DIY or Full Livery......which and why? BIIIIG decision!

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Chunky_Monkey

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I'm a long-time lurker (I just love this forum!
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) but I am struggling with a big decision, and I'd be realy grateful for any opinions from you lovely HHO people!

For various reasons, I'm planning to move yards (the main reason is that the YM provides totally rubbish holiday cover, bordering on the negligent), but I'm in no rush as I've not got a holiday coming up til next Summer
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so it's not an urgent move......

I've had my horse for 5 years, and he's always been on DIY. I've been to see a dream yard, but the YO can only offer me full livery....but, amazingly, the full livery works out at only £5 a week more expensive than my current DIY (with all things considered).

The new place reallly is a wonderful place......facilities are top-notch (it's like a 5* hotel for horses!), the YO and grooms are lovely, the location is wonderful with loads of off road hacking.....but it's actually a 'retirement' livery, with very few working horses there (I think there are only about 5 that are ridden, and of those, only a couple hack out).

I sometimes get a bit of a 'can't be bothered' attitude in Winter and can go days and weeks without riding (I'm really only a happy hacker), but I find that watching other riders encourages me to ride. We don't compete, so I sometimes feel that schooling can be a bit pointless....although I do enjoy it occasionally.

I love the time I spend with my horse, although, in truth, only about half of the time I actually spend at the yard is 'quality time' with him - most of the time is spent doing the 'jobs'.

I am having sleepless nights over this decision....and I keep flipping from one viewpoint to another, constantly thinking of the 'pros' then the 'cons'.........really, what I want to know is other people's experiences of full livery, and why you chose that option/how it worked out for you. Did you feel that you lost that 'connection' with your horse and how did you feel 'giving up' the care of your horse to someone else. I think I must just be a control freak!!
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I wonder if anyone can help at all?
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Tracey x
 
I had my horse on DIY for years, but I moved to a yard which would only do full livery. TBH I like it now, I know it's hard but you get to ride more and spend more quality time with your horse. I haven't lost any connection with my horse at all, so I would go for it.
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Nothing wrong with having full livery, especially if you can afford it! I have absolutely never lost the connection with any horse I have had on full livery.

If you want to do more of the jobs yourself some days then the yard will, more than likely, be more than happy for you to do so! As for the lack of people to ride with - do you usually hack out in company, or are you happy to go it alone? If you want company then this place may not be for you. Lets face it, all you need is decent hacking and a decent routine - no point in paying for facilities that you will seldom use.

Toughie!
 
On the one hand, it's nice to be the person to feed and handle your horse....on the other hand your horse doesn't care who mucked out his bed, filled his haynet and his water....or swept.
Maybe not having to do the icky bits if your horse is on full livery will free up time for you to spend with your horse, riding etc?
Maybe go back and have another look at the full livery one to make your mind up?
S
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I work full time in london (I start work at 7.15am & finish at 5.15pm!!) & i couldn't have my horses if they weren't on full Livery. I have everything done except grooming & riding. I don't feel I've lost any connection with them as when i'm there (& I go nearly every day) I'm spending time with them rather than doing jobs. My yard lets me decide on feeds etc, so i feel I have control of what is done with them. Both my boys know my car & are looking for me as I drive in
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If I get stuck at work, trains are delayed or any other issue, I don't panic as I know they are done & looked after. when i go on hols, they stay in their same routine, so i don't worry.
If it's the right yard for you, go for it. yes I miss the looking after some time, but the time I spend at the yard is with them.
 
i'd go for the new yard, as long as the YO doesn't mind if you do certain things for your horse. if you're going to get told off for trying to do things for your horse because you always have and so you want to, then it won't work. if they're happy for you to do a bit when you want (maybe by prior arrangement to make it simpler for them) then it sounds great. talk to the other riders/hackers out, in the new yard, and see if they'd hack out with you, if that's important. would you be leaving friends behind?
if you were told now that there were no more spaces at the new yard, so you definitely couldn't go, would you be really disappointed?
if so, that's your answer. go to the new yard.
(it's a way of tricking your subconscious, discovering how you really feel.)
 
My horse went on full livery a few years ago when I was working longer hours and just didn't have the time to do everything, even though i'm incredibly picky i felt that it was the right thing to do as i was spending all my time doing my jobs and not spending enough time with him.
To begin with there were a few teething problems, things not being done how i liked etc, but once we got over those it has worked really well. I know that if i'm a bit late it doesn't matter because he is happy and content in his stable and i can spend my time grooming and riding.
 
Hi all, thanks for the quick replies - I wish I was as quick with my decision making!
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Yup, I can afford it (the full livery includes all feed, hay, bedding, dentist, annual vaccines, foot trimming, worming, etc) so it's fantastic value-for-money and only a bit more expensive that being on DIY.

I think my real sticking point is the quietness of the yard......I sometimes like the company of other liveries (sometimes don't as well!
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) and my horse prefers to hack in company (although he will go out alone). I think my next step is to get a 'reality check' from the YO - can she tell me who hacks and how often, what time of day they normally hack, who actually comes to the yard to see their horse, etc etc...just to get a rough idea really.

Tracey x
 
I think that is a good idea - for you, the hacking out is the most important thing, so go sound it out - you may find that there are more people willing to hack out if they know there is someone they can go with!
 
Hi, I was thinking the same thing about the 'chores'.....they're hardly the way to build a bond with your horse, are they! And, let's face it, who really wants to be poo picking in the dark on a windswept wet December evening....not me!

Yep, I was thinking it'd be a good idea to have another visit to the place, to have another look around/talk to the YO.

Tracey x
 
Hi - yes, like you I would be at the yard every day (still in the DIY livery mindset!).....to be honest, all of the 'pros' on my mental list are the ones you mentioned......good consistant routine (even when you're away), a settled environment, all the icky jobs done for you, not having to worry if you're stuck at work, etc etc

It really is my dream yard........sigh
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I like the subconscious trickery! Never thought about it from that angle - very clever! I don't think I'd be devastated if I was told I couldn't move to the new yard.....the decision is really doing my head in, so it would mean I didn't have to make the decision in the first place....if you know what I mean?! I would be leaving some friends behind, but, to be honest, like most big yards, there are cliques and bitchiness...and I certainly won't miss that!

I've already talked to the YO about the fact that I'd want to be involved as much as possible in Archie's care, and she seems very flexible. I'm pretty easy going, as well, and don't cause problems.

I think I definately need to speak to the other riders.

x
 
Hi there - yes, I have to admit that I like things done in a certain way, but I spent about 2 hours at the yard with the YO, and I liked the way she did things / the routine that the horses are on....it all seemed to slot in with what I would do anyway.

x
 
Like you I swopped from DIY (well, kept at home) to Full, basically because I had those 'can't be bothered' phases which linked directly to leaving for work at 7.30 am and not getting home until 7.30pm!! I'm about to move yards but will still have full livery, if you get the right place it can be super. Of course if I could not afford to do it that way I'd be happy to do my horse again but that's on the assumption that I wouldn't be working!!
 
Hi catherine....did you find that being on full livery helped to get you through the 'can't be bothered' phases? I just get this feeling that, when I'm having a day like that, I just won't bother to go to the yard....after all, if all of Archie's needs have already been met, is there any need to go and disturb him if I'm not planning to ride.......I'm finding it hard to put into words, but I'm sure you know what I mean.

I know this is entirely in my own hands.....after all, if I want to go to the yard every day, then it's up to me to get off my bum and go to the yard every day!

I tell you, I feel like I'm planning to pack my kids off to boarding school!

x
 
When my mare was on full livery I would go up to the yard sometimes just to give her a cuddle. Its was very relaxing to be up there in the evening with no one about except for a barn full of contented munching horses.
 
I visited a number of full livery yards before I got George, and all of them said you could do any jobs you wanted to when you were there, but as others have said mucking out etc. doesn't build a bond with your horse. I am on part livery where I am and sometimes I have to ride for a shorter time because of all the jobs, if George was on full i would still go up every day.
 
hi Trish....thanks for replying. I have to say, that reading people's replies has made me seriously consider the full livery option (there are lots of 'pros'!).

PS - I've been reading your posts about George (like I said earlier, I'm a bit of a lurker!), and I have to say he's a total stud-muffin and you're very lucky to have found him, he sounds wonderful!
 
Ive done both full livery, DIY and a lot in between over the years. Although to be fair, as soon as I was financially able to pay for full livery again, I switched right back.

I love full livery and wouldn't switch at all. Any "issues" that arise in my life (be these anything from me being ill... to being stuck in traffic.. to bad snow meaning roads are dodgy.. whatever) dont effect my horse. He is fed, watered, put on the horse walker, rugged and taken care of all at the exact same time during the day.

If he gets ill or hurts himself, he doesnt have to wait for the next time im up to notice - theres someone on the yard 18 hours a day and that level of peace of mind is worth every penny for me.

Most full livery yards will happily let you get more involved if you really want to - i think most full livery clients soon get bored of that tbh. I don't think your relationship with your horse needs to change, if anything, as already pointed out, you usually have more time to spend WITH him or her rather than doing things for him / her (and honestly, no horse cares who mucks him out or mixes his feed).

I personally prefer riding on my own so its rather different for me and that side of things is something you'll have to consider.

I dont think you should be feeling guilty because you don't always feel like riding during winter. It's great that some people ride 5 and 6 times a week all year round but I can assure you, the majority of people dont
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(Incidently, I always found making a weekly plan that took into account days off for "me" helped to keep me going much more than getting into the mentality of "oh god i have to ride")

I dont go up to the stables every day anymore. I did at first but im finally comfortable that he's well looked after and fine. I will frequently go up when i have no intention of riding though, just to see him, groom him, talk to people.. whatever really.

Personally, if you can afford it, i'd do it. You may find that when you dont have all the stables chores to do in the miserable weather, you might actually be more inclined to ride
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Will you've all tempted me, I'm on DIY right now!! Off to look at full livery websites lol and get the prices. It does sound better esp over the winter months
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DIY livery is pretty much unknown in Canada and I don't think anyone feels hard done by.
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It seems the biggest issues for you are the social aspect and the motivational component.

The social part, as you say, has good and bad. Once you check with the YO owner about what the schedule of the other boarders is you can will have a clearer idea. I've been in quite a few places where I'm almost the only person up sometimes (usually as a trainer/rider but the same idea) and I've often liked it. On such yard the YO is often quite keen to have someone come up and I found I encouraged them to ride themselves, which meant I had someone really experienced and interesting to ride with that I don't have to watch out for. But then again I don't go to the yard to meet people so if the social thing is big for you, you might want to investigate your options.

As far as the motivation . . . perhaps you could take a look at your concerns. Presumably you are worried you won't go to the yard sometimes but is that really such a bad thing? Do you think that makes you a bad owner? Maybe you are feeling a bit burned out and need to not feel like you have to go all the time. It's not "disloyal" to your horse to occassionally want to do other things, it's realistic. Your REAL responsibility as an owner is to look after your horse's needs and it sounds like you are doing your best on that front. It's unpopular to say but honestly your horse doesn't "need" you to be there everyday - he needs good care, a healthy routine and his horsey friends. I think it can be a bit different if the horse is particularly needy (I had one that hated other horses and couldn't be turned out - he HAD to have someone work with him everyday) but even then such horses are often better off on full livery so someone is around all the time and the owner can spend their limited "quality time" with the actual horse. Plus you get the added advantage of someone experienced looking out for your horse all day, on top of your own attention. I'd much rather see someone recognising the necessity of care first than trying to do everything themselves but constantly falling short.

Have you looked around at your other options? It might be the decision is made for you by either finding something even more perfect or by realising your options are very limited.

By the way, I think liking and trusting the barn owner is a VERY BIG DEAL. If you know the care will be good and think you can have a decent working relationship that is a huge plus and not always that easy to find.
 
Thanks tierra - what a great reply! I have to say that I am seriously veering over to the Full-Livery option.......it does sound fantastic. This yard is great (horsewalker, indoor and outdoor school) so that will probably inspire me to ride more often anyway.

It's probably a bad thing that I'm thinking about this at the end of the summer...with light nights, reasonably warm and dry weather, etc, still fresh in my mind.....I think we horse people tend to have short memories and forget just how revolting it is poo picking, mucking out, carrying water buckets about, etc during the winter!
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thanks again

Tracey x
 
Ooooh, just think....no more stupid o'clock alarm calls, not having to worry about Xmas/New Yrs Day, no more smelling of horse wee, no more hay in your hair at the supermarket checkout, no more tramping round wet windy fields to poo pick,......heavenly, eh?
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Hi Cruiser - very good points very well made, and real food for thought!

I have to admit that I do sometimes enjoy the social aspect of being on a large yard, but to me that's just a pleasant diversion. I don't spend time with other horsey people when I'm not at the yard, and they are just acquaintances, not lifelong buddies.

I don't think I'm particularly burned out, and I always surprise myself that I can fit so much into my life (work full time, have a new partner, a big home, a son, pets, have a really busy and varied social life, try to keep fit by swimming, gym, belly dancing, etc)....but I guess I could fit more 'me time' into my life if Arch was on full livery! Looking at all that, maybe I AM burned out! LOL!
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I think you're 100% right in what you say the horse actually needs and doesn't need. I think subconsciously I probably am thinking that not seeing him every day makes me a bad owner, cos it's what I've always done, but he probably wouldn't even notice I wasn't there to be honest....yes, he waits for me at the gate every day, and neighs when he sees me, but that's just his routine and he knows that I usually mean there's food in the offing!

I have been looking around for about a month (there's no real rush for me to find the 'perfect' place), and I've seen some shockingly awful places - this full livery yard is amazing, just wonderful. I really do like and trust the YO, so, yes, that is definately a big bonus!

Tracey x
 
I was having this thought last night, if I had flash on full livery somewhere I'd have far more time to ride him and spend time with him, people to ride with and possibly people to go out to competitions with.
 
Hi Harry_and_Flash - yep, I think you're right. It's just that full livery tends to be out of most people's budget (mine included) but I've been very lucky to find this yard - it really is a good price for full livery.

Tracey x
 
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