Don Index

[ferdimb]

I have just bought a foal by Don Index. Bar having the top score in his grading does anyone know anything else about him and if he is competing. Would also be interested to hear if any one has or knows anything about his offspring. Thanks

 

[Pendragon]

Don Index was awarded Premium title.
He is owned by the States Stud Celle.
A further competition record is, therefore, irrelevant. He was performance tested in Adelheidsdorf for 1 year - a real tough testing compared with the normal performance test requirements for Warmbloods in Germany.
Result list: http://landgestuetcelle.de/cms/upload/pdf/S25C-110101509290.pdf

There is not much to say about Don Index' offspring yet, because of their age. Foals of Don Index are highly regarded and priced at the auctions (auction in August: 1 foal for 22,000 Euros, 1 foal for 18,000 Euros).

 

[HBM1]

Don Index was awarded Premium title.
He is owned by the States Stud Celle.
A further competition record is, therefore, irrelevant.

It isn't irrelevant at all, if I buy a foal, I like to keep track of his sire's activities. What if no one ever asked and a sire had broken down at a very young age etc - obviously we all hope that they will go on to compete very well, but it is never an irrelevant question to ask at all - especially when someone pays out good money for one of their offspring.

 

[Pendragon]

Yes, it is irrelevant. There might be a misunderstanding as you seem not be aware of the system. The stallion is owned by the Celle States Stud. They are performance tested for one year to fully prove their ability. During covering season most of the stallions are sent to different stations all over Germany to be at service for the breeders. They return to the states stud for winter season, where their ability is then shown during the parades. They are fully trained and ridden up to highest level as to their abilities during winter season.

A stallion owned privately receives lifetime grading status after the 70-days performance test. Privately owned stallions are normally regularly competed for marketing and it is managable to produce them as to the annual schedules.

The first selection for a stallion to become a states stud stallion is done as a foal. The states stud reserves the optional right from a breeder to buy the stallion. This is very prestigious and already a sign of potential here in Germany.

 

[HBM1]

I am absolutely not questioning that the stallions are very well tested..what I am saying is that it is not irrelevant to ask about their ongoing competition records if you buy one of their offspring. as you say they do have competitive input in winter it would be good to hear about it. foal owners like to brag about their foal's sire too.

 

[Pendragon]

The system as described works very well. Reports are given in horse magazines and by the breed association. And the annual parades are booked out for up to five years in future.

Also, indexes and statistics are published annually.

I do understand that a foal owner loves to brag about the sire. A competition record the way you are used to with privately owned stallions just does not work with states stud stallions. And this is why I say it is irrelevant.

If there is a problem with me using this term then please explain.
But we can also go on discussing in German.

 

[sywell]

One needs to be aware of the vetting process for stallions which includes leg xrays inluding the stifle. As has been said the state stallions are all ridden regularly but do not compete a visit to the stallion parade at Celle in September is a real eye opener. At Warendorf I was watching 12 stallions being long reined from another stallion doing a musical ride. The roman chariots racing with 4 stallions is magic

 

[jamesmead]

Irrelevant? What incredible arrogance to suppose that once Celle has approved the animal nothing else matters!

So, basically these horses have to stay sound for just one year and never truly compete except in what is basically a grading; a comparison with their peers? And whatever happens after that is irrelevant?!!!

 

[Pendragon]

Sorry, but I have no idea, why you call this "incedible arrogance".

Please feel free to do some research on the system yourself. This might enlighten you.

 

[volatis]

What pendrgaon is saying is that the hanoverian State stud stallions are managed during their breeding careers is quite different to that of a privately owned stallions and therefore you cannot judge these stallions on their competiton records as they wont have one.
Instead they spend a year in what you could describe as very vigourous competiton, where they are assessed and marked, and if they successfully complete that they are used for breeding. They are obviously still kept in work and progressively trained. Their usefulness as a sire is then assessed on the success of their offspring in sport.

I know its a hard system for some people to get their heads round but remember not that long ago it was quite unusual to see so many stallions out competing. these days the competiton is so fierce that privately owned stallions have to go out and compete to be in the public eye.

 

[lindajones]

Apart from the Celle system of producing stallions ,what do people think of Don Index and his offspring so far ? He is on my short list of sires for next year and how easy is the Celle stud to deal with ? Any pics of Don Index babies please ?

 

[Pendragon]

I found some examples on youtube for you. Dams are different bloodlines. All look like fantastic movers in a good frame.
And as I already mentioned they seem to go at very good prices; so something for the market indeed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUtNl6yEiC4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujWyaiiEoeg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SgPOgM8nQhA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bSDugqqvOyc&feature=related

Celle should be easy to deal with. They are professionals handling more than 100 stallions.

 

[crabbymare]

Celle are very easy to deal with and ship semen all over the world they speak very good english so you can just ring or email them and they sort all the paperwork out for you. we have used them a few times in the past with no problems. If you want to see the things they do at the parades look at the pics from marrianne schwobel on facebook, they are all state stallions and moat have been out at stations for the stud season the temperaments are pretty good.