EPSM am I a hypochondriac mum?

[1CTrenowath]

This could get long so bear with me.... I am looking for peoples thoughts I guess and to hear if any of this rings bells as epsm or anything else....
17.1 ID gelding whom I have owned since he was 2 - now 14. As a foal had foal scour - was on a drip at some point and as a youngster was intolerant to molassed feed apparently. He has always had problems cantering which with his size and lack of balance (took him a loooong time to realise he wasn't supposed to be dragging himself along with the front end...) wasn't a huge surprise, but he still has issues and goes disunited on left lead (and fell over in the school last year on this lead!!)

5 years ago he had an *ahem* incident in a horse box -ie over the breast bar and out the personel door of a Renault master.

.... at one point hanging from a stifle off the breast bar whilst front end lay on floor (grazing ! yes hes an ID!!

). Ever since has had problems with hind end which about a year after above incident showed itself as a 'snatch and bang' step when first coming out of the stable in the morning, also started to show signs of stifles not locking which got better on shoeing with heel wedges and lots of schooling to strengthen the area, but still poor. He doesn't like downhill work (and by hill I mean even the teensiest Norfolk slope) He fails to build much top line despite my and my instructors best efforts (think scary dressage type but brilliant!). When in work he also has mega sensitive quarters when grooming to the extent he leans into it and almost falls over towards the pressure.
And now he has been off for some months due to coffin joint problems, we have patchy sweating and twice this winter has shown what to begin with I thought were colicky signs, but actually seemed like he just wanted to lie down (full haynet rejected to do so!!!!). He has also since this lay off become very unhappy when rugged - this may just be 'cos he gets hot , but I would say this was out of character. So am I paranoid? Would welcome all thoughts on this, so don't be shy in letting me know if you think I am mad, paranoid mum!

Thank you and have a cuppa if you actually read all this - you deserve it!

 

[AmyMay]

First thing that actually springs to mind is, is he a wobbler??

 

[lillie07]

Thats what went through my mind as I read through...

 

[1CTrenowath]

[ QUOTE ]
First thing that actually springs to mind is, is he a wobbler??

[/ QUOTE ]
Luckily no - day to day he is okay ie. gaits basically ok etc, just has trouble mainly when stopping, starting when his back end doesn't quite lock when required...... Now my old boy is a wobbler these days..... not got a clue where his back feet should be if you try and pick them up......bless!

 

[Patches]

Has he had his back checked recently or since the accident?

My horse has mild stringhalt and snatches her legs a bit as she walks out of the stable. She also drags her hind toes and has a stiff gait. She used to hate walking downhill and would either stop dead, or go down leg yielding.

I had an Osteopath out to her two weeks ago who confirmed she had a chronic (long standing) back problem behind the saddle and over the sacro-illiac region. After just one session she's been greatly improved. The toe dragging has all but stopped and she walks downhills (and by that I mean steep hills) as though they aren't there!

Of course, I'm sure pain in the sacro-illiac region wouldn't account for your horse falling over in the school. Has your horse ever tied up?

 

[1CTrenowath]

Stringhalt was considered - should have mentioned he went to Rossdales when the funny stepping first came up, who couldn't find an explanation, was eventually reported as 'possible' upward fixation and non-locking stifle type problem, but nothing conclusive . He has his back done by both a chiropractor and physio regularly, and has his saddle checked annually. The falling over in the school was very much a case of back end gave way and did a tom & jerry style splat on our sides - thank god for sand or my leg would be v flat now!!!

 

[sqippa]

The fact he started symptoms after his box incident would push me more in the direction that something happened then which is affecting him. Having said that the more recent developments could be something separate!?!?!
Have a look on www.ruralheritage.com and look up Vet clinic then EPSM pages (there are loads) see if anything clicks. Can't really think what else to suggest. Isn't it irritating when despite all your best efforts you can't really get a diagnosis!

Sqip

 

[beaconhorse]

hi

Firstly I apologise if this does not make sense and for any mistakes, but I am in a rush and don't have time to check it

Well it is easy to find out. You may be aware my horse has EPSM he was eventually diagnosed with a muscle biopsy which I had sent to Dr beth (rural heritage) to diagnose for me.
He also had similar problems on the left rein in canter including falling over.

Personally I think you have NOTHING to lose and possibly everything to gain from trying the diet, especially being an ID he is more likely to have EPSM than some other breeds
The things that strike me most with me about your horse are

Not able to build top line, this is not normally the case with ID's (is it?)
Canter problems
Snatching hinds
You need to avoid ALL feeds with starch and too much sugar and start adding oil to his feed. This has to be done gradually but also as quick as you feel you can. My horse is around 550kg and he gets 550ml oil everyday I also feed saracens releve and alfa a, along with baileys stud balancer.

In the early days I was still struggling to build top line so also fed bailey Ulitmate finish which is very expensive at £30 a bag BUT worked when nothing else would!

You may or may not have to restrict grass intake too.

Personally I would get on this ASAP as otherwise you will find it VERY difficult once the grass starts coming thro to know if it is really helping (may already be too late, unless you also restrict grass intake)

Tradtionally it is best to turn out 24/7 with restricted grazing BUT my own horse is in at night all winter and one or two days a week in summer, as he gets tired without proper sleep (bless him)
If you want to see nearly 2 years on how he has changed look in lounge at thread 'Free to worst home only' lol

This is a horse that got so bad he could hardly trot!!

 

[1CTrenowath]

Thanks Beaconhorse, I am really glad to hear your horse has been turned around by finding out the cause of his problems.
I have taken the plunge 7 days ago to feed him according to EPSM rules, and whilst I may be imagining it, I already seem to have a happier, dare I say it soppier hoss. Not sure how quickly any signs should/will show, as he is on no hard feed anyway other than Alfa a oil and speedibeet.... He has noticeably lost his podgy belly look (the 'in foal' look has gone

), so we shall see. I basically posted for further views as still think I may be paranoid, but having drawn a blank from vets, chiros etc. as far as explaining why he is not a happy boy a lot of the time, figure its definitely worth a shot. Fingers crossed!

 

[trishachapman]

Hi
I can really sympathise - I went down a similar route with my Irish D - very strange hind leg action especially on a deep surface, difficulty in canter, stumbling and falling over, sensitive with rugs, (the grazing bit made me really laugh - soooo true!!) I went down the long road of Newmarket, back people, new saddle etc and drew a blank each time (foot balance, wobbler, stringhalt, bridle lame - you name it, it was suggested!) until my instructor told me about an article she had read. I googled EPSM and found the Rural Heritage website with Dr Beth Valentine and the high oil low starch/sugar diet + regular exercise. It really does work and gave me new hope. I used to feed ultimate finish (which is rice bran) but Baileys stopped doing it. I have just discovered that Saracen EquiJewel is also a rice bran feed, I have just started using that. If you phone the nutritionalist at Saracen horse feeds she is very helpful and they are knowlegable on the EPSM diet - but check out the rural heritage website - the info there is very encouraging. My vet is also coming out to do some acupuncture which she says is also very beneficial. Good luck, there are a lot of us out here with EPSM horses! Trisha