Downplate rice richardson trailer

[Thecogpit]

Anyone able to help with rice richardson queries? We have a 1975 trailer in pretty good condition. We want to have the weight downplated as we're converting it into a kitchen. It'll be around 700-750kg post conversion as equipment and materials very lightweight inside. The original weight currently is 600kg. Any ideas how we can down plate?

 

[I'm Dun]

You cant legally. Even if you could, to plate as less than 750kgs you need to have the brakes taken off which would be a whole load of faff and not worth the hassle or expense

 

[Thecogpit]

Ah OK. Thank you for the heads up. Probably a dumb question, but why would the brakes need to be taken off? It is a braked trailer. What if they would simply replate it at whatever it weighed in at the weighbridge when finally converted?

 

[conniegirl]

As far as im aware you don’t have to have brakes taken off as braked trailers under 750kgs are quite normal, most small caravans weigh under 750kgs
It is just that anything over 750kg’s has to be braked.

ETA i’m correct according to government website

 

[Thecogpit]

As far as im aware you don’t have to have brakes taken off as braked trailers under 750kgs are quite normal, most small caravans weigh under 750kgs
It is just that anything over 750kg’s has to be braked.

ETA i’m correct according to government website
View attachment 75812

Thank you very much for the info. The more I read the more confused I get. We are simply stripping out an old 1975 horse trailer and converting it to a mobile kitchen. There was no weight plate on it when we bought it. It will sadly never be used for horses again. Has new brakes fitted. It will be very light post conversion with the horse dividers and rubber flooring removed and light materials for the conversion used inside. You can lift and move the thing by hand it is that light. We just want it down plated so that it can be towed with a capable AWD vehicle on my B licence. My current car allows me to tow 1060kg (85% about 906kg) which it will definitely come in under if weighed on a weighbridge. It should be simple to arrange a downplate surely given its usage will be changing? As it has no plate we looked at the tyres they say 104/102r. If I'm right as there are two tyres either side that would be 900kgs per tyre for this trailers load rating ...3600kgs!!! So if I can't get this trailer, which I can move with my hand downplated I'm going to have to pay £600 for a B+E license??? Doesn't make any sense. It's never ever ever going to have that much weight in it. A griddle is 55kg, a fryer 36kg, a saucepan 2kg, even a small mini oven is only 68kg!!! It's gonna be hard pushed to be over 800kgs when complete. Any advice would be appreciated that's for sure. Could we change its use, just like folks who convert a transit van to a camper? Then re plate? Like I said, I'm bemused and confused by it all.

 

[I'm Dun]

No, you cant unfortunately as the manufacturer is out of business and has been for some years. If the original plate is missing then you are correct regarding the tyres. There are other trailers that can be downplated, but not Rice.

 

[Thecogpit]

No, you cant unfortunately as the manufacturer is out of business and has been for some years. If the original plate is missing then you are correct regarding the tyres. There are other trailers that can be downplated, but not Rice.

Urgh, that's very frustrating. Thank you so much for getting back to me. I was informed I could contact Richardson trailers as they took over rice richardson or ifor williams and either could do this legally for me. So, yet again, sometimes it doesn't pay to read too many forums as you get conflicting information. I have contacted the DVLA, ifor and Richardson trailers to get this in writing from 'the horses mouth' so to speak.

 

[Renvers]

Thank you very much for the info. The more I read the more confused I get. We are simply stripping out an old 1975 horse trailer and converting it to a mobile kitchen. There was no weight plate on it when we bought it. It will sadly never be used for horses again. Has new brakes fitted. It will be very light post conversion with the horse dividers and rubber flooring removed and light materials for the conversion used inside. You can lift and move the thing by hand it is that light. We just want it down plated so that it can be towed with a capable AWD vehicle on my B licence. My current car allows me to tow 1060kg (85% about 906kg) which it will definitely come in under if weighed on a weighbridge. It should be simple to arrange a downplate surely given its usage will be changing? As it has no plate we looked at the tyres they say 104/102r. If I'm right as there are two tyres either side that would be 900kgs per tyre for this trailers load rating ...3600kgs!!! So if I can't get this trailer, which I can move with my hand downplated I'm going to have to pay £600 for a B+E license??? Doesn't make any sense. It's never ever ever going to have that much weight in it. A griddle is 55kg, a fryer 36kg, a saucepan 2kg, even a small mini oven is only 68kg!!! It's gonna be hard pushed to be over 800kgs when complete. Any advice would be appreciated that's for sure. Could we change its use, just like folks who convert a transit van to a camper? Then re plate? Like I said, I'm bemused and confused by it all.

Tagging @ROG who is our HHO Towing Guru who can probably give you the best advice. But I think you are over complicating some of your calculations. I have never heard of trailer tyres adding 900kg each to your weight considerations.

If there is no plate I would take it to a weigh bridge and find out the weight and if it weighs less than 1060kg you have your first step. Your 85% figure is moot, that seems to be something that the Caravan Club gave as advice to new caravanners and isn't set in stone, partly because a trailer is a twin axle and therefore a steadier thing to tow as a beginner than a single axle caravan.

 

[Tiddlypom]

My current car allows me to tow 1060kg (85% about 906kg) which it will definitely come in under if weighed on a weighbridge.

What car is this? That's a very low tow limit.

An empty horse trailer often bounces about, I wouldn't tow one with a lightweight car. Son's gutless Clio can tow 1200kg, but it would be lethal to tow our 1000kg Ifor horse trailer with a few bales of shavings in, the car would get bounced about all over the place.

 

[Thecogpit]

I'm getting a new car anyway so isn't an issue. No towbar fitted on the 1.3l (63 plate) eco vauxhall astra car, so going to struggle to get it to a weighbridge lol. And even if I had a towbar and took it to the weighbridge, what if the police stopped me half way and I wasn't legal to tow it lol.. lots of dodgy lanes round here.. but on a serious note, I'm getting a 1.8l vehicle in Sept once conversion completed to tow it so that's not really the issue.

 

[honetpot]

I have a Rice trailer and I have owned a mobile kitchen, eg a catering trailer, which was purpose built, and I think that you are underestimating the amount of kit and fittings you have to carry.
Selling or cooking food and you have to carry water, for handwashing and to make your hot drinks. A light weight trailer, depending on the make, is about 7.60-800kg, if you have bought a vintage trailer the only way to make it lighter is perhaps, is to replace the metal sides with lighter board, but your equipment inside can and will move if you are not careful and go out through the side. You also have problem in how you balance the load.
You need a bigger tow car, I would go for something like a people carrier, as they have loads of space for carrying stock, equipment. I wouldn't spend a lot of money on doing up a trailer, the hardest part is finding a place to sell from, and depending on what you sell it will not make a lot of money.

 

[ROG]

With no weight plate then the total of all the tyre load ratings are taken as the MAM

How many tyres does it have and what are the load ratings on those tyres?

 

[Thecogpit]

I have a Rice trailer and I have owned a mobile kitchen, eg a catering trailer, which was purpose built, and I think that you are underestimating the amount of kit and fittings you have to carry.
Selling or cooking food and you have to carry water, for handwashing and to make your hot drinks. A light weight trailer, depending on the make, is about 7.60-800kg, if you have bought a vintage trailer the only way to make it lighter is perhaps, is to replace the metal sides with lighter board, but your equipment inside can and will move if you are not careful and go out through the side. You also have problem in how you balance the load.
You need a bigger tow car, I would go for something like a people carrier, as they have loads of space for carrying stock, equipment. I wouldn't spend a lot of money on doing up a trailer, the hardest part is finding a place to sell from, and depending on what you sell it will not make a lot of money.

No drinks as next to coffee trailer. At cying and sporting events so foot traffic not an issue. Griddle is 30kg, fridge is 48kg, baine marie 12kg, materials come in at 98kgs, sink is 9kgs, water is carried in car whilst driving.... then just

With no weight plate then the total of all the tyre load ratings are taken as the MAM

How many tyres does it have and what are the load ratings on those tyres?

They say 104/102r which is ridiculous as I think that's load each of 850kgs!!!....as that would mean with 4 tyres = 3400kgs lol. These aren't original tyres and I've no info about what would've been on there in 1975

 

[Thecogpit]

Plus with a kitchen inside there will never be an option for that weight capacity to be reached as no horse will fit

 

[Thecogpit]

Tyres say 105/70R15C 104/102R

 

[Thecogpit]

Was looking at 2.2ltr 2012 Antara ....
GTW 4205
MAM 2505
WHICH MEANS 1700KG TOW CAPACITY
Trailer only 650kg now, when turned into kitchen by physical alteration it'll be less than 1000kg. It is braked and tows lovely behind a 2ltr kia sportage like a dream, no rocking, no tipping, follows behind perfectly moving with the car. So Antara would be fine and it's 2.2ltr. Just literally that annoying towing MAM that throws everything out because it'll never be carrying horses again.

 

[I'm Dun]

Tyres say 105/70R15C 104/102R

Those look like the tyres it would have had originally to me. Ive replaced tyres that size on one.

There are trailers that you could have gotten that would have been able to be downplated. This isnt one of them sadly. If it is very important to you, then perhaps sell this one and get something more suitable. The market is fairly buoyant at the minute so you shouldnt lose money.

 

[fredflop]

Is it a single trailer? I have a rice trailer of a similar age, and it weighs considerably more than 600kg. I’ve had it on a weighbridge

 

[Tiddlypom]

The OP has put pics up on another thread. It's a twin axle front unload trailer, probably a Europa or a Beaufort.

I would think that it is later than 1975 as it has a split partition, and they came in later. Older ones had solid partitions. It certainly weighs a lot more than 600 or 650kg, or would have when new.

The problem I think is that the OP wants it to be downplated, but because Rice/Richardson are defunct and can't authorise it that can't legally happen.

 

[Thecogpit]

The OP has put pics up on another thread. It's a twin axle front unload trailer, probably a Europa or a Beaufort.

I would think that it is later than 1975 as it has a split partition, and they came in later. Older ones had solid partitions. It certainly weighs a lot more than 600 or 650kg, or would have when new.

The problem I think is that the OP wants it to be downplated, but because Rice/Richardson are defunct and can't authorise it that can't legally happen.

And we are changing its function from horse carriage to kitchen

 

[Tiddlypom]

And we are changing its function from horse carriage to kitchen

But what you intend to put in it has no relevance to the legalities around down plating it and towing with a B licence.

 

[honetpot]

No drinks as next to coffee trailer. At cying and sporting events so foot traffic not an issue. Griddle is 30kg, fridge is 48kg, baine marie 12kg, materials come in at 98kgs, sink is 9kgs, water is carried in car whilst driving.... then just

Been there done, that and my comments are still the same. There are lots of 'converted' ones on eBay, and the only good thing I can say is they have increased the value of my very old Rice.
If you are making money, you have to carry a lot of stock, and be very quick or have enough prepped to sell.
Some of the best I have seen advertised are based on the larger old Rice Badminton, which is the biggest of the old ones, but you are always stuck with the width. https://www.facebook.com/thompsonca...KJO5_bk0v81CyPiSH6n9o6m2m_Tq0tyCyICCXt5NG7b3s.

 

[Thecogpit]

Been there done, that and my comments are still the same. There are lots of 'converted' ones on eBay, and the only good thing I can say is they have increased the value of my very old Rice.
If you are making money, you have to carry a lot of stock, and be very quick or have enough prepped to sell.
Some of the best I have seen advertised are based on the larger old Rice Badminton, which is the biggest of the old ones, but you are always stuck with the width. https://www.facebook.com/thompsonca...KJO5_bk0v81CyPiSH6n9o6m2m_Tq0tyCyICCXt5NG7b3s.

My husband has been a chef for years and we've sold food traveling the world, on that front since we will will be attending prepaid sporting events where average foot traffic is 1,000 - 20,000 people, we really will be fine. My question isn't about whether a house trailer business will or will not be a success, it is about weights and weights alone. Thanks for the heads up though, but honestly we've got 16 events for 2022 already lined up and aren't looking for a massive profit since we're doing this for fun and to meet other sporty folk. Also nice for our kids to see something being transformed.

 

[I'm Dun]

If its a Beaufort/Europa style you have the weight wrong. They come in at around 1000kgs. Even with the partition and fittings out you arent going to get that much below 850kgs, then the addition of the cooking things, your going to be back well over 1000kgs again. Dont forget you have the weight of the stock and other bits and pieces and I'm assuming some sort of generator.

There just isnt any way to legally tow it without taking a towing test.

 

[honetpot]

This website gives you most of the weights of the Rice trailers, I have an older Europer, and I think it's slightly lighter.
http://www.horsetrailersales.co.uk/RiceIndex.asp

The tyres on horse trailers are usually heavy duty, because they need to go over rough terrain, you can also get blow outs as when they are loaded with a horse they warm up quickly. I had a 2,500 GW trailer for catering, and you need a good tyre, not only for towing on the road but also for field sites. What ever griddle you use I would recommend using two gas bottles in tandem, it keeps the pressure up, so things cook quicker, you will need a specialist catering gas check.