Equine college - I'm appalled

[TandD]

I was speaking to a lovely lady today about her experience at a well known equine college. She is currently on her 2nd year of the level 3 (nvq?) qualification and also completed the year for the level 2 (nvq?). So overall she has almost spent 3 years at this college.

however she has only done the bhs stage 1 care and is currently 'training' for her riding (although by what she said there doesn't seem to be much decent training towards it!). She has never taken it before, so it's not like she has failed and had to take a whole year before re-taking!

i am just shocked that even though she has spent 3 years at this college she is yet to complete one bhs stage. This has to be a massive failing on the part of the college?!? Even if someone isn't the 'brightest bulb in the box' the college should surely work with them to make sure they keep up with the rest and achieve all they can. I would have thought that this lady would leave with at least stage 2 if not 3 as I thought they ran along side the nvq qualification? I did stage 1 and 2, plus r&r all within 6 months! I think I can get stage 4 care within 3 years from starting them!

am I being silly here? Or do you think this is pretty ridiculous and that she should be much further along?

 

[Honey08]

I think its quite normal nowadays. I know a few people who have equine degrees yet haven't got past their stage 1.

 

[Patterdale]

Well it's absolutely impossible to say without knowing her, and would be impolite to speculate.

 

[4faults]

Depends on the college. I did my ND which was a 2 year course that did not include BHS stages, you had to do these and pay for them off your own initiative. Which is why I only did my 1 and my r&r

 

[windand rain]

Having met a few equine degree students/graduates that couldnt ride one side of a sedate but well schooled highland pony I guess nothing much surprises me anymore

 

[twiggy2]

you pay extra to do bhs exams at the college my daughter is at, you can have the college qualifications and not bhs

 

[Moomin1]

Doesn't really matter - they are mostly pointless qualifications anyway!

A qualification is not a patch on experience.

 

[babymare]

At Aa young age i moved from lancs to surrey as working pupil in a large livery/hunting/competition yard. Was there 2 years.I was taught so so much and passed my exams. Hard work. Long days for £6.50 a week. But 34 years on the principles of good horse management are still there. The hands on experience rugging/bandaging/feeding and horse care can not be taught in a classroom. I can still hear mrs Howes voice in my ear tellingme how to do things happy days

 

[zaminda]

I recently came across someone who had been at a dorset college doing her level 2. She didn't even last 2 weeks on the yard. Her horse handling skills were laughable, her mucking out was dreadful, and slow, and she couldn't even hang a haynet properly. However, she had not been offered a place on their level 3 course, which leads me to believe they didn't think much of her. She hadn't done stages either, and only rode once a week as part of the course. She also said you had to pay for the stages separately.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

Mmmm, it would be very unfair to speculate here re. either (1) the individual student and/or (2) the college.

However........ I am not sure that this can be levelled as being the sole "failing" of the college TBH; coz surely if the student IS so far behind, then surely there is a little responsibility on her part, I would suggest? - to do something on her own behalf to address her own failings??? i.e. private or outside tuition, or something???

 

[The Fuzzy Furry]

At Aa young age i moved from lancs to surrey as working pupil in a large livery/hunting/competition yard. Was there 2 years.I was taught so so much and passed my exams. Hard work. Long days for £6.50 a week. But 34 years on I can still hear mrs Howes voice in my ear tellingme how to do things happy days

Not Betty? If so, she is well remembered by me

 

[TandD]

Mmmm, it would be very unfair to speculate here re. either (1) the individual student and/or (2) the college.

However........ I am not sure that this can be levelled as being the sole "failing" of the college TBH; coz surely if the student IS so far behind, then surely there is a little responsibility on her part, I would suggest? - to do something on her own behalf to address her own failings??? i.e. private or outside tuition, or something???

She does have outside tuition with someone who works with the kings troop and teaches top under 25's show jumping..... So it's not like she doesn't get good training etc!
I think I am more shocked that it has taken 3 years for the college to enter her into stage 1 riding....because there isn't much in it is there? Showing a stable position in walk trot canter, with/without stirrups, and jumping position over poles. Does it really take 3 years to learn this with twice weekly lessons? If so.....does that mean college lessons are poor?

 

[Queenbee]

Doesn't really matter - they are mostly pointless qualifications anyway!

A qualification is not a patch on experience.

Whilst I completely agree with this and have experienced that there are many free thinking and 'bright' individuals that choose a rider or instructor on experience, achievements and word of mouth over those who chose on qualifications alone, there are still those who are more comforted by qualifications sadly

 

[sam_]

Personally i think i going to collage in the first place to do anything equine is a waste of time!! I worked on yards to get through my stages and had my stage 3 and did it in 2 years, when you had people that had been to collage they were useless as had no real experience in working on a proper yard full time rather than a weekend every month or whatever it was!!

Sorry for rant but it annoyed me alot back then!! Might have changed now though!

 

[ridefast]

It was never compulsory when I was at college for us to take the BHS stages, and if we did we had to pay for them ourselves, so maybe it's taken her 3 years to save the money? I never took any stages, and as a result I have job offers from 3 yards

 

[Exploding Chestnuts]

Personally i think i going to collage in the first place to do anything equine is a waste of time!! I worked on yards to get through my stages and had my stage 3 and did it in 2 years, when you had people that had been to collage they were useless as had no real experience in working on a proper yard full time rather than a weekend every month or whatever it was!!

Sorry for rant but it annoyed me alot back then!! Might have changed now though!

I really don't know why it should annoy you, and it obviously still does, unless you are an employer what difference does it make to you?
Thing is, not everyone wants to work in a yard.

 

[TheSylv007]

what course is she actually doing? Equine science courses tend to be academic based (I speak from experience) rather than anything to do with stable management or riding - we didn't see any live horses for two years as we were in the labs!

 

[Exploding Chestnuts]

Whilst I completely agree with this and have experienced that there are many free thinking and 'bright' individuals that choose a rider or instructor on experience, achievements and word of mouth over those who chose on qualifications alone, there are still those who are more comforted by qualifications sadly

Insurance companies insist on qualifications to run almost any horse business where the public are involved. I know several BHSAI [lapsed] who don't know how to ride a strange horse, or instruct people in schooling.
I have been instructed [no cash involved] by one girl who happened to be a natural instructor as well as very experienced, she had no qualifications at all, but was excellent.
I saw one "instructor" at the local RS [BHS approved] who asked to be taught how to lunge, a few weeks later she was "instructing" on lunging! Thank goodness the ponies were all RS plods. She is running a yard now, about 2 horses to the acre!

 

[Exploding Chestnuts]

does that mean college lessons are poor?

Its not impossible, the local college used to use a defunct RS near here, the horses were begged and borrowed, the arena was hock deep in mud, it all ended when one poor horse charged through the gate [4 foot high], the gate had to be replaced! Horse was ok.

 

[sam_]

I really don't know why it should annoy you, and it obviously still does, unless you are an employer what difference does it make to you?
Thing is, not everyone wants to work in a yard.

It annoyed me because i was working with people that wouldn't pull there weight around the yard yet would go about there NVQ'S or whatever other qualifications they were at college for 3 years doing, if you can't do the job properly it doesn't really matter what qualification you have when it comes to horses in my opinion! So just because i am not employing them i have to try and work alongside them, i think is worse!

This is my opinion obviously other people will disagree with it and have there on opinion on the matter

 

[Spottyappy]

My daughter is currently in her second year of the extended higher diploma in equine studies,which sounds like the one the OP means. The person the OP is referring to,would have not achieved sufficient qualifications at GCSE to go straight to level 3 ( which requires GCSE at grade c and above in English, maths and Science plus at least two others) so would have had to take level two in order to access level 3.
The course, I agree is largely a waste of time. My daughter took it as she didn't want to do A levels, nor start work, and I refused to let her just "doss" about. At her college, and I would assume others, the. BHS stages are part of the course, and the college pays for students to sit them once. If they fail, then the cost is down to the student to resit.
The tutors seen to just put the students Infront of a white board, monologue off that, and tell students to do own research.
The practical side is basic, although anyone who has taken the BHS stage exams, will know it does go into more depth for stage 2.
There is a lot of hours, 200 I believe which have to be completed practically, as in work experience. This, I also agree is not many In the scheme of the real world, but does my daughters head in,as we have our own yard and she is light years ahead of many of the students,a high proportion of whom either do not own horses, or have them in full livery so are not involved in the daily care,and therefore do not have many practical skills.
Maybe the OP is unaware if the person she is talking of, has taken the stage 1 and failed, In Which case the college won't pay for them to resit, so they will not progress beyond that unless they self fund.
Hope that makes sense!

 

[maisie06]

She does have outside tuition with someone who works with the kings troop and teaches top under 25's show jumping..... So it's not like she doesn't get good training etc!
I think I am more shocked that it has taken 3 years for the college to enter her into stage 1 riding....because there isn't much in it is there? Showing a stable position in walk trot canter, with/without stirrups, and jumping position over poles. Does it really take 3 years to learn this with twice weekly lessons? If so.....does that mean college lessons are poor?

I couldn't do the riding phase at all, after 20 years of riding I cannot canter, nor jump.....yet I could easily pass the theory at college as well as stable management, I just cannot ride. I have had many instructors over the years but they cannot work miracles, I just hven't got the feel for riding, nor the balance, I have given up now other than the odd hack in walk with a little trot. So maybe not all the fault of the college??

 

[LaMooch]

Not read all posts but when I was at an Equine college we had to complete 1 stage per year but also be working at the stage above what we had. I had completed stage 1 in first year and working stage 2 and in 2nd year completed stage 2 working to stage 3. My riding instructor said if I was not working to stage 2 at end year 1 she would not let me in for the 2nd year.

 

[FireFly29]

I went to equine college and, as others have already said, BHS stages were extra so I didn't do them.
It depends what your end goal is.

 

[TandD]

Not read all posts but when I was at an Equine college we had to complete 1 stage per year but also be working at the stage above what we had. I had completed stage 1 in first year and working stage 2 and in 2nd year completed stage 2 working to stage 3. My riding instructor said if I was not working to stage 2 at end year 1 she would not let me in for the 2nd year.

This is similar to what I thought may happen in college - that they would put you through one stage a year - but obviously not! Thank you for your replies everyone..... I've learnt a little more about the college equestrian career direction tonight!

 

[LaMooch]

Also add my college paid for one BHS exam a year. Any extra you paid for yourself. This was 9/10 years ago

 

[confirmedponyaddict]

I am currently in my second year of the level 3 extended diploma in horse management and I have only just got around to booking my rrs and stage 2 because the college is horrendously disorganised to the exrent that I had to practically stalk one of my tutors just to find out when the exam was being held.
I was akso recently told at a job interview that the employer had considered throwing my CV away because she saw the words "college student", so I don't think thd industry has much time for the qualification I just spent 2 years working towards...

 

[LaMooch]

I was akso recently told at a job interview that the employer had considered throwing my CV away because she saw the words "college student", so I don't think thd industry has much time for the qualification I just spent 2 years working towards...

I agree with this last statement. I wish I did a apprenticeship/work base learning. I found in the really world I was too lecture based then practical. If anyone asked me now college or apprenticeship/work base learning I would advise the latter big style

 

[charlie76]

Glad this has been bought up. I had a college student on work experience for two weeks, she was the same age and has been with horses longer than my full time apprentice . my apprentice left her for dust! She struggled with the work load ( and I was easy on her) and the standard they are taught at college isn't good enough. She was a lovely girl but the college system is letting people down, they simply aren't trained to cope and work at industry standard.
I am the wrong side of 35 and I mucked out nine inc forking into ,luck trailer, doing hay and water in the time it took her to do one. How is that preparing them for the real world?
Riding wise she wasn't bad but had her toes firmly out so her leg was on all the time meaning anything she rode got hotter and fastest, when I explained this and changed her position the horses instantly went better, she said no one had taught her this before.
My 17 yr old apprentice on the other hand flew through her Level two horse care and riding, is now on level three and passed her stage one complete with distinction in both sections. She is so practical and matured in her work she could easily be left in charge and be able to run the yard and work horses to a decent standard. The colleges are letting people down IMO

 

[LaMooch]

Glad this has been bought up. I had a college student on work experience for two weeks, she was the same age and has been with horses longer than my full time apprentice . my apprentice left her for dust! She struggled with the work load ( and I was easy on her) and the standard they are taught at college isn't good enough. She was a lovely girl but the college system is letting people down, they simply aren't trained to cope and work at industry standard.
I am the wrong side of 35 and I mucked out nine inc forking into ,luck trailer, doing hay and water in the time it took her to do one. How is that preparing them for the real world?
Riding wise she wasn't bad but had her toes firmly out so her leg was on all the time meaning anything she rode got hotter and fastest, when I explained this and changed her position the horses instantly went better, she said no one had taught her this before.
My 17 yr old apprentice on the other hand flew through her Level two horse care and riding, is now on level three and passed her stage one complete with distinction in both sections. She is so practical and matured in her work she could easily be left in charge and be able to run the yard and work horses to a decent standard. The colleges are letting people down IMO

Fully agree with this and I don't mention college on my CV anymore as now I have experience under my belt that speaks volume and makes me qualifications through college not worth the paper it was written on