Excessively Strong!

[Lyd]

I have got a little horse 15.2hh who is an absolute delight in everything we do except.....hunting! We can hack out in large groups(8+) and he gets quite strong but out hunting last season he was hellish!!
What he does- sticks his head on the floor and goes, doing some sort of swimming arrangement with his front legs over his head- he is impossible to stop until he gets to the front. He barges at gates and is generally a complete swine- i tried last season twice(first in a gag on second ring, second in a pelham)
Im really not looking forward to this year and my new yard seem very keen for me to join them!
PLEASE HELP!
xxx

 

[connie1288]

I would be thinking a Cheltenham gag, various different mouth pieces available!!

 

[scotlass]

I have a previously driven strong bull of a fjord, who I ride in a tom thumb dr bristol. I got mine from Townfields Saddlers. The only other thing that springs to mind is to try something with a waterford or roller mouthpiece. When he gets his head on the floor, is he grabbing the bit?

 

[spacefaer]

I would agree with marymoo re Cheltenham gag but would add

a waterford mouthpiece so he can't grab hold and lean on it.

an overcheck so you can grab and pull when necessary

also, I have one of mine on magic - he's the same horse, doesn't make him flat, but it does take away the desire to be silly

 

[Lyd]

He does lean and take a hold- normally i ride in a Hanging cheek frenchlink with flash to jump/hack in company...but tried a grackle when we went hunting but that didnt seem to have much effect.
cheltenham gag sounds like a plan- was thinking waterford myself but didnt know what sort to go for. I REALLY dont want to ruin his mouth just need to settle his head!!
sorry to sound really dense but what is an over check?
xx

 

[spacefaer]

The overcheck gag is a very tiny and neat bit popular with driving horses, and has holes in the loose ring cheeks to accept a very fine gag cheek. The gag cheek is a type of extended cheek piece that passes through the holes in the gag bit, with a ring at the base for the reins to fasten to, as opposed to the cheek pieces attaching directly to the bit ring as usual. Gags work by raising the bit up in the horses mouth, as well as poll pressure. The effect is usually to lift the horses head up in most cases. The overcheck gag is a strong bit designed to be used as a secondary bit, and need to be used with care as there is no limit to the amount the thin mouthpiece can be raised in the mouth.

 

[Mike007]

I,m afraid this has less to do with bits and a lot more to do with discipline, Your horse has to learn to stand and wait until you tell him to go. Dont just follow the crowd ,make him stand,even while horses are going past him.Dont follow other horses ,go your own pace.My old ex racehorse(bless him,long gone now) would stand while the entire field galloped past, without me having to even take up a contact A) because I told him to ,and B) because he knew they were generally going the wrong way! :smirk:

 

[kerilli]

Lyd, i wouldn't take a horse out hunting which did that, sorry. lots of practise in big groups, making sure he is absolutely listening to you. i'd put in his mouth whatever i needed to shock/impress him enough to stop, as for "i REALLY don't want to ruin his mouth" i think you might have to give a couple of sharp lessons to get him to listen. a few sharp yanks in a strong bit won't ruin his mouth, you having to haul repeatedly in a milder one might well.
fwiw a friend was out hunting and a guy on an out-of-control puller kept running into the back of everyone to stop. eventually friend's horse got sick of it and lashed out and broke the other horse's leg. you can imagine the rest. friend felt awful, but everyone else told her that it was going to happen at some point, just a shame her horse had to do it.
so, that's why i wouldn't take such a disobedient horse hunting - for the sake of the horse, everyone else, and myself.

 

[Lyd]

Agree about the sharp lessons thing im not against that at all but im looking for the most effective method to get the desired effect.
xx

 

[Grey_Eventer]

my horse is exactly like this...well was. he was appauling. to the state where my friends were schocked i stuck with it!
but i did... polo gag in, drop nose band on. double reins and it worked wanders. although hes still strong... i can cope.
definitley try some different bits as once its cracked its great!
he still goes and goes all day, but i can stop when everyone else stops..and he jumps everything and anything :grin:

 

[JenHunt]

Ron would like to be like that, but I put a double bridle in for hunting and he's an angel. He goes when he's told and stops when he's told. And apart from right at the start of the season I hardly ever have to use the bottom rein.

 

[kerilli]

if you really need brakes, the strongest bit i've found is the cosquocero pelham. for sj and xc it turned my v strong mare, which nothing else worked on, into the model of politeness. i have one you can try if you want, 5", mare's resting now so it's adorning the tackroom wall.

 

[marmalade76]

What does this look like? Have googled it but nothing comes up other than mentions on here.

 

[kerilli]

What does this look like? Have googled it but nothing comes up other than mentions on here.

like this: http://www.bitworld.co.uk/popup_image.php?pID=2216
available here:
http://www.bitworld.co.uk/product_info.php?products_id=2216

 

[marmalade76]

Thanks.

 

[Lyd]

wow- that looks like it might work! my friend looks after her friends hunt horses and has said shes going to have a raid of their bit box- if i dont find anythin like this i may very well take u up on your offer
thanks
xx

 

[Lyd]

as in a cheltenham gag?
thanks for being supportive of my cause! ha ha!
xx

 

[kerilli]

it stops them locking their tongue up and back, and holding their breath, i was told. it gets a lot of respect, and sometimes you need that imho.

 

[Lyd]

oh cool thanks!
hav got a fun ride comin up- will see how he goes- hopefully he should have grown up since last yr!!!
if not i may take you up on your offer
thanks
xx

 

[molehill]

Mine does exactly the same!!
I have him now in an american gag and kineton noseband,and can just about hold him in that.
I dont think its just about manners and disapline as my horse will stand and not try and tank off until im cantering on.