Dressage Judge comments

[Lvrees]

I did a dressage comp today, its the first I've done in a very long time, but seeming as we had a disastrous showing show last week I thought some comments from a judge would be good, also it would be good to work towards.

So first test I got 65% and a 6th out of about 15, which I was pleased with untill I read the sheet, she basically didnt say anything good about him, she said he had "3 fair paces" and that the contact needed to be stiller, ok fair enough, so what can I do to improve them? (thats a retorical question) so I thought right, next test, got 61% and again the sheet was basically blank apart from a few comments saying "hollow" and "not straight" and at the bottom it said "need to use more half halts". Now I'm not asking for an essay or a step by step guide to improving my horse, but there was no encouraging or guiding comments at all, so basically out of today I got nothing!!! It was nice to do something different, but I was annoyed with the comments or lack of them, surely she could at least say weldone!!

As I have said I havent done dressage for a year so am not sure if things are still as they were and judges still made nice comments as well as negative ones!

Discuss!!

 

[MistletoeMegan]

"Needs to use more half halts" is a pretty guiding comment for some judges to make, a lot will just write "unbalanced" etc instead.

It varies judge to judge on what they write - some are very helpful and provide suggestions, but there are others who don't write anything at all (I mean literally, not a single word)

 

[Sunny_Star]

Quite often you get no positive comments from judges, as they are under pressure to analyse you and the horse in a short space of time so if they were to say give you a 6 for a movement then they would want to justify why, so are more likely to focus on what didn't make it say a 9, if you get what I mean..

It can be a bit dis-heartining when you get few or no positive comments, however I just deal with it and take all the comments (good or bad) on board.

 

[GDB]

'Well done' can be a little patronising tho.... but yes a few nice comments wouldnt go amiss. I try to give the positive before the negative with a few words on where things need improvement. We are not there to give a lesson tho..

 

[Partoow]

its a critical sport so you go in the arena to be criticed.
true, that can be constructive and thats what you got. 'Use more half halts' , 'need more straightness.' take this to your instructor and she should be able to guide you through what this actually means with reference to the scales of training.
a judge will be there for hours watching the same test, she has a time scale on which she has to keep and therefore getting to the point is the best she can do.
as Hils says she cant give a riding lesson [although god knows there is many a time i would like to]
When you get a 6 and a comment she is letting you know the reason it did not get higher and that she thought there was hope for you to get more.
it is not a judges job to blow sunshine up your bottom but to make a critical appraisal of your training at that moment in time with reference to the 'scales of training'.
as for 'fair paces' then i guess it was a 6 and that is exactly what a 6 is .
You should be pleased with the mark if you are rusty but now be aware that there are some basic training errors that you need to work on.

 

[Tiffany]

I agree with others that all judges are different. Also, it's also about how you interpret their comments.

For me use more half halts would mean needs balancing. Fair paces could mean needs more activity? What about getting someone to video you rding your test then you can see for your self how you ride and how your horse goes.
Don't be disheartened, you went and did your best and I'm sure you know yourself where you can improve for next time.
I always try and remember, it's supposed to be fun.

 

[TableDancer]

FWIW, I prefer getting a few comments tailored to me like you did than what many judges seem to do nowadays which is simply underline certain words in the collectives description - this is a complete cop-out IMO and smacks of laziness. It is a relatively new fashion - 5-10 years ago judges bothered to write something themselves. I used to judge abroad and always tried to write one positive thing on each sheet - I guess it can be seen as patronising, but (back to speaking as a rider) it's encouraging to see something nice on what is essentially, and in this at least I agree with Partoow, a critique.

 

[Lvrees]

I just think things have changed, I've always received sheets with good things on there too. I did have the test filmed for me and am not disputing the judge's marks I just think there where the judge writes at the bottom I'm used to having more than a line! Normally, a few lines, not one. I know shes not there to instruct me, many moons back dressage was my main sport so I'm not being naive I just think the way the sheets are filled in now has changed, Or may be it was just that judge!!

 

[loobylu]

I agree. Apparently that is how young judges are trained now, I spoke to a girl a few weeks ago and she said that they are encouraged to underline the elements that need work rather than write it out. I feel a little cheated with an empty sheet but I presume it is to put more emphasis on the scales of training?

 

[Three]

I'm easily confused

I had always thought an underlined bit meant something to work on but today 'desire to move forward' was underlined but in the comments the judge wrote 'well forwards'.

 

[GDB]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree. Apparently that is how young judges are trained now, I spoke to a girl a few weeks ago and she said that they are encouraged to underline the elements that need work rather than write it out. I feel a little cheated with an empty sheet but I presume it is to put more emphasis on the scales of training?

[/ QUOTE ]

I have to disagree with the above. Yes Judges are now encouraged to underline the salient points on the list of required elements within a movement, but should still accompany that with a positive or negative comment. Most certainly on a mark of 5 or under there MUST be a comment of some sort.. 6 or above doesnt require an explanation, but its always helpful ....

 

[GDB]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm easily confused

I had always thought an underlined bit meant something to work on but today 'desire to move forward' was underlined but in the comments the judge wrote 'well forwards'.

[/ QUOTE ]


No NO No.... the underlining of a word or words, whether it be in the scale of training or in the collectives doesnt always have to be a negative assessment...

 

[TarrSteps]

Hils and partoow have given you the view from the other side of C. I think it is different now - days are longer, more entries, more shows, higher standards - and judges tend to be quicker and more to the point.

I have to say I've seen more "positive" comments on crap tests! If it's all pretty wretched judges seem to feel they need to be encouraging and sympathetic, looking for something nice to say amidst the carnage. Having done some judging (and a lot of scribing) myself, I know if you've had nothing but dispairing things to say it's almost human nature to want to say something nice! Quite frankly, one feels sorry for the rider by that point!

If the test goes well, though, judges tend to think the rider knows they're on the right track (or they should from the marks!) and concentrate on the reasons they didn't give a higher score, assuming the rider will go away and work on those weaknesses to improve. Encouragement is all well and good but I want to know what I did wrong.

It's easy to forget tests are meant to assess training, not just to give marks for the tricks on the day. Anything that shows the judge a "hole" in the training is reason for comment, especially if it pertains to the fundamentals. The next level up is to comment on "test riding" and tell people where they could improve or make up marks in specific instances. Essentially you want the judge to give you the information - in the limited time available to them - to improve for the next outing, not just to make you feel okay about the current one. (If you get a 90-something score, then that might be a bit different.) What I find most annoying are a bunch of 6's with no comments on how to do better - that speaks to me of "playing it safe" and lack of conviction on the judges' part.

 

[Three]

Ah! light dawns. Thanks Hils - thought it seemed odd.

 

[GDB]

I agree in the most part to what you are saying. Giving a 6 isnt always playing it safe, although it can be seen as 'sitting on the fence'. So very often a movement isnt quite good enough to be a 7 (fairly good) but definately not a 5.. Until we have half marks ( heaven help those poor scorers) we do have to adjust our marks to show the true quality of the test before us and as you will know, esp at Horse trials, we have very little time to come to our conclusion...it is for me, certainly, exactly how I see that movement develop before me and is a considered and honest mark...
Just to deviate rather a lot.. I spent many a happy childhood holiday playing in the water at Tarr Steps!

 

[TarrSteps]

It's a lovely place!

Oh, I've nothing against 6's! It's just a bit frustrating to have a test full of average marks without comments on how to make them better. My personal experience has been I've got more out - education wise - of the tests where the marks ranged more widely and the comments, however, light, targeted why some moments are better than others. I find it frustrating to get the same mark - usually a 5 or a 6 - with one movement getting a negative comment and the other not, or, even worse, what seem to be completely opposite comments. It seems like some judges do a "good 6" and a "bad 6" but at the end of the day this means nothing.

Sometimes the test is average and likely deserves a bunch of average marks. But it seems often in that case there is something fundamental that should be improved, such as engagement or straightness or consistency. In such cases, rather than sounding like a broken record, the judge really does only have to comment once, applying the comment to the whole test.

Interesting comment about the underlying drawing attention to the point, not being negative. I would bet MOST competitors see it as being only an implied negative comment . . . perhaps another example of riders not always understading the judging process!

 

[Alibear]

on the lack of comments bit, it is also not always the judge, sometimes the scribe or the filler in for the scribe can't keep up with comments so the judge just concentrates on getting the right scores down.