Dilemma: inexperienced friend completely over horsed!

[ImmyS]

This is a long one but will try to keep it short. Basically my friend, the same age as me, 16 recently bought her first horse. She has plenty experience of riding as had ridden from a young age but no really experience of owning her own horse and neither of her parents are horsey themselves.

Late August she said her dads 'friend' has a horse for sale, a 5 year old ex racer that had done sponsored rides,hunting etc.. Which is what she wanted to do. I explained her my views in ex racers, I have one myself, and that they are rewarding but can be difficult. She went to see him and all seemed well and he was good at the viewing. She decided to buy him without a vetting or second viewing.

So when she brought him home I went over for a visit and was shocked at how thin he was, but seemed nice enough temperament wise etc..

For the first few weeks all seemed to go really well, she hacked him out and got on well with him however the last week or so he has turned extremely sour, bucking when ridden and also reared in hand as well as being moody and bad to catch in the field. She is now just lunging him but is adamant she wants to sell him as he's not what she wanted, which is fair enough. I have tried to advise from the start that he needs food, worming and insuring but she hasn't done any of these, which with the first two I suspect is what has made him bitter and I also think his back could be causing him issues, as she said he has lumps on his back, I suggested getting chiro out then a saddler but nothing.

She is convinced that she will get her money back on him although he is pretty much not rideable at the moment. I think that she should give him the winter off to just chill and put on weight until the spring but she doesn't want to do this. I know it seems like I interfere a lot but I have let her get on with it, just trying to give hints along the way as I know myself the quirks and difficulties of owning an ex racer. So basically I am just asking for advice, what do you think she should do in this situation, I'm looking for you're suggestions to give to her as I think she is just lost as to what to do?

Thank you for getting this far!

 

[CobsGalore]

How much turnout and grass was he getting before your friend bought him?

It is very likely he is just enjoying himself too much in the field, and has lots more energy than he did before - it may take him a while to settle down.

 

[ImmyS]

I'm not totally sure but grass was bare at his previous home. Is on better grass but only about an acre shared with another pony

 

[zaminda]

Has he put on much weight? Or is he still very light?
It depends on how much she paid for him as to whether she will get her money back, but as he stands, £500 is about all he is worth. On another point, to have hunted and done fun rides by 5, as well as having raced is going some.

 

[ImmyS]

I haven't seen him in flesh for a little while but in a recent phot still looks light, very ribby and prominent back bone. He seems to have done a lot, hunted in Ireland then imported where he's done sponsored rides etc.. Don't think he's had any let down time which may explain it.

 

[zaminda]

It sounds like you have tried to help, but that she doesn't really want to listen. He needs to put on weight, and I would check for ulcers too. At this time of year she is going to struggle to sell him at all, and the fact that he was very poor when she bought him was probably covering a lot of the behavioural issues. In your situation I would only offer advice if she asked for it, unless it became a welfare issue, where on you will have to act. Not a great spot to be in, especially if she is a friend.

 

[CobsGalore]

I would turn him away over the winter. I wouldn't even bring him in a stable over night. Just make sure he is well rugged and has adlib hay.

I would then re back him in the spring and if still not getting along I would sell to someone more experienced.

How much did she pay for him?

 

[MsChops]

We're in similar boats - guessing this was inspired by my dilemma thread

Is she keeping him at livery? Maybe you could suggest she gets feed through them to fatten him up, and he needs a break before being ridden. Five is so young to have done all that...

 

[Jazzy B]

unfortunately if she won't listen to your advice there isn't really much you can do unless the horse of course becomes a welfare case in which case you would probably have to report it.

 

[ImmyS]

It sounds like you have tried to help, but that she doesn't really want to listen. He needs to put on weight, and I would check for ulcers too. At this time of year she is going to struggle to sell him at all, and the fact that he was very poor when she bought him was probably covering a lot of the behavioural issues. In your situation I would only offer advice if she asked for it, unless it became a welfare issue, where on you will have to act. Not a great spot to be in, especially if she is a friend.

I just think she didn't fully understand how much she has taken on, management wise of him let alone ridden. And yes I agree I think he was pretty much starved in previous home which explains why he was good when tried out. I go over to hers fairly regularly so will be keeping a close eye on him to make sure he isn't dropping weight etc..

 

[ImmyS]

I would turn him away over the winter. I wouldn't even bring him in a stable over night. Just make sure he is well rugged and has adlib hay.

I would then re back him in the spring and if still not getting along I would sell to someone more experienced.

How much did she pay for him?

Yes this is what I feel she should do. I have hinted at getting some adlib hay and offered our hay suppliers number but she said she didn't want to put hay in the field as it would ruin the grass, tbh I think she can't really afford any extras and didn't understand how much it can take time and money wise to sustain a tbs weight. She paid 1500 for him then an extra 150 for the saddle which, although I'm no expert,doesn't seem to be a great fit especially with his lack of top line

 

[ImmyS]

We're in similar boats - guessing this was inspired by my dilemma thread

Is she keeping him at livery? Maybe you could suggest she gets feed through them to fatten him up, and he needs a break before being ridden. Five is so young to have done all that...

Yess indeed! No he's kept on her own land...

 

[FfionWinnie]

At the end of the day you cannot do anything. If she wants your advice give her it but otherwise I think you will have to bite your tongue unfortunately.

 

[Star_Chaser]

If she wants to sell then just hope the next person who buys him is the right person to at least give him the basics of care

 

[s4sugar]

Yes this is what I feel she should do. I have hinted at getting some adlib hay and offered our hay suppliers number but she said she didn't want to put hay in the field as it would ruin the grass, tbh I think she can't really afford any extras and didn't understand how much it can take time and money wise to sustain a tbs weight. She paid 1500 for him then an extra 150 for the saddle which, although I'm no expert,doesn't seem to be a great fit especially with his lack of top line

Sounds like the horse will be better off in another home. TB or not, how is she planning to keep a horse without giving feed?

 

[EMC]

Maybe she needs a bit of a confidence boost....besides education on his care.

I'm having my confidence knocked at the minute by my ex-racer so my YO is schooling us both and it is helping, both my confidence with him (riding him in racing was easier!!) and in my own abilities as a rider. When I'm having a 'I'm selling him to a better rider' day she peps me up and points out how far I've come with him.

Does your friend have the money to have his back etc. investigated? She might just be to embarrassed to say she can't afford it but as the horse is suffering you might need to gently approach the subject. If she can't afford it then maybe approaching a re-homing charity to re-home him might be the best option, although they will have long waiting lists.

Selling him is the quick option and trust me I've thought of it too!! But if he is sore/unrideable then this will be hard. Can you do some work with him? Maybe ask her if you could show her what you did with your ex racer? Softly softly with this approach though so as not to offend her and risk her carrying on regardless.

You could have a look at cheaper conditioning feeds suitable for ex-racers and encourage her to put some weight on him, worming is a must though as you know.

I hope for the horse's sake she listens but if she doesn't then you have done all you can. Worst case....ie. he becomes far too thin, contact a re-homing charity as an emergency. Big hugs x

 

[zaminda]

Is the horse rugged at the moment? She will be more than lucky if she gets her money back tbh. If she hasn't been feeding it, and has been working it, then I'm not surprised shes having trouble. Sadly I suspect it will soon become a welfare case. I would condition score it next time I was there, andif it is getting worse, you will either need to say something strongly, or report it. Shame she isn't on a yard, she may be getting some more advice, and people quite possible getting quite sharp about it if she was.

 

[canteron]

A difficult one, but I think you have to sit your friend down, offer your help and really give her your opinion - based on your experience, then drop it and let her come to you if she wants to!! After all, if she sell the horse to someone completely horrible, then I guess she will drop down your friends list anyway, so there is very little to lose?

 

[guido16]

Wow, what an incredible grown up 16 year old you are. Well done!

No advice except to say, you have to be really blunt with her about feeding for an ex racer or walk away and report her if this becomes a welfare case.

Agree with others, either give winter off or sell ASAP to a more experienced home.

 

[ImmyS]

It's a really tough situation. She's a good friend and I love her to bits so its hard to find the balance between giving firm advice and being 'horrible' and picking at everything. I have suggested worming and given her the website we use which is a cheaper option which I think she will do soon. I have also just suggested getting a basic chaff general supplement with some oil just so he gets what he needs for not too much money, she seems keen on the idea then goes of it again and just says ill see how he goes. She's not the most well off of people however neither am I but you just have to find the money if you are going to have a horse, and I know that all too well. Hmm and with rugging she is rugging but only lightweight, my tb has a heavy on at night if there is rain and if no rain a lightweight with a fleece at the moment and she has good coverage.

I may be going over to help with him tomorrow so I will look at him weight wise. We are planning to do some work on the ground with him, and lunge him without tack then with tack and see if he's any different, as I suspect the saddle has made him sore and I've lent her a half pad to bulk out the saddle until he hopefully puts on weight! I'm trying to support her in the kindest way possible!

 

[ImmyS]

Wow, what an incredible grown up 16 year old you are. Well done!

No advice except to say, you have to be really blunt with her about feeding for an ex racer or walk away and report her if this becomes a welfare case.

Agree with others, either give winter off or sell ASAP to a more experienced home.

I've had to grow up fast, especially owning an ex racer, they are a tough responsibility, but also very rewarding. She has said she will not sell unless she gets back what she has paid and i said the only way you can do that is to keep him over winter then work through spring and then yo can decide if he's really not for you. I think she will do this, just needs some help with the groundwork aspects of training as I think that is what this horse needs

 

[Tnavas]

There is not much you can do - offer advice if asked - you can tell people till you are blue in the face but they will only do what they want in the end.

This is her first horse and she will be wanting to do everything her way.

What you could do as a friend is buy her a Magnesium salt block to put out in the field as I wonder if the grass might be getting the better of him especially as he hasn't had a good feed of it in the past few months. You could tell her its a "horse warming present"

If he has already put on weight his saddle may very well be pinching - or it's on his withers and the reason he is not happy in his work.

Even as experienced as I am I've been caught by the quiet, lean horse buy! Stunning horse, lovely movement but the moment he picked up weight, mad as can be and you couldn't touch his feet - he'd be over the fence if the farrier so much as looked at him. Sadly he went on a oneway trip to the hunt.

Be supportive - she will notice that she needs to feed him as winter progresses, hopefully it will be soon.

 

[atlantis]

Could you show her this thread? You come across really well and she can see what other people's thoughts are on the subject and that you are not being mean but are really trying to help.

Just an idea.

 

[ImmyS]

There is not much you can do - offer advice if asked - you can tell people till you are blue in the face but they will only do what they want in the end.

This is her first horse and she will be wanting to do everything her way.

What you could do as a friend is buy her a Magnesium salt block to put out in the field as I wonder if the grass might be getting the better of him especially as he hasn't had a good feed of it in the past few months. You could tell her its a "horse warming present"

If he has already put on weight his saddle may very well be pinching - or it's on his withers and the reason he is not happy in his work.

Even as experienced as I am I've been caught by the quiet, lean horse buy! Stunning horse, lovely movement but the moment he picked up weight, mad as can be and you couldn't touch his feet - he'd be over the fence if the farrier so much as looked at him. Sadly he went on a oneway trip to the hunt.

Be supportive - she will notice that she needs to feed him as winter progresses, hopefully it will be soon.

I've also been in the same boat, bought my ex racer as a skinny just turned 5 year old as chilled as a donkey, been incredibly lucky though as although has her thoroughbred tantrums she has remained a workable and rational horse. I do worry about him going into winter as she wants to sell him after winter but I can't help thinking he's going be even thinner by then! It's so difficult because she does ask for advice but never really follows through which is the frustrating part. I've suggested just selling him cheap to a suitable home and then her maybe get a school master on full loan, however understandably her father who paid of the horse wants his money back if its sold so she is in a predicament and I really feel for her as its so tough when its a living being in the balance.

 

[ImmyS]

Could you show her this thread? You come across really well and she can see what other people's thoughts are on the subject and that you are not being mean but are really trying to help.

Just an idea.

I might do that, the next time she's asks for advice ill suggest maybe coming here for a look

 

[ImmyS]

Thank you for all your replies by the way, really helpful!

 

[Kallibear]

There really is a limit to what you can do, so offer advise than try not to stress about it.

She is less likely to take advise from you as a friend and someone her own age than an older adult with an air of authority (you prob know the kind of person I mean!). Could you somehow wangle her meeting up with someone like that. Maybe an instructor? Offer a shared lesson together and have a chat with the instructor before you go?

 

[ImmyS]

There really is a limit to what you can do, so offer advise than try not to stress about it.

She is less likely to take advise from you as a friend and someone her own age than an older adult with an air of authority (you prob know the kind of person I mean!). Could you somehow wangle her meeting up with someone like that. Maybe an instructor? Offer a shared lesson together and have a chat with the instructor before you go?

Actually you saying that has given me an idea. The woman who keeps her pony with ours, a lovely lady but knows her stuff is a qualified equine nutritionist, I could maybe get her to have a chat with my friend?

 

[Kallibear]

Sounds like a good plan. She'll need to be some authoritive, approachable and friendly: the kind of person someone 16yr old and a but novice looks up to. You could try and wriggle a way in to them meeting without making your friend resent interferance.

 

[ImmyS]

Yes I'll try to arrange my friend to come over Kate 'happens to be there. She's a really good person to talk and she's helped m out a lot with my girlie ex racer.