Do you think brussel sprouts help sarcoids

I have used the liverpool cream on my horses sarcoids in the past and it causes a lot of pain and swelling and can leave a bloody mess. Now if there was a treatment available without these adverse side effects, I would try it inspite of the snide comments on here!!
 
mjcssjw2 said:
I have used the liverpool cream on my horses sarcoids in the past and it causes a lot of pain and swelling and can leave a bloody mess. Now if there was a treatment available without these adverse side effects, I would try it inspite of the snide comments on here!!
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Presumably the 'snide comments' is aimed at me and I apologise if that's the impression made.

The point that I'm trying to make is that there are a number of scientifically validated means of treating sarcoids, that in my humble opinion should be considered rather than jumping onto non-scientific approaches picked up from the web or TV programmes. It may very well be that fluoride will turn out to be a logical approach to treating sarcoids and certainly if, in 10 years peer reviewed, clinical trials confirm this then I for one WILL be using Crest toothpaste to treat my horses.

In the meantime, however, there are many trialled means of treating sarcoids including immunotherapy, chemotherapy, cryotherapy and radiotherapy. Involving a vet in discussing and / or implementing the different means of treating different lesions makes sound sense and potentially increases the chances of a successful outcome in sarcoid treatment - BUT it is likely to cost considerably more than a tube of toothpaste.

I think that everyone needs to appreciate that there is a lot of middle ground in treating sarcoids between the Brussels sprouts and Liverpool cream approaches, and this hasn't really been touched on in this discussion.

So there you go - & only 1 slightly snide comment!
 
unfortunately the perfect treatment for most things doesn't exist, the liverpool cream seems to be haled as the gold standard and its nasty stuff resulting in some nasty ex sarcoid sites and nasty side effects along the way.
(Interestingly noticed the thread where laser had been used this morning - thought that looked promising)
If a better product was available then I would certainly try it, not that I am going to try some of the things that were tooted on this thread!
But some homeopathic remedies do have a place in medicine, even though the may not yet have peer reviewed clinical trials- everything has to start somewhere!

With regard to the cost, for me its the horses welfare that is paramount.

Also personally if my vet told me to jump of a bridge I wouldn't do it. Neither would I turn out my horse in exercise bandages (was worried about the rain, damp grass and then the buggers drying) as my vet recommended the other day! but still perhaps I am just odd! lol

To think someone somewhere thought it was a bright idea to put men on the moon, can you imagine what was said about that! lol
 
just been reading this thread with a vet and once we had stopped laughing, he actually said in all seriousness, don't mess about with them that long that there are a mess as they become increasingly difficult to treat!
 
homeopathic remedies (not to be confused with herbal etc) have no place in medicine but that is a completely different subject.
 
My vet has just spoken to me about treatment of my horse,s sarcoid with the crest toothpaste! He has spoken to other vets and the opinion is that the high fluoride content can kill the sarcoid cells it seems to work the same way as liverpool cream does, he also said like any treatment they don,t always work and the sarcoid may return or not but there is a risk it would return more aggressively!
He was pleased that it had worked for me and thought that this was definately something worth trying!
 
mjcssjw2 said:
just been reading this thread with a vet and once we had stopped laughing, he actually said in all seriousness, don't mess about with them that long that there are a mess as they become increasingly difficult to treat!
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Agree entirely - give the vet a chance in the first place.
One word of warning though, relating to an earlier point - if you don't want your horse to suffer pain / swelling/ a bloody mess as a result of sarcoid treatment, then think very carefully before you go for laser surgery.

Also worth mentioning that, again in my opinion, advise from Prof Knottenbelt rather than Liverpool cream should be the 'gold standard'. Prof K probably knows more about sarcoid therapy than anyone else in the UK , and certainly advises on several modes of therapy based on the type of sarcoid & the site - rather than just dispensing cream indiscriminately.
 
Keflavik said:
Agree entirely - give the vet a chance in the first place.
One word of warning though, relating to an earlier point - if you don't want your horse to suffer pain / swelling/ a bloody mess as a result of sarcoid treatment, then think very carefully before you go for laser surgery.

I haven't seen the laser treatment in life to be honest (thankfully), but the photos on the other thread the photo taken after treatment the site looked good. I would think laser surgery might be restricted by site, but again have no experience

Also worth mentioning that, again in my opinion, advise from Prof Knottenbelt rather than Liverpool cream should be the 'gold standard'. Prof K probably knows more about sarcoid therapy than anyone else in the UK , and certainly advises on several modes of therapy based on the type of sarcoid & the site - rather than just dispensing cream indiscriminately.
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I know its not dispensed willy nilly and Prof K is the 'expert' it was the dancing round naked that got me!! not a pretty sight esp if its me lol. In all seriousness I really dislike sarcoids and wonder whats caused the sudden upsurge, I am sure I didn't see the likes years ago.
 
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Liverpool dont just dispense cream, they merely firmulate a treatment plan, expertly, based on your own horse's photographs, for the VERY cheap price of about £14 at last look with a discount for charities.
Cream can then be reccomended as one of the treatments, as can many other treatments.
No Brainer.
why are you all arguing?
£14 is cheaper than a jar of codswallop from the horse shop.
 
So this Crest thing then ...


I am going to give it a go on my youngster who has just developed a tiny one on the inside of his leg and do a photo diary

For those who has success what sort of time frame are we talking ?

It has got to be worth a try - I have a mare who suffered from sarcoids Liverpool cream worked only as a temp measure and it came back like some demon character from a comic stronger and more angry !! She bust it on a leg strap so I tied it off with a plaiting band and not only did that one come off the one up in her groin lost all its powers and vanished too. This is at least 6 years ago now and they have never come back.

I would only say a method works if the problem goes away forever - not if it returns !
 
I used the Crest recently on a large sarcoid it took two weeks to work, I can,t say if it will return as it has only been gone a week but is healing nicely!
I think its a bit like liverpool cream and bloodroot sometimes it works and others not but the good thing is it wasn,t painful and didn,t cause any swelling
 
Its £14.40 for a sarcoid consultation googled at 7pm. cheaper if vat exempt and refundable on purchase of cream.
It really is cheap to find out the best plan of action.
However a vet would also be right to charge a visit fee, time to photograph, time to discuss with owner, time to upload photos and submit the form.
So this may be in some cases where an estimate of £150 is reached. Ask for an itemised estimate if you are unsure.

My point is that diagnosis is cheaper than trying unproven remedies and wasting time.
 
Liverpool cream treatment is expensive as the vet has to apply it, as it is not licensed for vet use per se, at least that used to be the case. So, if your vet is doing the right thing, he/she has to come out to apply it each time, so call out fees make up most of the cost. It is essentially topical chemotherapy - nasty heavy metals in it, dependent on what 'recipe' is thought to be appropriate, which is why it is painful and can leave nasty scars.
I used it once, and ot did get rid, but left a big sore and scar. I now leave alone, he has fewer as he gets older and the small pendulous ones drop out.
 
I have had cancer myself, (twice so far) and have to say I headed straight for the scientifically proved chemotherapy route, as nasty as the treatments sometimes were.

Therefore I went the same route for my horse and plumped for the Liverpool cream. Unfortunately until homeopathic or other complementary treatments are subject to full scientific review then I would not resort to them. So far the treatments for both her and I have been successful but if either of us need to repeat them then we will.

I also spent 15 years working for a well-known pharmaceutical company, and can confirm that other than colours and whiteners the composition of most toothpastes is nearly identical, containing silica, sodium bicarbonate, mint-oil, and flouride. I would no more put toothpaste on a sarcoid than on my own skin metatasis.
 
Really doubtful that brassicas or crest will work (except for producing farts and white teeth)but have tried Liverpool cream and it doesn't always work as Knottenbelt will readily agree.

Current Aussie vet. worked for 15 years with Prof K. and is an enthusiast for acycovir, based on an Austrian research paper. The paper suggests 69% success rate.

Used that on small new sarcoid on sheath with some success and am hopeful there will be no recurrence. It has some sense behind it as it is capable of killing the virus which causes warts and sarcoids.

Some horses in the paper had larger more mature sarcoids and they required debriding before application - which would frighten me in case it set the beastly things off growing. Still they reported regression in even in those cases.

I have used bcg on an eye sarcoid and that worked well - the sarcoid was very new when it was injected and it fell out in a month and did not recur.

It is, I think, a problem which is diverse in presentation and there is no single certain cure. One can only take the best veterinary advice and hope that one of the prescribed treatments works. If none of them do then it is down the greengrocers and the chemist or the homeopathist/faithhealer -nothing to lose by then - we are told that faith can move mountains...
 
My friend horse had a bad Sarcoid on her flank. She spent a fortune on global herbs remedies with no effect. The vet suggested Newmarket cream which worked brilliantly although with a little stress, must have stung.

My horse developed a nodule type Sarcoid about 2 weeks ago on the inside of her back leg. She is not ridden so thought I'd try some of the cheaper controversial remedies first. Didn't have to wait long, after 10 days of applying MARMITE to the Sarcoid it shrivelled up and has fallen off.

I can guarantee unusual suggestions DO work in some cases. My horse also loves the taste and a big blob off the end of my finger before hand took her mind off the application process.
 
use toothpaste like oral b has a high fluoride content, put a large amount on to sarcoid x 2 a day, do not wash off it dries and in doing so dries out the sarcoid which dies and shrivels off, there is another thread running at the moment in veterinary about it sounds like it is a good one
 
Get rid of sarcoids from inside out, the body is too acidic so make it alkaline, feed alkanize, then put crest toothpaste, aciclovir cold sore cream, or get the vet to subscribe liverpool cream no, not my choice though.
 
Always amuses me how irate people get about other people choosing to use alterantive and minimally invasive therapies/treatments on their horses,what's the problem??

Apart from the fact it's not their horse so unsure where they get off lecturing to the point of rudeness anyway:rolleyes:,what's the problem with giving things a try?? Am sure most people are sensible and wouldn't leave a horse in pain,or cause them more discomfort,so really fail to see an issue with trying other methods.

I have known of people for whom the toothpaste has worked and also human topical creams (fuciderm being one of them I *think*),it's not a myth I have seen it with my own eyes so who's to say on here that they definitely don't work?? Especially as most of the people making those comments are not qualified to make such a diagnosis or statement i'm guessing?? (not that minor details like that ever bother the know it alls on here IME;))

OP- Not sure about the brussel sprouts,can see your logic,but think maybe they would have an adverse effect on your horses digestion so perhaps not the best choice from that POV.
Great that you're giving the toothpaste a try,everything crossed that it works for you:)

For what it's worth and if you end up having to go down the more invasive treatment option,I have heard very good things about the bloodroot ointment.Cheaper I think than the LV cream,and more easily available from your vet AFAIK.
Also seen a good result with vet freezing off the sarcoid,think this depends on the type and location of the sarcoid though,but again worth asking your vet about maybe.

Good luck!!
 
I think the point about it is that people do actually care a bit about other people's horses and want them to do the best thing for them - that's a good thing I think.

My take on it would be that sarcoids become more difficult to treat the more times you try to treat them and fail, so it makes sense to try and get it right first time, otherwise you may end up not being able to get rid of them at all or even making them worse. (This comes from Prok K - recognised world expert on sarcoids). He also says that the fact that there are so many different treatments available kind of proves that there isn't one single cure.

I believe, along with many others on here, that the best form of attack on these things is to go for the best treatment first. Fluoride in toothpaste (and that's why it's Crest by the way as it has a high fluoride content - could also try Duraphat on Rx from dentist) is interesting and I believe that fluoride is one of the ingredients in Liverpool Cream. If it was the best treatment I suspect that Prof K would have it in his aresenal - but he doesn't. There is at least more science behind Crest than Marmite (could someone explain the science behind yeast extract helping?) Vitamin E and Aloe Vera and all the other healing things that have been suggested are definitely out in my mind becuase they promote healing ie promote cell growth - exactly the opposite of what you want to happen on a skin cancer!

If it's not a sarcoid then maybe they help. It costs £22 currently to send photos to Liverpool and have them advise you on their diagnosis and recommended course of action (taken from my November vet's bill). Worth it I would think to avoid potentially making things worse.......?
 
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