Feeding the correct feed.........are you sure!

Chermar

Chermar

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I am interested to hear people's view on this. Until recently I was convinced I was feeding the correct feed, and had all the logical explanations for doing so!!! That was until I had a really bad day with a loopy mare that was in season. On having a chance conversation with a local feed rep I actually found I was feeding her all wrong. Two weeks on and a compete change of hard feed I have a very settled mare who (so far) no longer gets fizzy, anxious or annoyed about things. I always thought I was doing things right, but that was my ignorance, how many of you actually seek the advice of the experts or just do what they think is right?

I have now decided to get all my horses feed looked at in detail as I can't believe the difference it has made and saved me a fortune on suppliments that I probably would have bought to counter act the feed she was getting. I think none of us take advantage of the free advice and expertise the feed companies offer us, they spend thousands on research and science and yet do we still think we know better?

What's your view?
 
Well my mare, behaves nicely, looks fantastic and is still alive so i'm assuming what i am feeding her currently is doing the trick. :D:D
 
I take advantage of all the advise from the feed companies and from the wonderful knowledge pool in this place too!!

In a way I'm 'lucky??' with my lad because he's sugar intolerant I know the feeds I have available to use and usually they are non-heating to boot. It is a minefield out there for feeding horses as it is with dogs, not many dog owners think to look at the food they are giving to explain some behavioural issues but I certainly do.
 
I had some great nutitional advice from spillers as my boy has been on A+P calm and condition and spillers cool fibre , just to get some topline , and see him through the winter living out , this was recommended by my equine chiropractor as he was lacking in muscle , but he's been a bit spooky and sharp so i got some advce from spillers and have now moved to the conditioning fibre to give him the topline and a balancer for the vits/mins etc , he's more chilled now!
 
Ive had short conversations about feeds but never looked into it properly.
Stupid as you say we have all this knowledgeable people at our finger tips, just waiting to be asked.

paddy irish said:
I had some great nutitional advice from spillers as my boy has been on A+P calm and condition and spillers cool fibre , just to get some topline , and see him through the winter living out , this was recommended by my equine chiropractor as he was lacking in muscle , but he's been a bit spooky and sharp so i got some advce from spillers and have now moved to the conditioning fibre to give him the topline and a balancer for the vits/mins etc , he's more chilled now!
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I too feed my boy calm and condition for top line but still find him spooky and sharp.
May be i should make the call!
 
Whilst advice from feed manufacturers can be useful, it also pays to do your own research and learn more about feeding in general, so you can interpret the advice you are given. For example, you might be told a feed is barley and oat-free and therefore assume there are no cereals in it and it is non-heating, but actually it could contain a fair amount of maize and wheat which might send a sensitive horse a bit nutty! If you are told a feed is 'conditioning' then check the calorie content (expressed in MJDE/kg) to see if it actually contains more or less calories than the product you are feeding already. If you are relying on a feed to supply vitamins and minerals, then check how much a day needs to be fed to fulfill that purpose, etc., etc.
 
Our horses have pretty much all-fibre diets so I think I'm pretty safe there. :)

I think the main problem most people have is that they don't read the back of the bag! All the ingredients/energy levels/protein levels etc are there and you only need a basic level of knowledge to understand how these things will affect your horse.
 
Bear in mind that feed companies are there to market feed and their research is to convince us that we are doing the right thing by following their advice. They don't tell us about the added chemicals in the feed and few will admit tht their feed contains animal product - if your feed bag contains ash then you're feeding incinerated animals as its the cheapest way to get the minerals in there. Nor do they tell you that many horses can do very well without commercial feed and feeding it to some has the same effect as giving E numbers to some children.
 
classicalfan said:
Bear in mind that feed companies are there to market feed and their research is to convince us that we are doing the right thing by following their advice. They don't tell us about the added chemicals in the feed and few will admit tht their feed contains animal product - if your feed bag contains ash then you're feeding incinerated animals as its the cheapest way to get the minerals in there. Nor do they tell you that many horses can do very well without commercial feed and feeding it to some has the same effect as giving E numbers to some children.
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V true!

Take advice from feed companies but don't forget that their job at the end of the day is to sell feed! Do your own reading and check the labeling on the feed - and understand it!

I think alot of horses don't need half the shiny bag feed they get- especially considering that alot are in light work and with such an obesity problem in this country.

Ours are on a fibre diet, with a little microionized linseed for oil. Pasture will be analysed as soon as it has grown a little more so we supplement only the minerals needed - cheaper and better for the horse - everyone's a winner!

Marketed feeds can only be a best guess for the horse so depending on what is in abundance or a lack of in the horses forage affects how well the feed suits - you might well be continuing to supplement minerals that the horse has too much of, without topping up the lacking minerals, without even going into the crap put into the feeds! No horse needs added sugar in its diet, even if you do call it a lami friendly product with low sugar mollased coating!
 
classicalfan said:
if your feed bag contains ash then you're feeding incinerated animals as its the cheapest way to get the minerals in there.
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I'm sorry but that is totally incorrect! The 'ash' percentage stated on the bag purely indicates the inorganic content of the feed - ie ash is what is left of a feed after it has been heated to a very high temperature and all the organic matter has been burned off.
 
TGM said:
I'm sorry but that is totally incorrect! The 'ash' percentage stated on the bag purely indicates the inorganic content of the feed - ie ash is what is left of a feed after it has been heated to a very high temperature and all the organic matter has been burned off.
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I'm glad you put that, it is what I always thought ash was but the previous poster got me worried for a moment there!
 
Not really impressed by feed companies, rang one recently to ask what wad in one of their mixes,they did not have s clue.

They are there to sell feed as expensive as possible after making it as cheaply as possible.

It was the feed and rendering industry that caused BSE but they have never come clean about that.

The feed companies are the reason lots of people have horses out of their heads on sugar because they cover everything in molasses to make it palatable.

Beware of feed company experts (salesmen?).
 
I spoke with a couple of feed companies regarding my finely tuned feed regime alongside my own research. I found them to be very helpful and not at all pushy, one company recommended feed from a different company even!
 
ThePony said:
, without even going into the crap put into the feeds! No horse needs added sugar in its diet, even if you do call it a lami friendly product with low sugar mollased coating!
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:mad: Don't even get me started!!!! It's my soapbox moment when walking round the feed place, I cannot believe they dare state something is low-cal etc and one of the first listed ingredients is molassas!!!!!!

My lad is on fibre based diet has been for the last 3 years and the difference in his coat, temperment and overall being is marked. I'm actually grateful he became sugar intolerant to the degree he did because it forced me to address his diet and stop blindly following the 'norm'.

I've found Allen & Page a very good advise company, they recommend their own brands of course but they've also confirmed the diet I have for my boy is perfect for his work load and situation, which doesn't just involve their products.
 
a and p are good, I wish they did fast fibre without the garlic though! The one product I really want is a hay/straw chaff - NOTHING ELSE!! Can't find it at all, can get molasses free chaff, but I would rather there wasn't so much alfafa in it though. Perhaps good ol' plain and simple doesn't sell feeds?!
 
Chermar said:
I am interested to hear people's view on this. Until recently I was convinced I was feeding the correct feed, and had all the logical explanations for doing so!!! That was until I had a really bad day with a loopy mare that was in season. On having a chance conversation with a local feed rep I actually found I was feeding her all wrong. Two weeks on and a compete change of hard feed I have a very settled mare who (so far) no longer gets fizzy, anxious or annoyed about things. I always thought I was doing things right, but that was my ignorance, how many of you actually seek the advice of the experts or just do what they think is right?

I have now decided to get all my horses feed looked at in detail as I can't believe the difference it has made and saved me a fortune on suppliments that I probably would have bought to counter act the feed she was getting. I think none of us take advantage of the free advice and expertise the feed companies offer us, they spend thousands on research and science and yet do we still think we know better?

What's your view?
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So what were you feeding and what are you feeding now?
 
I start from a basic chaff with supplement and work my way up so no horse is over fed with things it doesn't need.
My TB has a totally fibre based diet - cereals are simply not needed for his energy levels or his condition levels.
I never feed anything cereal based unless i feel absolutley necessary - which is rarely. :)
 
There are companies out there that switch the ingredients about to make the cheapest they can. BUT there are good companies out there that don't and do have the best interests of the horse at heart it's up to everyone to decide which is which!! I've had a positive experience and you know my mare was shiny and healthy before my change but I would have been adding suppliments to her feed as silly season had started. I'm not afraid to say my ignorance cost me money and a little sanity over the last few years, but I now will consult the experts and listen from now on.
 
ThePony said:
a and p are good, I wish they did fast fibre without the garlic though! The one product I really want is a hay/straw chaff - NOTHING ELSE!! Can't find it at all, can get molasses free chaff, but I would rather there wasn't so much alfafa in it though. Perhaps good ol' plain and simple doesn't sell feeds?!
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FF doesn't have garlic in. 'Vitamin A, Vitamin D3, Vitamin E, Copper, Selenium, Vitamin K, Folic Acid, Nicotinic Acid, Pantothenic Acid, Vitamins B1, B2, B6, B12, Biotin, Iodine, Cobalt, Iron, Manganese, Zinc, Calcium and Magnesium'.

Have you tried Simple Systems or Pure Feed Company? I can't get them delivered close enough to me but I know people who've used them and rave about it.
 
doris2008 said:
I start from a basic chaff with supplement and work my way up so no horse is over fed with things it doesn't need.
My TB has a totally fibre based diet - cereals are simply not needed for his energy levels or his condition levels.
I never feed anything cereal based unless i feel absolutley necessary - which is rarely. :)
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^^^^ This.

Mine have hay....smidge of chaff with pink powder.....nothing else. Horses looking good, money in my pocket;)
 
jsr said:
FF doesn't have garlic in. 'Vitamin A, Vitamin D3, Vitamin E, Copper, Selenium, Vitamin K, Folic Acid, Nicotinic Acid, Pantothenic Acid, Vitamins B1, B2, B6, B12, Biotin, Iodine, Cobalt, Iron, Manganese, Zinc, Calcium and Magnesium'.

Have you tried Simple Systems or Pure Feed Company? I can't get them delivered close enough to me but I know people who've used them and rave about it.
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Ah, that is interesting, I'm sure I read that it had garlic in! Have looked at those companies, but all I use is chaff (along with a home concocted supplement!)- I would just like a 'normal' unmolassed one, not a alfafa and straw one. Very basic really!
 
I used to work for a feed company and worked on the advice line. I know there are good and bad examples of everything but I just have to say I doidn't ever feel pressured into being a sales person by the company. The training was excellent and if a problem was too complicated, especially earlier on in my time there, there were some top nutritionists who I coudl hand over to if neccesary. I was always taught to advocate keeping things as simple as possible and often ended up recommending much simpler diets than people were feeding.

Also, obviously a feed company will always recommend thier own products, they would be stupid not to! But, by paying attention to the theory and reason why they recommend the feed they do you shoudl be able to understand the thought process they use to recommend the feed. Also, bear in mind that most of the main feed companies have equivelent products across their ranges so if one of them recommends one thing you may be able to apply it across to another brand if you so wish. Probably best to ring round a few as well and get several opinions and then make your decision.

As for my boy - handful of chaff and a couple of cups of balancer and he's done. :D
 
poppymoo said:
^^^^ This.

Mine have hay....smidge of chaff with pink powder.....nothing else. Horses looking good, money in my pocket;)
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Both or mine have fast fibre, with chaff added (little man will not eat soaked slop!! He likes to bite his food!!) A salt lick and Vitamin supplement.


Job Done!
 
marmalade76 said:
So what were you feeding and what are you feeding now?
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It was Bluegrass Nice & easy Cubes mixed with Alfa A and some linseed oil. I thought I was keeping it simple and that the Alfa was giving plenty of fibre, But those particular cubes have a high starch level so on the advice of the Rep I changed her to Bluegrass Releve which has very low starch levels. It really made a huge difference to her concentration levels she has been in season since and it made no impact on her behaviour. It's been a real success for me I would have been loading her with a calmer as I have done every year!!
 
I've got the TB on Alfa-A w/oil, chaff, and grain as he needs to gain weight. Plus hay, obviously. When he's filled out and is up to weight, the grain will go and he will be on just chaff. The Welsh B mare - who is affectionately known as Porkie - is on air. Bless her, she lives in a starvation paddock and gets very controlled amounts of hay and a wee bit of healthy hoof.

Does anyone have any experience with Winergy feeds?
 
I use A&P feeds approved by vegetarian society so no incinerated animals in it or fish products either.

QUOTE=classicalfan;9511702]Bear in mind that feed companies are there to market feed and their research is to convince us that we are doing the right thing by following their advice. They don't tell us about the added chemicals in the feed and few will admit tht their feed contains animal product - if your feed bag contains ash then you're feeding incinerated animals as its the cheapest way to get the minerals in there. Nor do they tell you that many horses can do very well without commercial feed and feeding it to some has the same effect as giving E numbers to some children.[/QUOTE]
 
Fast Fibre does contain garlic:- Ingredients -

(min 40 percent) cereal straw (treated), (10-25 percent) unmolassed beet, (less than 10 percent) oat fibre, expelled linseed, grass meal, Di-calcium phosphate, calcium carbonate, expelled soya oil, sodium chloride, natural vitamins, vitamins and minerals, mint, herbs garlic.

However I imagine tht the amounts are minimal and I certainly feed it with no issues, and I won't feed a garlic supplement.
 
touchstone said:
Fast Fibre does contain garlic:- Ingredients -

(min 40 percent) cereal straw (treated), (10-25 percent) unmolassed beet, (less than 10 percent) oat fibre, expelled linseed, grass meal, Di-calcium phosphate, calcium carbonate, expelled soya oil, sodium chloride, natural vitamins, vitamins and minerals, mint, herbs garlic.

However I imagine tht the amounts are minimal and I certainly feed it with no issues, and I won't feed a garlic supplement.
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Thank you for posting that, I could have sworn it did, but couldn't find the info anywhere again! My mare has sweetitch so I just won't risk it. Such a shame though as it is a fab feed, good value too!
 
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