H-J
Well-Known Member
Have insurance to come and teach at yards?
Do all instructors or should all instructors....
- Thread starter H-J
- Start date
Bananaman
Well-Known Member
No, I can't imagine they do.
If they are accredited to BE, BD, BHS etc then they will have but otherwise it is very much up to the individual as to whether they take out insurance and I very much doubt that many do.
If they are accredited to BE, BD, BHS etc then they will have but otherwise it is very much up to the individual as to whether they take out insurance and I very much doubt that many do.
tigers_eye
Well-Known Member
Quite a few places I teach at ask to see proof I'm insured, but just as many don't give a monkeys... there's no law saying you have to be as far as I'm aware. BHS instructors have it if they have kept up their registration.
Molineux
Well-Known Member
I think you are meant to have insurance, if you were to have an accident whilst teaching someone and you were on your own place or at another yard and you were to have an accident you would not be covered.
So in other ways if you were to fall off, you would not say you was having a lesson.
It does get very messy, an old friend of mine who I no longer speak to! Got done for not having no insurance to teach, however she did not have any qualifactions to teach either
I think they require that instructors hold qualifications from the British Horse Society (BHS) or Association of British Riding Schools (ABRS).
So in other ways if you were to fall off, you would not say you was having a lesson.
It does get very messy, an old friend of mine who I no longer speak to! Got done for not having no insurance to teach, however she did not have any qualifactions to teach either
I think they require that instructors hold qualifications from the British Horse Society (BHS) or Association of British Riding Schools (ABRS).
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
No, although they should have.
The BHS have two registers for BHS qualified instructors. One is for those based at approved riding establishments, one is for those who work on a freelance basis. Its not enough just to hold the qualification - they must be on the current register of iunstructors. Insurance is available for unqualified / unacredited instructors but it's not cheap.
Always ask to see proof, & for any uninsured instructor learn from what happened to a friend of mine. She went to a new client to do an assessment & work out a training program for her & her new horse. Within ten minutes the client's been bucked off & they tried to sue my friend because ' as a qualified instructor she should have realised that the horse wasn't suitable straight away'. (It didn't even get to court but thats the attitude that we're dealing with these days).
The BHS have two registers for BHS qualified instructors. One is for those based at approved riding establishments, one is for those who work on a freelance basis. Its not enough just to hold the qualification - they must be on the current register of iunstructors. Insurance is available for unqualified / unacredited instructors but it's not cheap.
Always ask to see proof, & for any uninsured instructor learn from what happened to a friend of mine. She went to a new client to do an assessment & work out a training program for her & her new horse. Within ten minutes the client's been bucked off & they tried to sue my friend because ' as a qualified instructor she should have realised that the horse wasn't suitable straight away'. (It didn't even get to court but thats the attitude that we're dealing with these days).
mat
Well-Known Member
I am an instructor, not BHS qualified and un insured... I have large number of people who I teach regularly, I trust them and they trust me and my judgement.
They would rather have the benefit of my experience than someone who has the letters but no actual experience.
As stated above insurance for unqualified instructors is very pricey and so for me is not an option.
I have looked at getting my AI just for the insurance benefits (and was granted direct entry), but as a professional rider/trainer with 13 horses to ride, I dont have time to do this.
There is a UK Coaching certificate that is going to become available, and I am very interested in finding out more about this and any possible insurance benefits that may be available having obtained one!
In an ideal world I agree that all instructors should have insurance to protect them from the SUEING culture that seems to be growing in this country, but it is not always possible. I would personally end up paying out more on insurance than I earn from teaching!
They would rather have the benefit of my experience than someone who has the letters but no actual experience.
As stated above insurance for unqualified instructors is very pricey and so for me is not an option.
I have looked at getting my AI just for the insurance benefits (and was granted direct entry), but as a professional rider/trainer with 13 horses to ride, I dont have time to do this.
There is a UK Coaching certificate that is going to become available, and I am very interested in finding out more about this and any possible insurance benefits that may be available having obtained one!
In an ideal world I agree that all instructors should have insurance to protect them from the SUEING culture that seems to be growing in this country, but it is not always possible. I would personally end up paying out more on insurance than I earn from teaching!
H-J
Well-Known Member
I understand that and agree - its just for our lucinda clinic on tues our yard owner wants to see insurance papers etc from her thats all and am panicking she may not have any! But should have as a BE accredited trainer
mat
Well-Known Member
Im sure she could afford insurance!
Baggybreeches
Well-Known Member
I would imagine that with her being an accredited coach and on the selection panel and with all the training she does that she will have something that covers her!
kayleigh_and_rocky
Well-Known Member
Agree with bbmats sentiments entirely on this one..
Thistle
Well-Known Member
She will have something, or you could get everyone to sign a disclaimer, probably won't mean anything but may keep the YO happy.
Toby_Zaphod
Well-Known Member
My daughter uses two trainers....one who specialises in flatwork/ dressage & another who specialises in show jumping. I don't know if either has teaching insurance & to be honest I don't really care.
The flatwork guy is really good & has been teaching people & training horses for years & has a terrific reputation. The show jumping trainer has riden for Great Britain & is still riding for us, so she really knows her stuff & she has a great ability to teach.
Both my daughter & horse are insured anyway. I believe insurance can be taken too far. Horse riding can be a very dangerous sport & I think you have to accept that this is the case. If we legislate too much it will either price instruction out of reach of many riders or it will strangle the sport out of existance.
The flatwork guy is really good & has been teaching people & training horses for years & has a terrific reputation. The show jumping trainer has riden for Great Britain & is still riding for us, so she really knows her stuff & she has a great ability to teach.
Both my daughter & horse are insured anyway. I believe insurance can be taken too far. Horse riding can be a very dangerous sport & I think you have to accept that this is the case. If we legislate too much it will either price instruction out of reach of many riders or it will strangle the sport out of existance.
tigers_eye
Well-Known Member
Bbmat - I too have no letters after my name, I got my insurance through Shearwater and it was just over £300, it hasn't taken much teaching to cover that? I think Shearwater may even let you pay it in instalments too, though not sure about that. Also covers me riding other people's horses etc. Don't think I'd want to be without it tbh....
Bananaman
Well-Known Member
I would agree wholeheartedly with the sentiments here. Horses/riding can be dangerous and we all know the risks we put ourselves under, however it can only take one person to spoil things.
In this day and age of 'no win no fee', the most ridiculous cases, imo, are being taken to court.
I have to go to court next month as a character witness for an ex employer who is being sued for their stallion kicking her and breaking her leg.
I wasn't there at the time, nor was the employer, but as far as I'm aware there was no negligence......it was an accident. But it is costing thousands to get this to court, I can't believe it has got this far, and really stressing those involved.
In this day and age of 'no win no fee', the most ridiculous cases, imo, are being taken to court.
I have to go to court next month as a character witness for an ex employer who is being sued for their stallion kicking her and breaking her leg.
I wasn't there at the time, nor was the employer, but as far as I'm aware there was no negligence......it was an accident. But it is costing thousands to get this to court, I can't believe it has got this far, and really stressing those involved.
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
The trouble is that in the event of a claim (say they had a fall in one of your lessons & were unable to work for a while so wanted to claim for loss of earnings, or they have a fall & the horse gets on to the road & causes a third party to have an accident) your clients insurers would want to know the circumstances surrounding the fall. The clients insurers would then set out to do their damnest to prove that you are liable to pay the claim not them.
It doesn't matter how friendly you are with your clients. Once their insurance company get hold of a sniff that they can shift the liability they will. Most insurances include legal support as well, so are well worth having.
It doesn't matter how friendly you are with your clients. Once their insurance company get hold of a sniff that they can shift the liability they will. Most insurances include legal support as well, so are well worth having.
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I have to go to court next month as a character witness for an ex employer who is being sued for their stallion kicking her and breaking her leg.
I wasn't there at the time, nor was the employer, but as far as I'm aware there was no negligence......it was an accident. But it is costing thousands to get this to court, I can't believe it has got this far, and really stressing those involved.
[/ QUOTE ]
And the chances are your employer will lose. The criteria isn't that they were negligent, but that the horse behaved in such as way that could be counted as normal predictable behavior for horses. Do horses kick? Yes. Therefore the owner of the animal accepts the risk that an employee may at some time get kicked. It's the same principle that the couple in the article below have been found liable under.
(Note - Liable & negligent are NOT the same thing....)
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/article.php?aid=133752&cid=397
I have to go to court next month as a character witness for an ex employer who is being sued for their stallion kicking her and breaking her leg.
I wasn't there at the time, nor was the employer, but as far as I'm aware there was no negligence......it was an accident. But it is costing thousands to get this to court, I can't believe it has got this far, and really stressing those involved.
[/ QUOTE ]
And the chances are your employer will lose. The criteria isn't that they were negligent, but that the horse behaved in such as way that could be counted as normal predictable behavior for horses. Do horses kick? Yes. Therefore the owner of the animal accepts the risk that an employee may at some time get kicked. It's the same principle that the couple in the article below have been found liable under.
(Note - Liable & negligent are NOT the same thing....)
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/article.php?aid=133752&cid=397
burtie
Well-Known Member
QR - No way would I teach without insurance in this day sadly. As tigers_eye said its only £300 per annum even if not a reg'd instructor as I used to have it with SEIB for that amount. However as I have my BHSAI from 18 years ago I'm getting my First aid up to date so I can go on the register as it costs only £160 including the membership of the register so a very good deal IMO.
I'm not prepared to risk being made bankrupt and losing my home just because I could not be bothered to get insurance.
I'm not prepared to risk being made bankrupt and losing my home just because I could not be bothered to get insurance.
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
QR.
Ooh good point re the first aid as well......if you're teaching you really MUST have an up to date first aid qualification. If someone did fall in a lesson & you were unable to render the correct assistance you would be liable.
Again if someone has had a life changing accident they're going to need the kind of long term financial support which could well bankrupt or lead to the loss of a home.
Ooh good point re the first aid as well......if you're teaching you really MUST have an up to date first aid qualification. If someone did fall in a lesson & you were unable to render the correct assistance you would be liable.
Again if someone has had a life changing accident they're going to need the kind of long term financial support which could well bankrupt or lead to the loss of a home.
Zebedee
Well-Known Member
Re getting your AI....you can now just do the PTT without having to do the stages as well which speeds thing up, or the ABRS have teaching qualifications which are also fairly straightforward to obtain if you have the relevent experience / ability, which by the sound of it you do.