SecretSquirrell379
Well-Known Member
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6931639.stm
I saw this on the news last night but it was unconfirmed then, what a flipping cock up to say the least
F&M OMG The Scource is Found
- Thread starter SecretSquirrell379
- Start date
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6931639.stm
I saw this on the news last night but it was unconfirmed then, what a flipping cock up to say the least
casey2312
Well-Known Member
Oh be-jesus, someone is in the sh!t.
SecretSquirrell379
Well-Known Member
What worries me is F & M is a horrendous, terrible disease, what else could 'leak' out
pottamus
Well-Known Member
This sort of thing really should not happen at all, it is terrible and I hope and pray for livestock owners that it does not spread. I dispair that 2 farms have now had to destry animals (one as a precaution)...it is dreadful to think how anyone could cope with doing that to their life times work. Very sad indeed.
Patches
Well-Known Member
What worries me about this news is that I can't see how only one farm 3 miles away from the lab at Pirbright can have been exposed and infected with foot and mouth, can you?
How does one farm get plucked cruelly at random? I have no doubt that there must/will be other cases.
As a farmer's wife, I can't tell you how angry all the local farmers to me are about this latest news. We've had several discussions about it via phone or in person at a show yesterday (before it was confirmed as the lab being the most likely source of the infection). Lord knows how local farmers in Surrey are reacting to this latest development.
UK agriculture already suffers continual negative press. Not so long ago the papers were even declaring British milk as being dangerous as it contained antibiotics for instance. Utter tosh! Milk is tested daily to make sure no farmer accidentally lets a tainted supply of milk into a bulk tank. Just one cow's tainted milk let into a tank of 3000 litres is easily detectable, such is the sensitivity of the tests that are carried out. These tests also check our cell count for bacteria, water content, butterfat etc.
To think a laboratory could have put the whole of UK farming and other ancillary businesses as well as tourism at risk is mind boggling. The biosecurity at these places is supposed to be mammoth. I can't get my head around how they can have had a leak and not known about it.
Scary isn't it? UK Agriculture is quick to be blamed for bringing about it's own downfall, when in fact the poor farmer who's just lost his entire herd could be guilty of nothing more than being at an unfortunate geographical location.
How does one farm get plucked cruelly at random? I have no doubt that there must/will be other cases.
As a farmer's wife, I can't tell you how angry all the local farmers to me are about this latest news. We've had several discussions about it via phone or in person at a show yesterday (before it was confirmed as the lab being the most likely source of the infection). Lord knows how local farmers in Surrey are reacting to this latest development.
UK agriculture already suffers continual negative press. Not so long ago the papers were even declaring British milk as being dangerous as it contained antibiotics for instance. Utter tosh! Milk is tested daily to make sure no farmer accidentally lets a tainted supply of milk into a bulk tank. Just one cow's tainted milk let into a tank of 3000 litres is easily detectable, such is the sensitivity of the tests that are carried out. These tests also check our cell count for bacteria, water content, butterfat etc.
To think a laboratory could have put the whole of UK farming and other ancillary businesses as well as tourism at risk is mind boggling. The biosecurity at these places is supposed to be mammoth. I can't get my head around how they can have had a leak and not known about it.
Scary isn't it? UK Agriculture is quick to be blamed for bringing about it's own downfall, when in fact the poor farmer who's just lost his entire herd could be guilty of nothing more than being at an unfortunate geographical location.
MillionDollar
Well-Known Member
It makes me so angry, especially being a farmer BUT TBH it doesn't surprise me (thats bad isn't it?!).
I know for a fact that the last outbreak was released by the government. There is so much evidence. Companies selling sleepers and coal were phoned months before the 2001 outbreak and asked if they could provide huge quantities. When they replied the phone was hung up. I also have a very good source that a test tube of FMD went "missing" a week before
The government (or this one) does not want farmers. It doesn't want us producing food but just wants us to keep the countryside looking pretty.
Well thats my opinion of it (and many, many of the farmers around here).
I know for a fact that the last outbreak was released by the government. There is so much evidence. Companies selling sleepers and coal were phoned months before the 2001 outbreak and asked if they could provide huge quantities. When they replied the phone was hung up. I also have a very good source that a test tube of FMD went "missing" a week before
The government (or this one) does not want farmers. It doesn't want us producing food but just wants us to keep the countryside looking pretty.
Well thats my opinion of it (and many, many of the farmers around here).
dozzie
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
What worries me about this news is that I can't see how only one farm 3 miles away from the lab at Pirbright can have been exposed and infected with foot and mouth, can you?
[/ QUOTE ]
No I cant either. Unless they are the only livestock farm within the three miles.
But lets hope this is where it has come from and it doesnt spread further.
What worries me about this news is that I can't see how only one farm 3 miles away from the lab at Pirbright can have been exposed and infected with foot and mouth, can you?
[/ QUOTE ]
No I cant either. Unless they are the only livestock farm within the three miles.
But lets hope this is where it has come from and it doesnt spread further.
vivhewe
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Companies selling sleepers and coal were phoned months before the 2001 outbreak and asked if they could provide huge quantities.
[/ QUOTE ]
I've said that before too
(Think I might've said it on here too but not sure)
Companies selling sleepers and coal were phoned months before the 2001 outbreak and asked if they could provide huge quantities.
[/ QUOTE ]
I've said that before too
Patches
Well-Known Member
Quite.
The containment of the outbreak could only be hoped for if none of the farms within the protection zone around Pirbright have moved any stock on/off within the last few weeks.
That would be such a lucky coincidence if that were the case.
The containment of the outbreak could only be hoped for if none of the farms within the protection zone around Pirbright have moved any stock on/off within the last few weeks.
That would be such a lucky coincidence if that were the case.
Patches
Well-Known Member
Yup agree with you both.
That missing "vile" was never found was it? At least this time Defra have been quick to step up the mark and implicate Pirbright. There seems to be no cover up this time.
That missing "vile" was never found was it? At least this time Defra have been quick to step up the mark and implicate Pirbright. There seems to be no cover up this time.
vivhewe
Well-Known Member
No cover up but funny how they blame Merial (I'm sure they make wormers too) and not their own research institute
Patches
Well-Known Member
You wouldn't expect anything else though would you?
vivhewe
Well-Known Member
Right, if anyone had any doubts about my stupidity this will probably confirm them, but...
Surely vaccines such as for TB in humans they contain a small amount of the disease which your body then becomes immune to. If this is the case and they ARE producing F&M vaccines at Pirbright, wouldn't it make more sense to vaccinate clean ruminants now so they can't get it? (Obviously the reliability of anything from Pirbright might mean it does more harm than good but in theory could that work?)
I don't know how long vaccines would take to work. I also don't know why they are making F&M vaccines unless they are expecting future outbreaks in the UK
Surely vaccines such as for TB in humans they contain a small amount of the disease which your body then becomes immune to. If this is the case and they ARE producing F&M vaccines at Pirbright, wouldn't it make more sense to vaccinate clean ruminants now so they can't get it? (Obviously the reliability of anything from Pirbright might mean it does more harm than good but in theory could that work?)
I don't know how long vaccines would take to work. I also don't know why they are making F&M vaccines unless they are expecting future outbreaks in the UK
Patches
Well-Known Member
They won't keep the stock even if they do vaccinate them though.
I'm pretty sure it was said that you can't consume meat or dairy products of vaccinated stock or export their products. Therefore, they are still culled at some point anyway as there's no market for them.
Correct me if I'm wrong (as I often am wrong) but I think the purpose of a FMD vaccine is to create a "ring break" of animals around exclusion or surveillance zones that can't get the disease, protecting animals from outside of that zone.
I'm pretty sure it was said that you can't consume meat or dairy products of vaccinated stock or export their products. Therefore, they are still culled at some point anyway as there's no market for them.
Correct me if I'm wrong (as I often am wrong) but I think the purpose of a FMD vaccine is to create a "ring break" of animals around exclusion or surveillance zones that can't get the disease, protecting animals from outside of that zone.
1985
Well-Known Member
Hmph, no wonder the government were so quick to react.. lessons learned or quick cover up lol?
zigzag
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
They won't keep the stock even if they do vaccinate them though.
I'm pretty sure it was said that you can't consume meat or dairy products of vaccinated stock or export their products. Therefore, they are still culled at some point anyway as there's no market for them.
Correct me if I'm wrong (as I often am wrong) but I think the purpose of a FMD vaccine is to create a "ring break" of animals around exclusion or surveillance zones that can't get the disease, protecting animals from outside of that zone.
[/ QUOTE ]
That is what was said on the news last night so you are not worng
They won't keep the stock even if they do vaccinate them though.
I'm pretty sure it was said that you can't consume meat or dairy products of vaccinated stock or export their products. Therefore, they are still culled at some point anyway as there's no market for them.
Correct me if I'm wrong (as I often am wrong) but I think the purpose of a FMD vaccine is to create a "ring break" of animals around exclusion or surveillance zones that can't get the disease, protecting animals from outside of that zone.
[/ QUOTE ]
That is what was said on the news last night so you are not worng
vivhewe
Well-Known Member
Ah lol! And here's me thinking I had had a good idea for a change
dozzie
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
That missing "vile" was never found was it?
[/ QUOTE ]
That occurred to me too.
That missing "vile" was never found was it?
[/ QUOTE ]
That occurred to me too.
chestnut cob
Well-Known Member
From what I can gather, the fault lies with the company manufacturing the vaccine. In order to manufacture the vaccine, the company will hold some stocks of the live virus. According to the news the company have been criticised before for not being stringent enough and not having enough "quality trained staff".
I'll probably get shot down for this but I am entitled to my opinion....trying to find cover ups and conspiracy theories in every avenue doesn't help anyone and just adds to the the bitterness and confusion.
We should be thinking about those farmers who are affected, not trying to invent cover stories. Taking it at face value the Govt seem to be doing everything in their power to stop this turning into a crisis. Do you also believe in UFOs and that the Govt are really aliens who invaded the earth in 1960?
To the poster who said there was a huge amount of evidence that the Govt planned this...can you provide solid, factual evidence of this? Not just heresay?
I'll probably get shot down for this but I am entitled to my opinion....trying to find cover ups and conspiracy theories in every avenue doesn't help anyone and just adds to the the bitterness and confusion.
We should be thinking about those farmers who are affected, not trying to invent cover stories. Taking it at face value the Govt seem to be doing everything in their power to stop this turning into a crisis. Do you also believe in UFOs and that the Govt are really aliens who invaded the earth in 1960?
To the poster who said there was a huge amount of evidence that the Govt planned this...can you provide solid, factual evidence of this? Not just heresay?
Angua2
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
The government (or this one) does not want farmers. It doesn't want us producing food but just wants us to keep the countryside looking pretty.
[/ QUOTE ]
No they don't, they want to build on it!
and why they saw fit to tinker with FMD is beyound me, they should be spending more time trying to cure it not modifying it.... scientists..... makes me ashamed to be one!
The government (or this one) does not want farmers. It doesn't want us producing food but just wants us to keep the countryside looking pretty.
[/ QUOTE ]
No they don't, they want to build on it!
and why they saw fit to tinker with FMD is beyound me, they should be spending more time trying to cure it not modifying it.... scientists..... makes me ashamed to be one!
Cuffey
Well-Known Member
Heard on TV this am that no stock on or off the affected farm since July 10th but they have killed out a contiguous farm
Personally still have suspicions that 'research' etc caused 2001 not Bobby Waugh he was a bad farmer and useful 'fall' guy
Personally still have suspicions that 'research' etc caused 2001 not Bobby Waugh he was a bad farmer and useful 'fall' guy
chestnut cob
Well-Known Member
I don't know about what happened in 2001, but if there was evidence of missing vials etc my best guess would be that the staff were completely incompetent rather than a deliberate attempt to sabotage British farming.
chestnut cob
Well-Known Member
That's what they are doing....they need to research the virus and study it to be able to cure it! The place the leak has come from is somewhere manufacturing vaccines, not somewhere that they are trying to create some mutant strain of FMD to let loose on the world.
SecretSquirrell379
Well-Known Member
I am really shocked at some of the theory's, I never knew about the missing vial last time
I have recently heard some horrendous cover up stories about the MOD so I really can believe this
Tinkerbee
Well-Known Member
Was camping with a friend whos a vet when she got a call with the news
Gosh, just cant believe it, she was talking about some of her clients whose farming didnt survive the last outrbreak and many still havent recovered...if it spreads again.... *shudders*
very sad news
Gosh, just cant believe it, she was talking about some of her clients whose farming didnt survive the last outrbreak and many still havent recovered...if it spreads again.... *shudders*
very sad news
vivhewe
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Personally still have suspicions that 'research' etc caused 2001 not Bobby Waugh he was a bad farmer and useful 'fall' guy
[/ QUOTE ]
I still think he was dodgy!
Personally still have suspicions that 'research' etc caused 2001 not Bobby Waugh he was a bad farmer and useful 'fall' guy
[/ QUOTE ]
I still think he was dodgy!
pixie
Well-Known Member
I hope they have bloody good insurance. I foresee a farmer owning the lab in the near future...
sunflower
Well-Known Member
Thank you Chestnut Cob. My initial thoughts on hearing the location of the cases were that it could have come form the lab as that is the only place in this country that works on FMD. I had an interview for a PhD there and I can tell you security is very high. They are working on a vaccine, therefore they need a strain of the virus to work on. During the last outbreak the staff there were working the most ridiculous hours in very very cramped conditions as they are the only approved centre in the country for testing for the virus - I really can't believe that anyone working there would have intentionally released this.
Oh - and whoever was talking about vaccines, yes, most do contain the organism you want to vaccinate against but it will be in an attenuated form - this is not foolproof but you do not inject known virulent organisms into people to immunise them.
Oh - and whoever was talking about vaccines, yes, most do contain the organism you want to vaccinate against but it will be in an attenuated form - this is not foolproof but you do not inject known virulent organisms into people to immunise them.
YorksG
Over the hill and far awa
To add to the conspiracy theory, what better way to ceate a market for your vaccines than having an out break of the disease that you create a vaccine for?
Puppy
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Can the Government to sued? If so I hope that every person affected by this sue's their butts off for damages
[/ QUOTE ]
Off the top of my head, I would imagine so - and like yourself I hope they do
However, vague caselaw lurking in the back of my mind makes me think only those <u>directly</u> infected will be able to...
Can the Government to sued? If so I hope that every person affected by this sue's their butts off for damages
[/ QUOTE ]
Off the top of my head, I would imagine so - and like yourself I hope they do