Dressage - Am I Imagining Things? (In CR Too)

[QueenOfCadence]

So I rode a dressage show today on my palomino fluffball and came 2nd (which I'm pleased with!). Anyway, I felt my test was marked a bit stricter than the tests of the other competitors and I'm not sure if I'm just imagining it or if it's possible. Basically what I want to know is do you guys think it's possible that because my horse is 14.2hh, palomino and extremely fluffy (just like you'd imagine a pony to be) that he'd be marked stricter than say a 17hh WB that rode a similar test?

Anybody else on an unlikely dressage horse ever feel this way?

I didn't feel that is was the case in Novice and Prelim but I've been suspecting that my ponio has a disadvantage because of his looks for quite a while in Elementary. Am I imagining things?

Sorry if this is a silly question to ask ^_^ (also not saying that the horse that beat me didn't deserve it, as I did think that her test was better than mine - just wondering point wise)

 

[NightOwl]

I don't really do much dressage to myself but surely if you came 2nd and felt you were being judged stricter then the others then its something to be proud of? I would be! What makes you think that anyway?

 

[*hic*]

It won't be his looks it will be his paces. I watched a masterclass given by Owen Moore with Phoebe Buckley riding Frostie (Little Tiger) as was pointed out then Frostie was trying her heart out in a discipline she's not really built for but a downhill 15hh(measured generously) TB is never going to look as extravagant as a big warmblood. So although Frostie was showing correct extension in proportion to her size it just looked rather poor compared to the big boys.

With my own small grey AA mare I found judges either loved or hated her and on my big bay mare I've had the embarrassment of being beaten by a nearly 13hh grey Welsh Section A type pony with a very small adult riding, it was going in a manufactured outline the whole time but looked cute whereas my big ugly girl was correct but absolutely NOT cute!

I'm afraid dressage is subjective!

 

[Booboos]

Well done, sounds like you did very well!

I don't know what it's like in South Africa, but my experience in the UK is that on the whole judges are very pleased to see a correctly schooled pony. My former trainer in the UK brings on German ponies to FEI level and then sells them on to kids and neither she nor the children who buy the ponies have any problems winning with generous scores. One of her clients was Reserve Novice National Champion and has since qualified for the Nationals at Elementary and now the Regionals at Medium, all at the tender age of 11 so it can be done!!

Oh just remembered that I used to get thoroughly beaten by another teenager on a Welsh pony who went on to be Elem National Champion, so it can be done twice!

 

[QueenOfCadence]

Probably that. He has a MASSIVE extended trot - but generally his canter and walk are poor compared to WBs. He's built quite uphill as he was bred to be a dressage/showing pony. He's in Juniors so looks like a midget against the rest of the horses ^_^. Thanx for the input so far guys - saw a video of the test and thought everything looked quite good!

I'm pleased with the second - but only got 52% (YIKES!). So either the judges were marking very strictly today or we're just a very poor group of Junior Elementary riders

 

[Littlelegs]

I've never had it. Jumpings more my thing but I've done a fair bit of it with mine as training. And mostly bd as used to take her with work. We did a handful of medium but mainly successful at elementary, more from lack of interest in pure dressage than marking though. She's a 14.2 connie x tb with paces that are pretty workers paces, rather than floating wb ones. But I don't feel she or I ever lost a single mark because of it if I'm honest. A purpose bred horse might naturally produce extended trot easier than her, but if hers was most correct on the day, she invariably got the marks. And collection has always come very easily to her. Plus the majority thought it was nice to see a well schooled pony. It's really only since others have mentioned possible bias I have ever considered it as I never saw it as an issue. My boss, & other similarly qualified people believed with training any horse could succeed up to advanced, only then would natural paces cause a problem.

 

[floradora09]

Well done on the good result If you came 2nd on 52% what did the others get?!

Would agree about paces, even if he is very correct, bigger 'dressage horses' are just totally built for it and make a much more uphill picture and the movements look easier. Some are just more capable of performing the movements better- might not be your case but it's really hard to get a nice med trot out of my boy as he's not a big mover and isn't build so 'uphill' and has a tendancy to plough down and get long.

 

[QueenOfCadence]

Well done on the good result If you came 2nd on 52% what did the others get?!
.

3rd place was 51% and it all went downhill from there . First place was won by the sexiest bay WB stallion I've ever seen with 60% (which is why I mentioned that I do think that they deserved to win).

My boy's lateral work and collection is hard - but he has a nice open shoulder and I'm getting better with keeping him very engaged(which is what use to be the problem with his Med Trot - he'd have an amazing shoulder but trail behind).

Maybe the judge was just being very strict and I was imagining things. Or I REALLY need to slot in more lessons every week

 

[Littlelegs]

I suppose if its what you do primarily you analyse more really. Because I wasn't concerned by placings, just marks its a lot easier to have an outside view. But ime some judges do mark every one harder than others do.

 

[MiCsarah]

I have a 14.2 and have never felt like ive been marked differently. Your obviously feelng a little fussy if your worried about being marked differently but still coming 2nd. Fair enough if you were way under marked from the others

 

[Miss L Toe]

Well done, sounds like you did very well!

I don't know what it's like in South Africa, but my experience in the UK is that on the whole judges are very pleased to see a correctly schooled pony. My former trainer in the UK brings on German ponies to FEI level and then sells them on to kids and neither she nor the children who buy the ponies have any problems winning with generous scores. One of her clients was Reserve Novice National Champion and has since qualified for the Nationals at Elementary and now the Regionals at Medium, all at the tender age of 11 so it can be done!!

Oh just remembered that I used to get thoroughly beaten by another teenager on a Welsh pony who went on to be Elem National Champion, so it can be done twice!

These German dressage ponies [forgotten the breed] have suberb action, and are not comparable to UK native ponies, they can reach £200K to the right home! i assume they have their own classes and are not in with the horses.

 

[Booboos]

They do not have their own classes at all! These were normal BD classes and the normal Regionals and Nationals. The 11 year old was reserve National Champion Restricted against everyone else who qualified that year, which I would assume was mainly adults on horses as there are far more adults on horses around than anything else.

I also happen to know the prices they were bought for unbroken and the prices they sell for as FEI potential 2-3 years down the line and they are very sensible prices for competition ponies. 200k is beyond ridiculous and nothing like the actual prices.

The Welsh was bred by the family's Welsh stud - coincidentally he was also for sale after his win at the Nationals and his asking price was nowhere near 200k!

 

[peaceandquiet1]

OP I ride an Arab and I do feel sometimes that we are at a disadvantage but it makes it all the sweeter when we do well...... Depends on the judge and their inherent prejudices. I have been judged by a listed judge at an unaffiliated show that we should affiliate although "some judges might not like Arabs." This judge has Arabs herself so understands them and enjoys judging them!

 

[misterjinglejay]

When my floofy palomino sec D was out competing at med advanced (not with me, I hasten to add ), he would get marked down for his extensions - or lack of them! But would get high marks for collection and uphilliness (invented a new word!).

I think most judges are pleased to see natives out there with the warmbloods.

 

[Flicker51]

I think it all depends on the judge tbh. My daughters fluffy cob is exceptionally well schooled and does a very accurate test but some judges love him and others assume he's a 6 for everything and don't look to closely ! unaffiliated is usually ok but affiliated judges can be very dismissive. I think it is a rare cob who does really well from elem onwards.

 

[Miss L Toe]

They do not have their own classes at all! These were normal BD classes and the normal Regionals and Nationals. The 11 year old was reserve National Champion Restricted against everyone else who qualified that year, which I would assume was mainly adults on horses as there are far more adults on horses around than anything else.

I also happen to know the prices they were bought for unbroken and the prices they sell for as FEI potential 2-3 years down the line and they are very sensible prices for competition ponies. 200k is beyond ridiculous and nothing like the actual prices.

The Welsh was bred by the family's Welsh stud - coincidentally he was also for sale after his win at the Nationals and his asking price was nowhere near 200k!

I mean in Germany the dressage ponies are a whole different ball game, I have seen one who was sent to to a top English yard for schooling, that is where I was told the prices they reach.