Disapointed and lots of money spent..what would you do?

charlie76

charlie76

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A horse at our yard was sent to be schooled by a 'horse behaviourist' as he was naughty to ride.It cost almost £500 per week for this. He came back to us a few days ago and he was very nervous, had lost a lot of weight and condtion and had 1 shoe on! we have not ridden him yet as we have had to wait for the farrier. would you contact them and have words?
 
Most definately! I would be horrified
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where they recommended to you? Sounds like a horror story for the horse- if he is that nervous may be best to start with some work of the ground- you just dont know what they have done to the poor thing.
I hope it works out ok for the horse
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I certainly wouldn't be paying any bills until I knew what had gone on.

The horse should have come back looking well, feeling happy and with four shoes on.
 
Erm - did the owners not bother to go and visit the horse at least weekly? That is very irresponsible of them, and to be honest, could have meant that the horse suffered less.
 
Has the bill been paid? If not, I would certainly withhold payment. I think you need to contact them and express your concerns and also follow up with a letter. Was this person being recommended to you? Instead of having a horse that is naughty to ride, by the sounds of it, you now have a traumatised horse in poor condition that hasn't even had his feet seen to. I am sure you won't be recommending this "horse behaviourist" to anybody in the future.
 
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£500 per week!!! How much, a top Olympic rider doesn't cost that much.

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Was actually going to post the same thing actually.

Sounds like a massive scam.....
 
I would be horrified, but then my horse would never get like that as I would not send it away (especially to someone I don't know) and not visit regularly.
This is the exact sort of things I would have hawk eyes for!
It's sad but you can't trust anybody you don't know - and you can't always trust those you do but at least you usually have a better idea!

Why did the horse go to a behaviouralist? Presumably it wasn't normal to begin with?

What where the terms - sometimes for short term stays, the owners are asked to provide the hard feed - if this was the case and non was provided then it's the owners fault as the yard would have presummed it didn't eat hard feed (although I would expect them to inform you of the weight loss).

However, some horses do loose lots of weight when they are moved (especially as it was a problem horse to begin with). How long was it there?

It is impossible to fully judge without knowing all these things!!

Similaly, it may have been in the terms that it is the owners responsibility to get the horse shod by the regular farrier.

It is sad, but IMO, it is the owners responsibility to ensure the horse is being looked after as they see fit (then it can be removed immediately if not!)
 
Jem 1 - I agree with what you have written and also with your avatar.

It sounds like rather than work through the horses problems at home with the help of an instructor etc, they have sent the horse away 'to be fixed' and forgotten about it, expecting to get a fixed horse for the money they have spent.

It also sounds like they have more money than sense. Out of intrest, what was 'wrong' with the horse?
 
The owner went and visited it weekly and the horse seemed ok and they saw it ridden- they are pretty novicy- hence why they sent it away. Please be assured that this was some one that would be known and highly regarded on the equine world, the horse would not have been sent to just anyone- this is wondering whether it should be questioned as if so I will have to do it as the owner wouldn't know how to deal with the situation. It seems that it the 10 days the horse wasn't seen it all went down hill. The owner could only visit at weekends as the horse was a long way from home.
With regards to a quick fix- that is nonsense. We have had the horse here for almost a year and got him to a point but he is a very difficult type, we have got him to being a nightmare to even mount through ground work and patience to being ridden in walk, trot and canter and small jumps ridden and he is fine with us riding him but its no good if he still tries it with the owner- which he did. The owner sent him to be 'finished' and to be ridden by some one else as a last resort to try and settle him.
a lot of others would have given up on the horse as a lost cause so please don't judge the owners as thats not fair.
 
Well, quite simply. If I sent my horse somewhere to be trained, schooled - whatever - then I would expect it to receive the highest standard of care. I'm not sure that I would expect to have to visit it to ensure it's welfare was not being compromised.

So yes - this situation sounds wrong and I would want to chase it up further to find out what had happened for the horse to return 'not itself' and minus three shoes.

HOWEVER - Why does someone so novicy have such a 'problem' horse. And she was obviously seen coming if they expected her to pay £500 a week. No one I know charges that amount - and I know plenty of professionals who have horses in for breaking, re-training, schooling, competing etc.

Poor girl, sounds like she has been taken for an absolute mug. Not only has her purse suffered, but so has her horse.
 
Amy May- she was advised NOT to buy the horse but went ahead anyway and since then we have tried our best to help with the horse and made lots of prgress, she finally agreed that perhaps she made a mistake but decided to give the horse 1 last chance before moving it on, and to be honest, not sure she will be able too!
So, despite my and others advice she bought the horse and is now having to pay to have help to get the horse going either well enough for her or well enough to sell.
 
sounds awful - i definately wouldnt be paying anything until id had a full explanation from the place he went to.

personally id never send my horse away to someone, however bad it was - you never know what they do to them, whether they are meant to be reputable or not. You can get people to come out to yards these days, then at least you can keep an eye on whats going on.
 
AmyMay, I would expect the highest level of care, but I know that to be sure of it, I would need to check - it maks sense to me. I cannot risk my horses welfare on the hope that my expectations will be met (or even shared) by strangers.

Charlie, so I have this clear. How long was he there before taking this turn for the worse over ten days?

Was he definately being fed and shod up until then. At the start of a ten day period, was he definately full up to weight and healthy with a set of well maintained feet?

Or could it be the case that he was loosing weight steadily but as the owner is very novice they did not realise until it got quite bad? Also with the shoes - the feet may have been getting longer and longer and worse and worse without them noticing which makes it very conceivable that it would loose 3 in ten days - obviously it is then easy for her to spot the problem when the horse has actually lost the shoes?
 
What a horrible situation, and how distressing for the horse. i don't know anything about the terms that were agreed with this behaviourist person and it may be that simply being away from home has brought on stress induced weight loss and enough tramping around to rip off shoes.

for now I would be inclined to give neddie a short holiday and then restart with some NH type work before assessing what kind of future this horse has.
 
Your right there PG- they tried having some one come out but he needed to be done every day, if not twice as he is such a tricky one.

The thing is though if you send a horse to some one who is known as one of the best, you kind of trust them to give the best.

The horse hasn't been abused in anyway but its not the way I expected the horse to be returned to us considering the expense!Def put me off!
 
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she was advised NOT to buy the horse

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Mmmm - in that case, don't get involved. Let her sort it out herself. Tough lesson, but hopefully one that she won't repeat.

Still - poor horse. What is the matter with it?
 
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Please be assured that this was some one that would be known and highly regarded on the equine world

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Come on then........ can we have initials at least?
 
Charlie - I am going to sound really harsh here -

If they were novicey, they are clearly over horsed and whoever said that they should buy it should be shot. They should be shot if they didnt listen to sound advice. There are two many horses in this world who are bought by inexperienced people and then labled as problem horses and gain stinking reputations. It amounts to cruelty IMO.

Just becasue you can afford to buy a flash horse does not mean it will turn you into a flash rider. And even if the horse would have come back fit and well schooled the chances are these novices still would not have coped with it - so what is the point? No amount of money can buy a bond with a horse it is something that has to be worked at.

I would question the 'highly regarded' person as to why the horse came back in the condition it did. I am not saying that this was not unprofessional and I am not saying I would take this person to the cleaners over it - (BTW I think you should take pictures of the horse's condition)

HOWEVER. I would have done everything in my power to make sure that my horse was well cared for. It is your reponsibility to ensure that your horses welfare is taken care of. I have had horses away to grass over an hour and a half's drive away and I have gone down weekly (even though they were with a friend) to see to them.

Ultimately I think that whoever advised these novice people , the owners of the horse (you can excuse naivety but not a disregard for the welfare of your horse - they are as responsible as the pro) and the pro are all fully responsible for the condition the horse is in.

The only person I feel sorry for is the horse.
 
With regard to the shoes, I assume that he shoeing was not part of the livery and they made no attempt to discuss a farrier with the pro?
 
Jem1- I can PM you if you like!

As its not my horse I didn't go and see it. The owner told me he was being shod when he was there- he has been there for 7 weeks. And he was shod as the 1 show left on wasn't one of ours! His feet aren't long but why send him back with 1 shoe on!
He was in at night so why he has lost weight I do not know and you could say its workload that knocked the weight off but then why the lack of muscle and top line- he went with some!
 
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With regard to the shoes, I assume that he shoeing was not part of the livery and they made no attempt to discuss a farrier with the pro?

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This is unlikely as livery and training costs always exclude shoeing and veterinary care if required, but are always available if needed.
 
FeuFolet - I have already said that they were advised not to buy the horse but the did do anyway, I have also stated that they visited the horse weekly on both days at the weekend- so they didn't just leave it.

TBH , yes, they made a mistake but at least they have admitted that, held their hands up and sought advice from a well know person. How on earth were they to know that it would turn out this way! Many people would have sent it to the sales and washed their hands of it!
 
In this instance the top line does not concern me one bit - he went to be taught to behave (to be vauge!) not to be schooled as such - these behaviouralist types don't concentrate on getting the horse on it's back end working in a nice outline to a soft, supple contact blah blah blah!! So I would forget his now lack of topline.

The weight and the shoes........... well, if you know he was shod while there, and his feet are nice, just missing three shoes then I guess he could have gone out just before being brought home and pulled them off?? Rare to get three off but could happen! Again, as long as his actual feet are good, I would forget this.

The weight and the nervousness are what seem odd.
The weight can't be because of new surroundings etc if he was there a while before he dropped it all. I would ring and find out what happened in those ten days that was different and caused this.

Also the nervousness - I'm not sure if you are saying this was fine also until the last ten days? In which case I would again question what happened in those ten days (and is probably the same cause as the weight loss). But then, this can't be the case, as he went with problems??
So do you mean he has just got no better? (In this case, why did they say he was ready? Or did owner decide to bring home?)
Or has he come back worse than he went?
 
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