pressure and how to have it yeild from the ground and also long reining. Then feeling comfy with the mounting block, and I won't go further than that until they will park themselves at the block and accept fuss and pats, slaps, knees, booftering with a foot..

All of which I do a stage at a time, with them knowing that if they stand well they will be walked away. I do it in such small increments that I don't usually get any reaction. I also teach them to be repositioned, reversed, represented etc while I am still on the mounting block. I jump up and down on the block. Pick up the reins and re position with them.

Through all of that I won't so much have put a foot in the stirrup, much less mounted.

If you are getting a reaction then you did too much too soon and did not give a break soon enough.

Before I put a foot in the stirrup I also like them to be OK with the mounting block falling. I use a sealed barrel, so it is kicked away from them, we chase it, it goes under them....

I then make sure they are confident with weight in the stirrup and know how to rebalance by bracing against the pull of the stirrup by pulling on it. The finally a foot in, out, scratch and walk off. In fact, we spend longer chilling and walking round as we do at the bloc, but I always give them a break before they need a break. A bit more each time so they realise that if they can just stand a second longer they will get a break.

I will lean over, pat the other side, play with stirrups banging round, make noise, jump up and down with my foot in one stirrup and eventually stand up in one stirrup. Not all in one go, but a bit at a time, wit a scratch and a walk between. With reins tighter or looser, no issues r we take it back a step.

I do all of this from both sides.

By the time I actually mount the horse is just pleased that we are finally getting on with it!

I have had a couple of horses take longer than an hour to mount, but they were both 'cured' after a few sessions.

The being able to reposition without getting off the mounting block is a biggie. Otherwise they just teach you to get off the mounting block!
Thank you that is a great reply he is long reined every other day atm for the same reason of rein pressure and he has been fine he prefers a much lighter contact but will generally go with it, with lunging I have been using my chambon not as an aid for getting him to stretch but on its loosest setting as a dummy rein contact nothing more so I could see how he reacted and again he is fine, reins from the ground I do that and he is fussier I honestly dont find that bit easy Im a little 5 fter every horse is huge to me lol but we do it maybe what might be easier for shorty over here is to replace the reins with longer leadropes, I have done gymballs over him underhim bounced off him nothing I havent tried shuffling my mounting block around him but Im going to thats a great idea and he is fine with everything saddle related flapping patting swinging of stirrups etc.. just this darn rein issue I cant seem to crack we are now 1 year 4 months since we first got him he has always been a 2 steps forward one step back kind of horse sounds like I need you to come down live in dorset by any chance ;) ty
 
Have a look at the Guy Robertson videos on YouTube. He's released all his videos for free and he has specific ones for mounting. Joe Midgely also has shorter clips available on his FB page and I'd presume YouTube.

Richard Maxwell was the first person I saw teaching a horse to move to the block and stand of it's own accord. I went to his last round of demos and the demo horse was very anxious. Apparently they'd had issues similar to what you are describing and RM had prescribed specific groundwork exercises before building up to getting on, being still and getting off again. On the night they were able to get on and work on standing calmly before moving off. I don't think he specifically covers this in his books but there will definitely be video footage of it. He's back out on the demo tour again doing the second part (transferring groundwork to ridden work) and I'd highly recommend. He's also excellent at taking questions and hanging back to speak to people with problems.

Someone above also mentioned making being mounted be a "good" thing for him. I remember reading one of the Mark Rashid books and the ethos is make the right thing easy and the wrong thing hard, horses always look for the release (ie that's their reward). So in the book Mark talks about backing a horse and how "we" (generic) get on and then try to stay on and perhaps have a few laps in walk being led or lunged. I'm probably horribly misquoting but his advice was along the lines of get on and get back off again - that's the release. Then get on and do 2 steps and get off so the horses learns there is ALWAYS a release. If you're not familiar with MArk's books all the "lessons" come via a story and you take from it what you need so depending on the situation there is more than one answer. This nugget just always stuck with me.
 
i get on on pretty quick, brain in gear, foot in stirrup, put body over horse, leg over, i make sure the horse in a good place to mount always use a block, and approach steadily and relaxed but when getting on i don`t faff about.

monty roberts was saying mounting is the most dangerous moment in riding, with according to doctors causing the most injuries

not much help sorry, but was thinking about this subject recently, red-1 `s idea sounds great

have you tried with a headcollar?

best of luck xx
 
as TPO mentioned Richard Maxwell has demos online you can watch where you see him train a horse to bring itself to the block having had issues being mounted - may be worth a look x
 
I think it may be an ISH "thing" - of possibly a BS thing, or a combination. But every ISH we have had did this. They were all BS ponies and we were told they simply are not taught to stand to be mounted. The kids get legged up on the fly. But the worst one we had had also had a rough history and he was genuinely terrified of being restrained in any way. For a couple of years we just dealt with it and legged child up on the fly. But when she wanted to try for her PC B test (from which he then got expelled...) we had to crack it. We spent two days doing absolutely nothing but mounting, walk around, dismount, repeat. Until he was completely bored. Then we progressed to - if he stood still he could have a canter. If not we went back to mount, walk a circle, dismount repeat. Took about 5 days in total. You still had to be quick. You couldn't hold him or faff about. But if you were calm, firm and quick you could get up without too much issue. DD is a fair time out of BS Juniors now and Pony is in fact in Sweden on their FEI junior pony team! (No idea how they mount him though...)
 
I think it may be an ISH "thing" - of possibly a BS thing, or a combination. But every ISH we have had did this. They were all BS ponies and we were told they simply are not taught to stand to be mounted. The kids get legged up on the fly. But the worst one we had had also had a rough history and he was genuinely terrified of being restrained in any way. For a couple of years we just dealt with it and legged child up on the fly. But when she wanted to try for her PC B test (from which he then got expelled...) we had to crack it. We spent two days doing absolutely nothing but mounting, walk around, dismount, repeat. Until he was completely bored. Then we progressed to - if he stood still he could have a canter. If not we went back to mount, walk a circle, dismount repeat. Took about 5 days in total. You still had to be quick. You couldn't hold him or faff about. But if you were calm, firm and quick you could get up without too much issue. DD is a fair time out of BS Juniors now and Pony is in fact in Sweden on their FEI junior pony team! (No idea how they mount him though...)

Interesting you say that as the only horse I ever had with this issue (and it was a pain!) was an ISH.
 
I had a horse on Sunday that was reluctant to walk up to the block, he just stopped when he saw what I was leading him towards.

He's otherwise well behaved:
  • when I open his stable door, if he's been right up against it a gentle push against his chest makes him back away so I can step inside,
  • he lifts his feet for me to pick out his hooves and stands to be groomed,
  • after the lesson, he knows that it's feeding time, but he stands quietly while I open his door, and lets me lead him inside (unlike some that charge in there to stick their noses in the manger).

But for mounting, he's a little bugger!

I walked him away from the block and brought him around in a big arc towards a block and got within a yard of it before he saw it, then he stopped. I could reach the block, so picked it up and placed it next to him. He didn't try to pull his head away, but swung his rear end away, so I couldn't get on.

By now, everybody else was mounted up; I had to get the instructor to come over and hold him still... that worked.

And that was it; once up there, he was fine for the whole of the next hour.
 
I am a complete convert to clicker training an would use this with your mare. What is she like if you gather the reins, without being in position for mounting? I would start with clicking when she allows you to touch the reins, then work up to taking up the reins to mount, clicking and treating all the way.
 
Ha, I stopped working with horses, too broken myself. Just got a little retirement horse for myself now, and as she is yung I am even letting a fit, young and fantastic rider help me out with the jumping!
my old mare is 25 bombproof and amazing this guy is testing my age though not being as young as I used to once be I cant bounce on from the ground as well lol :)
 
Have a look at the Guy Robertson videos on YouTube. He's released all his videos for free and he has specific ones for mounting. Joe Midgely also has shorter clips available on his FB page and I'd presume YouTube.

Richard Maxwell was the first person I saw teaching a horse to move to the block and stand of it's own accord. I went to his last round of demos and the demo horse was very anxious. Apparently they'd had issues similar to what you are describing and RM had prescribed specific groundwork exercises before building up to getting on, being still and getting off again. On the night they were able to get on and work on standing calmly before moving off. I don't think he specifically covers this in his books but there will definitely be video footage of it. He's back out on the demo tour again doing the second part (transferring groundwork to ridden work) and I'd highly recommend. He's also excellent at taking questions and hanging back to speak to people with problems.

Someone above also mentioned making being mounted be a "good" thing for him. I remember reading one of the Mark Rashid books and the ethos is make the right thing easy and the wrong thing hard, horses always look for the release (ie that's their reward). So in the book Mark talks about backing a horse and how "we" (generic) get on and then try to stay on and perhaps have a few laps in walk being led or lunged. I'm probably horribly misquoting but his advice was along the lines of get on and get back off again - that's the release. Then get on and do 2 steps and get off so the horses learns there is ALWAYS a release. If you're not familiar with MArk's books all the "lessons" come via a story and you take from it what you need so depending on the situation there is more than one answer. This nugget just always stuck with me.
I know Richard he is out on tour atm Ive watched a ton of his videos Im just waiting till he is abit closer to me Okehampton was alittle bit far for me to go :)
 
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i get on on pretty quick, brain in gear, foot in stirrup, put body over horse, leg over, i make sure the horse in a good place to mount always use a block, and approach steadily and relaxed but when getting on i don`t faff about.

monty roberts was saying mounting is the most dangerous moment in riding, with according to doctors causing the most injuries

not much help sorry, but was thinking about this subject recently, red-1 `s idea sounds great

have you tried with a headcollar?

best of luck xx
yup same thing with a rope headcollar :)
 
I think it may be an ISH "thing" - of possibly a BS thing, or a combination. But every ISH we have had did this. They were all BS ponies and we were told they simply are not taught to stand to be mounted. The kids get legged up on the fly. But the worst one we had had also had a rough history and he was genuinely terrified of being restrained in any way. For a couple of years we just dealt with it and legged child up on the fly. But when she wanted to try for her PC B test (from which he then got expelled...) we had to crack it. We spent two days doing absolutely nothing but mounting, walk around, dismount, repeat. Until he was completely bored. Then we progressed to - if he stood still he could have a canter. If not we went back to mount, walk a circle, dismount repeat. Took about 5 days in total. You still had to be quick. You couldn't hold him or faff about. But if you were calm, firm and quick you could get up without too much issue. DD is a fair time out of BS Juniors now and Pony is in fact in Sweden on their FEI junior pony team! (No idea how they mount him though...)
could be true he is a showjumper and he came from Ireland past year :)
 
monty roberts was saying mounting is the most dangerous moment in riding, with according to doctors causing the most injuries

One of the reasons I 'hop' on, rather than put my foot in the stirrup. Far too much can happen between the time your foot goes in and the time it takes to swing over! Had a few very close calls like that on previous horses.
 
I had a horse on Sunday that was reluctant to walk up to the block, he just stopped when he saw what I was leading him towards.

He's otherwise well behaved:
  • when I open his stable door, if he's been right up against it a gentle push against his chest makes him back away so I can step inside,
  • he lifts his feet for me to pick out his hooves and stands to be groomed,
  • after the lesson, he knows that it's feeding time, but he stands quietly while I open his door, and lets me lead him inside (unlike some that charge in there to stick their noses in the manger).

But for mounting, he's a little bugger!

I walked him away from the block and brought him around in a big arc towards a block and got within a yard of it before he saw it, then he stopped. I could reach the block, so picked it up and placed it next to him. He didn't try to pull his head away, but swung his rear end away, so I couldn't get on.

By now, everybody else was mounted up; I had to get the instructor to come over and hold him still... that worked.

And that was it; once up there, he was fine for the whole of the next hour.
yes he is ok if held from the ground but I need to crack this I wont always have someone there to hold him he has improved he wouldnt even go near the mounting block at first that took ages but this rein thing I just cant crack it Im going to practice tomorrow just picking up and putting down reins when he relaxes (although he hardly ever relaxes if he does a slow blink thats him relaxing :)
 
One of the reasons I 'hop' on, rather than put my foot in the stirrup. Far too much can happen between the time your foot goes in and the time it takes to swing over! Had a few very close calls like that on previous horses.
I am too short and too old I have to get it down to a slow process as I hope this horse will stay with me for years to come I want to try and sort this out now I wish I was bouncey and young haha :)
 
I am a complete convert to clicker training an would use this with your mare. What is she like if you gather the reins, without being in position for mounting? I would start with clicking when she allows you to touch the reins, then work up to taking up the reins to mount, clicking and treating all the way.
I have a clicker somewhere in my kit this is a good idea thank you. he is still fussy if Im on the ground gathering reins but perfectly fine once you are on, I think after talking to a few friends he has either been held on to for dear life yanked about in his mouth so hard etc.. he had the dentist out last week and even he said I have never dealt with a horse so fussy with his mouth hence why we took him bitless but he had no issues in the mouth beside him having a small mouth and a big tongue :)
 
you guys have been so helpful keep those great ideas coming Im willing to try anything and as I am out of ideas you guys have been great hopefully my beautiful loving yet scared of life horse Jack will get there he is special and deserves to have a better start then he did before me its just so awful he is only 6 now to think in his tiny short life so much wrong has happened to him
 

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I taught my big horse to stand by treating him. It took probably a year of having a helper armed with polos but now he won’t move away from the mounting block until he’s had his sweetie. I can fiddle, do my girth, change my stirrups etc and he won’t walk off.

I think it’s a competition thing - the rider gets legged up and off they go. I’ve had to teach a few to stand and it can take time, unfortunately.
 
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