Exercise intolerance-head on the floor!

[cheekychico]

My 19 year old cob is usually sharp as a button and keen to go forward. He was diagnosed with COPD 7 years ago and now lives out, has steamed hay and basically has all his needs served. At the time of the diagnosis I was a bit sceptical as whilst he coughed, there was no mucus, heave line, hard breathing etc that you would normally associate with this condition. Over the last few weeks however, he has lost a bit of his 'va va voom' and has started to resist going into trot by pulling down hard on the bit as if trying to dislodge something stuck in his throat. This can occur immediately or 50-100 m on in trot- again no laboured breathing or other signs of distress. He always coughs once on the way out on a hack but that's it, and he does make a grumbling sound as a pre-curser to snorting- but he's done that since he was four. The vet has put him back on ventipulmin to see whether this eases it. I was just wondering, having done extensive web searches and not found anything enlightening, whether anyone else has a horse with a similar problem and if so, any tips for making him better?

 

[flintfootfilly]

I don't understand what you mean by him leaning on the bit as though he's trying to clear his throat? Could you describe it a different way for me, please?

I'm not sure whether you mean he's coughing and/or wretching as he does that, or whether he's literally just leaning hard on the reins and putting his head low?

THanks

Sarah

 

[cheekychico]

Hi- he literally pulls hard and down and so his nose is almost touching the floor- he also returns to walk at this stage if he has actually got into trot in the first place. Then he will walk a few paces, not making any noise or sounds of distress but with his nose on the floor before slowly raising his head- if I ask him for trot then he will try, but then his head will go down again. He doesnt cough or breath hard....
He is not a horse that evades work so I dont think its him being lazy or 'clever'- clearly there is something that is stopping him going forward

In anticipation of your advice???

 

[popularfurball]

I would personally be having back/tack/feet checked as a first point of call - cops ime Results in altered breathing (coughing or wheezing etc). So I would be checking other things first if I'm honest could be way out but better safe than sorry

 

[flintfootfilly]

Thanks. Just wanted to be sure whether the head lowering/leaning also involved any signs of coughing or discomfort breathing. So it seems it doesn't.

And in which case, I'd definitely check teeth, back and saddle. And I'd start with seeing what he's like if you lunge him with and without a saddle and rider, because you may pin it down a little more that way.

Some of the others on here may know that I'm trying to get to the bottom of an ongoing problem with my gang at the moment, and so you know how it is when one or two particular conditions are on your mind. You kind of see them everywhere, whereas a few weeks ago I'd not have even thought of it.

So, this is a longshot but might be worth looking into muscle problems like EPSM and/or selenium deficiency. Selenium deficiency is top of my list of things at the moment with my gang, but as yet I have no proof.

I would say your boy is definitely trying to take weight off his hind end by leaning on the bit and lowering his head. So whatever is going on, I'd think it would be back end. Now of course there are loads of things that can go wrong with the back end, but if there's no particular lameness on any one leg, then it's definitely worth thinking of something more widespread/systemic.

There are plenty of posts on here about EPSM. There aren't so many about selenium, but there are some (usually with me posting on them somewhere or other! ).

With my gang, now I've had a close look at their forage analysis (3 lots of hay/haylage over the last 2 years), all are providing less than the 1.0mg/kg selenium recommended as daily intake by NRC. My guys are on restricted hay, and that brings them down to 0.34mg/kg diet per day, so only a third of what they should be having. I have usually felt a token amount of a good feed balancer, but even with that I now realise it only brings them up to two thirds of the required amount of selenium a day.

So if by any chance any of this rings true with you, I'd up a good balancer to the full ration for your cob's weight, and also have a full grass/hay analysis done to include selenium (Forageplus will do that, and also interpret the results for you, which is well worthwhile because the standard reports tend to come back with "low", "average" or "high" which actually mean nothing in respect of whether enough is being provided for the individual animal. So someone needs to compare the actual figures with NRC guidelines. Then that will give you an idea whether you need to supplement more.)

Of course it may be nothing like that, but it just sounds familiar. My guys have started off with a reluctance to do faster work, and then it escalates to not wanting to trot, and then the number of times they grind to a halt increases.

But worth keeping an open mind to all sorts of possibilities, and definitely worth keeping a diary of how he is each day, because patterns can really help get to the bottom of things.

Sarah

 

[Box_Of_Frogs]

Pulling forward on the reins to get head as low as possible is a recognised sign of exercise intolerance IF it's accompanied by other symptoms of COPD/RAO. The dropping of the head is usually immediately followed by several hoarse, barking coughs. This happens because, with exercise, the horse obviously needs more oxygen in his body and COPD/RAO horses struggle to get it. I'd be very suspicious since your horse has already been diagnosed with COPD. The absence of the hacking cough after he drops his head may be a quirk with your horse or it may come a few weeks down the road as the exercise demand increases. You do need to keep COPD/RAO horses fit and at a correct weight so that they are better able to deal with the disease but clearly, if your horse can't get enough oxygen into his lungs then you need to be careful with exercise or you could have an even bigger problem on your hands.

I'd start by doing a breath-counting test. Chilled and lazing in a stable or a favourite corner of the field, half asleep, a horse should take 8 to 12 breaths per minute. Watch his flanks for 1 breath in and 1 breath out - that = 1 breath. You can time for 30 seconds and double it if that's easier. Then exercise your horse and see what his breaths per minute go up to and how quickly he returns to his resting rate. My severely pollen RAO veteran has a resting breaths per minute rate of 45 and if he's just a little bit stressed, it shoots up to 65+ and I have to stop counting because it's so scary. He can't be sedated because that slows breathing down and he'd probably stop altogether.

 

[cheekychico]

Many thanks for your detailed and thought-provoking responses! I would never had thought it be related to back or hind but he was lame with hock issues five years ago so maybe there is some link. He's defintely not lame to the untrained eye and when I lunged him yesterday he was very forward going and yet still had his head on the floor whilst trotting round showing no signs of wanting to stop. He shares his field with an old dear so he doesnt get much chance to play, but when he does he can certainly move with his back rounded and prancing all over the place.

So my homework is to look at teeth, back and feet- of any of these I reckon the hocks (Spavin) may be affecting the back and I'll look at EPSM and selenium- he is on Top Spec All in One but need to check its contents to see levels of whats in it. I have checked his breathing and it is slow - so I think I can elimate that aspect

My dilemma is to keep him going whilst not making it worse as he is already over-weight through me cutting down on his exercise...

So thanks again for your input...if only horses could talk!

cheers

 

[popularfurball]

How does he respond to free schoing? Whilst he still has to balance himself roud corners, it is just him and not a lunge line or rider?